My sneaky plan to upgrade our roster

[spikelovetheCelts]

I like the idea of Alexis Ajinca!
Only  "Add a 30 mil / 4 yr for ajinca" is too much for a unproven player.
He's no Whiteside

I think Danny Green is good!
But i think Avery Bradley is getting better each year.
Also Bradley is paid 8 million and Danny Green will probably cost more.

We may have to overpay for a rim protector. I think getting a player like him who can grow will be wise. I am like most here I hope we trade up to get WCS and sign butler, lenoard or Middleton to a big contract.

[mctyson]

First:

No plan to upgrade our roster should involve Evan Turner continuing to be a starter.

Second:

I love Danny Green.  He's probably my ideal not-a-star-shooting guard.  I think 4 years / 44 million would be a fair price for him, given the right situation. 

That said, the Celtics are not that situation.  Green is a substantial upgrade over Bradley, it's true.  But he's a finishing piece at that price, not a starting point.

I like our team with ET a lot. I think he is way better than AB.

Also - how is Danny Green not a good get? If he is a FA we get him for cap without spending picks. He is instantly turbo boosts our offense and defense. Since we are not getting Lebron and most likely now Kawahi, Green becomes one heck of of consolation prize, don't you think?

Also, what do you think about Asik / Ajinca ? They both give us size, rim protection and rebounding on a budget. How is our team + Center + Danny Green not a top 4 team in the East?

Danny Green is a good get, but tying up 11 million a year on a guy who is a finished product and will probably look worse (but still be useful) once he leaves the Spurs does not make sense for a Celtics team that is still trying to put together a foundation for winning.

Green is the type of player you add in free agency when you already have a handful of talented young players and what you need to add is veterans with a couple of elite skills that know how to win.  The Celtics are not there yet.  Don't let this playoff push fool you.



Evan Turner is OK.  His numbers, though, are largely fools gold.  This has been said plenty elsewhere, but it's worth repeating.  Turner is almost entirely an on-ball player.  He is not effective playing off the ball.  He is not a good enough scorer, despite his occasional hot streak from 10-15 feet, to be one of the primary ball-handlers for a good team.  His defense and rebounding are not totally awful due to his size, but they are still not good enough to really make up for his shortcomings offensively.

Turner is a nice enough role player, especially for a team that lacks ball-handlers and shot-creators.  Ideally, though, the Celtics will find ways to upgrade on the wing and add superior two-way players so that Turner's skillset will become wholly redundant.

Oooooooooh celticsblog fans, so difficult to please!!! This team has a better win % since the Jeff Green trade than the entire last season with Pierce, Rondo, + KG. 

But NO! No talent on this team.  We are not there yet.  We are only there when we win the Eastern Conference.

[More Banners]

Bradley is the only starter.  Consistency or some limitation make, in my view, just about everyone else replaceable as starters, or, put another way, AB is the last of the starters to try to upgrade, and the other 4 are each high priorities.

This summers unrestricted FA class isn't too great.  Barring the blockbuster trade, this summer, I would set the sights on signing the single best player we can, and then a max FA in 2016.

This is where I could see IT and ET either coming off the bench or being packaged. All bets are off until at least after the draft, but....

My guess is go hard after either Asik or Dragic. Bring either Zeller or smart off the bench. It would be a definite upgrade, and then save cash for 2016. No big money for Sully.

Next year a shot at the division?

Prob try to keep crowder. Hope next year the scoring punch is there with IT, ET, and Sully able to score, and hopefully one more player able to score, with shooters on the floor. Smart and Zeller each getting better as shooters, and KO having range and increasing confidence. Crowder shooting well.

Something like

[Dragic] Smart/ IT
AB/Smart/ET
ET/Crowder/Wallace
Sully/KO/Wallace
[Asik] Zeller/KO

For continuity, Pressey as 3rd guard, the other rook on the bench, plus two picks.
Who would want a package of picks, either Smart or Bradley, ET or IT, and Zeller or KO?  I'd want some continuity, but the redundancy if ZELLER and KO as backup 5's makes one expendable in trade, Bradley and Smart non-creating guards, and ET and IT as 6th/bench scoring leader.  My preferences to keep: ET, Smart, and Zeller. IT, KO, and Bradley plus pick could make an enticing package. 

[PhoSita]

Oooooooooh celticsblog fans, so difficult to please!!! This team has a better win % since the Jeff Green trade than the entire last season with Pierce, Rondo, + KG. 

But NO! No talent on this team.  We are not there yet.  We are only there when we win the Eastern Conference.

False dichotomy.

The team currently lacks any high end talent.  The Celtics have put together a collection of quality players that fit well under our coach.  Our coach is the only guy on the team who is "elite" for his "position."

The point is that the Celtics should only look to commit large chunks of their cap space if they are adding a core piece, or they already have a core in place and they just need to add one or two quality contributors to complete the supporting cast.

Like I said, I really like Danny Green.  And I'll always be happy to see players like that on the Celtics.  But talking about spending 10+ million a year to add a player like that is jumping at least a couple steps ahead in the process.

Patience.

[chambers]

I like your idea.

I'd much rather pay Green $11 million than Avery's $8 million. Avery's just terrible efficiency wise and replacing his garbage looooong 2  point jumpshots with Green's 3 balls is a great upgrade on offense. Defensively Green is a beast too- but he's got to play the SG spot- he's not strong enough to guard SF's all season.
But Green at $11 million is likely a bargain once the cap goes up. I think you could get away with something like 4 years $36 or 4 years $40 and your SG spot is taken care of for the next championship run and he's got championship experience which is great for guys like Smart and James Young.
Ultimately you have to ask if James Young deserves a shot at becoming the next Danny Green- the physical tools are there, but perhaps the passion on the defensive end is missing.

Rim protector wise Ajinca may be okay off the bench but he's pretty slow but he's arguably a poor man's Roy Hibbert which is great if you can get him cheap.

I don't like ET for our team and never have. Don't get me wrong he's improved this season and been a good foot soldier by changing his game to only shoot 5 feet jumpers and layups which is a big sacrifice for a guy who's used to being the first option.

An efficient team that knocks down threes and hounds defensively?

Smart
Green
Middleton
Sullinger
Hibbert

IT
Crowder
Olynyk
Turner
Draft pick
Draft pick

That right there is the best defensive starting 5 in the NBA if you ask me, they are also arguably the best three point shooting team behind golden state if Marcus Smart can get to 38% or better.
The gambling part is that Smart becomes and offensive threat in the paint and Middleton becomes a 20 point 5 rebound guy in 30-33 mins a game and maintains his 3 point shooting.

[CelticsFanFromNYC]

Oooooooooh celticsblog fans, so difficult to please!!! This team has a better win % since the Jeff Green trade than the entire last season with Pierce, Rondo, + KG. 

But NO! No talent on this team.  We are not there yet.  We are only there when we win the Eastern Conference.

False dichotomy.

The team currently lacks any high end talent.  The Celtics have put together a collection of quality players that fit well under our coach.  Our coach is the only guy on the team who is "elite" for his "position."

The point is that the Celtics should only look to commit large chunks of their cap space if they are adding a core piece, or they already have a core in place and they just need to add one or two quality contributors to complete the supporting cast.

Like I said, I really like Danny Green.  And I'll always be happy to see players like that on the Celtics.  But talking about spending 10+ million a year to add a player like that is jumping at least a couple steps ahead in the process.

Patience.

Im pretty sure Danny Ainge wants his next rebuild to last a life time if not a [dang] good while at championship contention. I would think ell agree with you. To early in the rebuild to throw money like that at a complimentary piece. hes a finish your roster with cherry on top player. Not your key piece.  not enough offensive firepower or dribble penetration threats for him to excel like he does on the spurs


would only make sense if were keeping IT for the long term and were getting rid of Bradley. You need a star point guard  to have Green IMO cant have to non go to guards. In OUR SITUATION, Green us not an upgrade

[Joe Green]

Getting Green + Ajinca would:

A. Make us contenders in the weak East
B. Cost us Zero picks

Given that the cap is about to skyrocket, hording cap is not going to help us much. We would still have a zillion picks to trade for a superstar, and become a much more attractive destination for free agents.

[Joe Green]

Boston currently ranks 25th in 3p% and 28th in Blocks. How much better would we be by adding one of the best 3 point shooters and one of the best shot blockers with giving up ANY real assets?

Wouldn't we become a team where a superstar goes to win a championship? (KD, Cousins etc.) If we won the Atlantic next year and OKC struggles, would they not be open to trading KD rather than risk him walking in 2016?

[greece66]

First:

No plan to upgrade our roster should involve Evan Turner continuing to be a starter.

Second:

I love Danny Green.  He's probably my ideal not-a-star-shooting guard.  I think 4 years / 44 million would be a fair price for him, given the right situation. 

That said, the Celtics are not that situation.  Green is a substantial upgrade over Bradley, it's true.  But he's a finishing piece at that price, not a starting point.

[Rosco917]

You're not going to upgrade every position on the team in a single year. You may have to live with certain short coming in 2015 so you can strengthen other positions. Then look to 2016 to take another step.

I would be happy if we got a solid rim protecter, in the draft or through free agency, and 2/3 combo wing that can contribute on both ends, (Butler) or even a long term PF, if we can't get the wing player we also need.       

[Endless Paradise]

You can't make all of those offers to restricted free agents: the Celtics won't have the cap space. Every offer made to a restricted free agent manifests itself as a cap hold. Since the Celtics won't hold the Bird rights to any of those guys you mentioned, they can't go over the cap to make offers to all of them.

[ddb]

I think it is widely accepted that in order to compete at the next level we need:
A. A long rim protector who can board as well
B. A solid wing who can defend and knock down the 3 ball at a high rate

The problem - teams are going to spend whatever it takes to protect their free agents. Looking at the potential FA targets, it seems two teams present a strong option to "steal" and quality player from.

First our rim protector. The Pelicans have two excellent defensive centers BOTH hitting free agency. Omer Asik and the leser know - Alexis Ajinca

First Omer, one of Danny's long time targets is doing a fine job posting 7 pts, 10 reb and a block at about 26 minutes. He is a FA and would possibly welcome a chance to start on a playoff team.

Second Ajinca. This guy came into the league as a project - a huge (7"2) dude he has improved every year and is now one of the best shot blockers / rim protectors in the league. With only 14 minutes per game, he is posting 6 pts / 5 rebs and a block. He has soft hands shoots over 50% from the field and 80% from the line.

I would make offers to both, and see if the pelicans can match.

Next - wing 3&D. San Antonio is holding a pair of FA aces. First Kawhi Leonard. I will not even waste time telling you this in a superstar wing player and we heard Danny and every other GM in the league will chase him. Assuming he will not leave SA to come to Boston I suggest we look at Danny Green who was nearly the MVP of the previous finals.

One of the nest 3pt shooters in the NBA, Green is posting 42% from behind the arc. That alone would make him one of the most deadly offensive players on our team. He is a competent rebounder and passer (5 rebs 2.5 ast per 36) and a remarkable pickpocket at 2.5 steals per 36 !!! To complete his all around great game, he is blocking 1.5 shots per 36 which would make him the best shot blocker on the Celtics !!!!

His advanced stats are off the charts - a 108 offensive, 98 defensive +10 net make him one of the best 2 way players in the league.

If we throw 44 mil / 4yr to Green - do the Spurs match? Add a 30 mil / 4 yr for ajinca and our lineup will look something like

Smart / IT / Pressy
Green / AB / Smart
ET / Green / Crowder
Sully / KO / Jerebko
Zeller / Ajinca

I an ideal world, we package Sully or KO and a boatload of pick for Cousins (or insteam maybe get Love) and man our PF with a true superstar. But even without them, we would address our two weakest points taking us from borderline playoff team to contenting with Raptors for the 3rd position in next year's Playoffs.

Your thoughts?

I'm not interested in Asik or AJinca.  And Danny Green isn't leaving San Antonio. 

[Evantime34]

On green being an upgrade from AB, he absolutely is but I think the gap looks bigger than what it actually is based on that talent around both players.

Most of Green's shots are created for him, via passing or penetration in the Spurs offense. If you put AB on the Spurs I promise you that his efficiency would improve because he would be shooting open 3's rather than one dribble pull ups of a pick and roll.

Completely agree that Turner needs to go to the bench next year, but that all depends on Smart. Turner has started this year because Smart isn't ready to handle the ball full time. If Smart isn't ready to do so next year, the C's will either need to keep Turner as the starting 3 or bring in another 3 that can run the offense.

I do like Green but with Bradley and Smart currently being best at the 2 I don't think adding another 2 guard makes much sense. Much rather have Middleton (23) at the same or even a greater price than Green (27). But the only way we can upgrade the 3 with more shooting is if Smart is ready to take the reigns next season.

[mef730]

TP to the OP, as it's always nice to be introduced to a player like Ajinca.

I like the idea of Alexis Ajinca!
Only  "Add a 30 mil / 4 yr for ajinca" is too much for a unproven player.
He's no Whiteside

Here's my question, and I don't know the answer.  I agree that 30/4 is a lot for an unproven player.  Can this guy start?  It sounds like he's got some upside from here, but somebody who knows more about him than I will be better at answering this question.  The reason that I ask is that, in the new salary paradigm, $7.5m in 2016 is worth $5.5m today, +/-.  If there's any upside here, might not be a bad bet.

My feeling is that we shouldn't get overly aggressive this off-season with long-term contracts.  The top players are not going to sign for more than a year, and I'd rather have that money available for 2016.  And while that brings us back to the old argument about whether players would sign here (and my feeling is that if you show somebody the green, and I don't mean the uniforms, they'd come), I'd rather save our money for a few A players than sign 2-3 B or B+ players.

Mike

[jaketwice]

First - TP on some good ideas. My biggest question is whether D. Green is a product of an excellent SA system - or whether he is really so good. Look: if you're picking your poison, I'd rather help off of Danny Green than Leonard or Duncan. ...but, I mean, clearly - he has an excellent shooting percentage, and no matter how good your team-mates, you still need to make the shots.

I am not sure those guys are stars, however. So - following your idea through to its conclusion, and assuming we now have SG, PG (M. Smart) and C (Ajinca) locked up - who would you have start at SF and PF?

I do not like Olynyk in that line-up; Turner is too small; JJ is not a starter; and Bass and Sullinger just are not good enough at their positions to make that line-up successful. We'd need two stars - or one all-star game starter and a quality player - to make that rotation work; and both pieces would have to be good shooters (with Ajinca on the floor).

So - mean Joe Green - who fills those roles?