The league lacks superstar talent

[Casperian]

Two campers are walking through the woods when a huge brown bear suddenly appears in the clearing about 50 feet in front of them. The bear sees the campers and begins to head toward them. The first guys drops his backpack, digs out a pair of sneakers, and frantically begins to put them on. The second guy says, "What are you doing? Sneakers won’t help you outrun that bear." "I don't need to outrun the bear," the first guy says. "I just need to outrun you."

[Rosco917]

Kobe had an interesting interview recently, where he stated the European youth are excelling in basketball over the American youth, because they are being taught true basics, and technique, and honest rules.

Rather than flashy moves, and the me me me philosophy. He said these poor basics are attitudes are carrying there way into high school ball, and college.

Now, if you take into account, that most college basketball careers are the "one and done" variety, you can see a problem developing.

[Evantime34]

I think there is certainly a changing of the guard, more than a lack of talent. I think Anthony Davis, Steph Curry, Russell Westbrook, and James Harden all are superstars but don't have the name recognition that the last wave of superstars had.

[D.o.s.]

Kobe had an interesting interview recently, where he stated the European youth are excelling in basketball over the American youth, because they are being taught true basics, and technique, and honest rules.

Rather than flashy moves, and the me me me philosophy. He said these poor basics are attitudes are carrying there way into high school ball, and college.

Now, if you take into account, that most college basketball careers are the "one and done" variety, you can see a problem developing.

Kobe also grew up playing basketball in Europe, so there may be some less-than-objective slant to his statements.

Or should I say:

[D.o.s.]

I also think that the way the playstyle of the NBA has shifted in the last 20 years has discouraged some of that individualistic hero ball type play. Go back and watch some of those games from the late 90's and early '00's. Much more iso, which leads to many more sneakers sold. 

That was a pretty terrible era, IMO.  The game today is much better.

What, you didn't like 20+ possessions of Mark Jackson spending 15 seconds backing a guard down from the 3-pt line to the post and either taking a baby hook or kicking out to Miller if the double came?  Philistine.

Guilty as charged.

[Celtics4ever]

Kobe had an interesting interview recently, where he stated the European youth are excelling in basketball over the American youth, because they are being taught true basics, and technique, and honest rules.

AAU ball is a big part of it, and parents urging kids to shoot every time they touch it.   These things definitely put "me" in team.

In a league, that lacks superstar talent, we are certainly without even a star now.


I think the basketball of the 80s was the best, the quality of the ball was better and top to bottom I think the league was more skilled.   Their are more athletes today but a lot of them cannot play.   However, each generation is marketed by the NBA as bigger and better than the last.   I would put forth that no generation was more skilled from players from 78-88  that includes many hall of famers.   Look at some of the recent drafts and the star potential is simply not there.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

I think there is a bit of East Coast bias seeping in here.

A lot of talent out west.  If they were in NY, Boston, Detroit...it would feel different.

Well, I live out west and I agree with the OP. In my book, there's LeBron in a class by himself, Durant slightly below him and also by himself, then a bunch of guys who are very good but not transcendent, who don't consistently take control of games and teams and seasons and are a commanding presence—this is where I'd put Bosh, Melo, Love, Westbrook, Aldridge, Wade, Paul, Griffin.

Lillard and Curry could go farther, but time will tell.

[greg683x]

I agree in general with your premise. There is another facet to it IMO. That is complete package superstars. Some have the physical talent but not The leadership or work ethic or pure desire. Take Dwight Howard for example. There are a few others.

I think John Wall is close. He might get there with Paul Pierce in his ear. Anthony Davis could be but needs a mentor IMO.

What real superstars have needed teammate mentors?

With all due respect how would know which stars had and hadn't had mentors?  I think theres plenty of evidence that shows the biggest stars in this league have had mentors during their first few years.  Garnett has said Sam Mitchell was a huge influence on him when he came into the league.  Tim Duncan had David Robinson to pass him the torch

[D.o.s.]

Kobe had an interesting interview recently, where he stated the European youth are excelling in basketball over the American youth, because they are being taught true basics, and technique, and honest rules.

AAU ball is a big part of it, and parents urging kids to shoot every time they touch it.   These things definitely put "me" in team.

In a league, that lacks superstar talent, we are certainly without even a star now.


I think the basketball of the 80s was the best, the quality of the ball was better and top to bottom I think the league was more skilled.   Their are more athletes today but a lot of them cannot play.   However, each generation is marketed by the NBA as bigger and better than the last.   I would put forth that no generation was more skilled from players from 78-88  that includes many hall of famers.   Look at some of the recent drafts and the star potential is simply not there.

Go back and look at the drafts from 78-88 and you'll find a lot more players who were decidedly not Hall of Fame Caliber. It's the nature of the beast. You could do just as well picking players from 1995-2005 (if not better, actually).

Then go look up "hindsight bias." It's clear that this is the best point guard play the league has ever seen, even if it doesn't fit the 'classic' model of what a point guard 'should' be doing. Team's offenses are better, the spacing is better, teams finally understand the three point shot, and the defenses are roughly a million times better even with the acknowledgement that more teams leads to greater distillation of talent which leads to fewer truly amazing squads with great depth 1-10.


Sepia is a great color and all, but don't let it rule your opinion of the game today.

[littleteapot]

IMO you can debate if Dwight Howard, Joakim Noah or Marc Gasol its the best center and that's kind of embarrassing for Dwight. He is obviously such a superior talent it's not even funny. When Shaq and Duncan were dominating the league, I think guys like Noah existed, but they were just overshadowed because the truly great talents maximized their talent in almost every (excluding free throw shooting for Shaq). And Dwight is the only truly talented big who's in the elite conversation - what does all this say about Bynum, Cousins and those type of guys who should have top 10 talent but don't even have a commitment to basketball?

I think perimeter players (partly because the rules help them) are as good as ever though. I personally thought Vince Carter and Tracy McGrady were to their era and position what guys like Bosh are now. Yeah they have a lot of talent and skill, but can they make winning plays? I think there are like 5 wings and 5 guards right now who are "oh sh--" players where you have to throw your defense out and change everything just to stop them. I always thought you could just put your best wing defender on Carter and TMag and many of the perimeter players other than Kobe and Kidd and you'd be fine.

[D.o.s.]

Simmons did a very good column a while ago on T-Mac, and in the midst of it there's a laundry list of the best players McGrady ever played with. I don't know if 'making the winning play' was his problem as much as staying healthy was.

Also, I think Dwight is more comparable to Vince/T-Mac, in that their athletic ability is/was just jaw-dropping. I don't see the Bosh comp.

Thirdly, I don't really think of Duncan as a dominant player the same way Shaq was, even though he's probably the best PF in the history of the game.

[littleteapot]

Simmons did a very good column a while ago on T-Mac, and in the midst of it there's a laundry list of the best players McGrady ever played with. I don't know if 'making the winning play' was his problem as much as staying healthy was.

Also, I think Dwight is more comparable to Vince/T-Mac, in that their athletic ability is/was just jaw-dropping. I don't see the Bosh comp.

Hmm maybe that's fair. I just go into a game where the Celtics are playing Dwight being terrified that he's going to get 20 rebounds and no one on the C's will score in the paint. With TMag I always felt like we could just put Pierce on him and he would make some shots but we'd be fine.

Thirdly, I don't really think of Duncan as a dominant player the same way Shaq was, even though he's probably the best PF in the history of the game.

Here's my point: I would consider Tim Duncan a great talent that is a head above most bigs in the NBA. There were a lot of guys like Ben Wallace who were average talents who were just really smart and competed their tails off, but comparing them to Duncan would have been laughable. Nowadays, the only freak big man who is elite is Dwight, and the elite bigs who are just smart, tough, competitive guys like Noah and Gasol are about as good as Dwight is.

[LilRip]

I don't think this league lacks superstar talent. Lebron, Durant, and even CP3 are obviously top-tier superstars. Meanwhile, the next wave of dominant players are already on the horizon. Potential future MVPs such as Anthony Davis, Paul George, and Steph Curry. Even Demarcus Cousins seems like he's well on his way to join this elite club. Then the league has its elder statesmen, the former superstars but still stars in their own right, in Duncan, Kobe, and Dirk.

Hasn't this generally been the cycle of the league?

[littleteapot]

If Demarcus Cousins is ever considered a superstar, I'm going to watch the WNBA.

[Moranis]

Kobe had an interesting interview recently, where he stated the European youth are excelling in basketball over the American youth, because they are being taught true basics, and technique, and honest rules.

AAU ball is a big part of it, and parents urging kids to shoot every time they touch it.   These things definitely put "me" in team.

In a league, that lacks superstar talent, we are certainly without even a star now.


I think the basketball of the 80s was the best, the quality of the ball was better and top to bottom I think the league was more skilled.   Their are more athletes today but a lot of them cannot play.   However, each generation is marketed by the NBA as bigger and better than the last.   I would put forth that no generation was more skilled from players from 78-88  that includes many hall of famers.   Look at some of the recent drafts and the star potential is simply not there.

There were a lot of bad bad teams in the 80's.  Sure the Celtics and Lakers were great teams and the early part had the Sixers and the latter the Pistons, but there were a lot of mediocre to bad teams with one or two quality players on a lot of teams.  I mean the Washington Bullets made the playoffs 5 straight years and were above .500 once in that stretch (they were 12 games below .500 one year and made the playoffs) and they weren't even the 8th seed all those years. 

The Bucks were consistently a top 3 team in the East and while they had some nice players, they didn't have a single HOF player on their team.

People always remember things more fondly, but the reality is the game of basketball has made tremendous strides recently.  The league may be stretched to a couple of unnecessary teams, but by and large the league is comprised of significantly better players today than of years prior.  There is more depth, more skill, more league wide balance, and just a better product on the whole.