rondo is so studied and criticised

[rollie mass]

My question is"Is rondo fully 100%" is ability to get to hoop different than past ?"Last nights blocked layup in 4th quarter,it just seemed like in past he would have hammered that"it seemed  nonchalant. Is he a little less explosive in his vertical or maybe tentative of a major collision?"he just seems to finish different.This not an attempt at criticism it takes along time to recover i assume because i didn't-but when i tried i was always conscious of out of control  in the air offensive situations,if he is 100% physically, there still is the psychological  impact that may be in the back of his mind.About a week ago he stated he wasn't 100% yet-

[soulman]

Leave Rondo alone 

[Roy H.]

First, I agree with the thread title.  I think the over-analysis has to do with him being the "star" on a very bad team, as well as him playing a fairly non-traditional game.  There are a lot of holes in his game for an all-star level player, and I think some fans focus on those faults, rather than looking at the total package.  With Rondo, it's easy to get into a trap where you think that the faults are easily correctable.  However, when you step back, you realize that if Rondo was an excellent shooter, penetrator, and scorer, he'd realistically be on Lebron's level.  That's not a fair expectation.

As for the question at hand, I can only cite stats.  Rondo averages 3.2 points per game on drives, and the Celts score 6.5 points per game on Rondo drives.  The first number isn't in the top-50 in the NBA; the second is 44th.

I don't know how that ranks in terms of years past, but for a player of Rondo's athleticism and speed, those are disappointing. 

[Celtics4ever]

I do not think he is as explosive as he was in the past, that is to be expected.   But to me, I think it is largely mental, he does not try to drive like he used to do so.  Often the mental takes longer than the physical in a recovery.  I think the tentative comment is both appropriate and applicable in this case.   I think it is normal after a bad injury like he had.  Let's hope he gets his mojo back.   I have seen some flashes of the old RR.

[D.o.s.]

I know I was criticized for saying that Rondo was going to be about as good as he was going to get after about a month's worth of games into his return last year.

 

[mgent]

First, I agree with the thread title.  I think the over-analysis has to do with him being the "star" on a very bad team, as well as him playing a fairly non-traditional game.  There are a lot of holes in his game for an all-star level player, and I think some fans focus on those faults, rather than looking at the total package.  With Rondo, it's easy to get into a trap where you think that the faults are easily correctable.  However, when you step back, you realize that if Rondo was an excellent shooter, penetrator, and scorer, he'd realistically be on Lebron's level.  That's not a fair expectation.

As for the question at hand, I can only cite stats.  Rondo averages 3.2 points per game on drives, and the Celts score 6.5 points per game on Rondo drives.  The first number isn't in the top-50 in the NBA; the second is 44th.

I don't know how that ranks in terms of years past, but for a player of Rondo's athleticism and speed, those are disappointing.

Yup, he has enough speed and athleticism where he should be coming up with 3-4 open layups every game (it's felt like he's had more of those in past years).  If he hits a couple of his signature tough finishes on top of that should be a bonus.

[manl_lui]

First, I agree with the thread title.  I think the over-analysis has to do with him being the "star" on a very bad team, as well as him playing a fairly non-traditional game.  There are a lot of holes in his game for an all-star level player, and I think some fans focus on those faults, rather than looking at the total package.  With Rondo, it's easy to get into a trap where you think that the faults are easily correctable.  However, when you step back, you realize that if Rondo was an excellent shooter, penetrator, and scorer, he'd realistically be on Lebron's level.  That's not a fair expectation.

As for the question at hand, I can only cite stats.  Rondo averages 3.2 points per game on drives, and the Celts score 6.5 points per game on Rondo drives.  The first number isn't in the top-50 in the NBA; the second is 44th.

I don't know how that ranks in terms of years past, but for a player of Rondo's athleticism and speed, those are disappointing.

I agree, but I also would like to add...I do think that at this point, Rondo is 100%. It does seem he changed his game a bit. I honestly thought his defense dropped off a bit. Before his ACL injury, I thought his 1 on 1 defense was average or maybe even slightly above average. This year, I felt all the point guards he was guarding blows by him rather easily. I also agree with the OP that it does seem like he isn't as explosive to the rim anymore...maybe his ACL injury changed the way he plays the game. He does take more open jump shots now. His FT definitely took a huge hit. Going from 60% - 30% is definitely not acceptable. Other than that, during our 3 game winning streak, I like how Rondo is pushing the pace compare to the first few games of the season. His jumpshot was always average in my honest opinion, and not as bad as people said it was.

With that said, I am not in the trade Rondo camp as I do feel he is one of our major piece going forward as our 2nd or 3rd best player in a championship team. I always said we need ourselves a go-to-scorer, we need a Paul Pierce but younger. Not sure if Jeff Green's improvement this year would enable him to be that guy but again I am not convinced that Green should be your best player on a championship team. On tight games, I miss those Paul Pierce isos

[Capricious]

My question is"Is rondo fully 100%" is ability to get to hoop different than past ?"Last nights blocked layup in 4th quarter,it just seemed like in past he would have hammered that"it seemed  nonchalant. Is he a little less explosive in his vertical or maybe tentative of a major collision?"he just seems to finish different.This not an attempt at criticism it takes along time to recover i assume because i didn't-but when i tried i was always conscious of out of control  in the air offensive situations,if he is 100% physically, there still is the psychological  impact that may be in the back of his mind.About a week ago he stated he wasn't 100% yet-

Rondo has played like this for years.  He used to go to the hoop and always ended up on the floor.  Now, he barely leaves the ground in traffic.

Its too bad, because he would be so much better if he would do it again. I guess his idea is to stay healthy. 

[Chris22]

Rondo used to be great.
Now he is not.
Everybody gets old.

[gpap]

Rondo is a very interesting case right now.

Yesterday, he made some great passes (like he normally does) and came up with a huge steal off Pierce.

HOWEVER, he also missed a couple of very key shots in the end of the 4th quarter yesterday as well.

Offensively, he seems to do great in the first 3 quarters.

But for whatever reason, in the end of games, he tends to come up short (again, offensively speaking.)

Just pointing that out.

What to do from there I guess is up to the team and Rondo to figure out.

[mgent]

Rondo used to be great.
Now he is not.
Everybody gets old.

Yeah but no one gets old at 28.

[D.o.s.]

Rondo used to be great.
Now he is not.
Everybody gets old.

Yeah but no one gets old at 28.

He's definitely starting the decline of his NBA career.

[Celtics18]

Every NBA champion I can think of in my life time has featured top players 28 years of age or older. 

[D.o.s.]

Every NBA champion I can think of in my life time has featured top players 28 years of age or older.

Every NBA champion I can think of has featured at least one player that's been traded at least once, too.

Every NBA champion I can think of in my lifetime has featured a player with a sneaker endorsement.

So on, so forth. Based on everything we know about basketball, the average NBA player is at his peak at 25-27, with some wiggle room. That's also true for NBA superstars, but in their case they're so good that they're still mopping the floor with the rest of the league. Post-retirement Jordan is a pretty good example of that, but in case you'd like to read more:

http://basketballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=399

http://wagesofwins.com/nba-players-age-like-milk/

http://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/2aa0r2/study_at_what_age_an_nba_player_reaches_his_peak/

edit: I should add that there's an argument to be made in favor of the mental gains that a player experiences throughout his NBA career, but that's largely a 'common sense,' confirmation- and hindsight-bias fueled observation.

[Chris22]

Rondo used to be great.
Now he is not.
Everybody gets old.

Yeah but no one gets old at 28.

The do if they have had a knee injury.
Rondo is a poor shooter and a poor defender and his fourth quarter play is terrible.
The team is a minus 3 with Rondo on the floor.
He passes and rebounds well, however.