Rubio gets 4 years, $56m

[byennie]

Rubio doesn't get enough credit for his defensive prowess. He's also among the league leaders in steal rate (3.5 percent, second to Tony Allen among players with at least 1,000 minutes), and that's not the result of bad risks. Rubio has quick hands, and his size and wingspan allow him to contest shots even when beaten on the perimeter. Add in one of the best rebound rates for any point guard and ESPN's real plus-minus puts Rubio as the league's second-best point guard on defense.

That's a great example of the strength and weakness of stats.  Rubio is probably a better defender than some in this thread are making out but only someone who literally NEVER watches NBA basketball could think Rubio is the 2nd best defender at his position in the league.

Mike

Just keep in mind that nobody actually said he's 2nd best. Just that one useful stat ranks him that high, which is an indication that he's at least good.

[byennie]

Not a huge surprise considering that $10 million will be the equivalent of $13 million pretty soon when the cap goes up.

This. Almost every long-term deal that's been signed in the last year has been criticized as an overpay, and that is missing the big picture. Salaries are about to go up. If you don't need the money to make a move today, it's a good investment to lock in deals that are 2015 overpays but 2016 bargains.

What we should really be talking about is the unfamiliar new world we're about to step into where Rubio is worth $14M a year- and what the Celtics are doing to get ready for it. They gave Bradley one of these deals. I think it's looking more and more likely every day that Rondo is going to get a max or near-max contract that will look similarly bad in today's dollars but have reasonable value in the new CBA.

Not everyone is missing it. Some just believe in making better investments. Sure salary is going up, yet you shouldn't spend based on what you will have 2 or 4 years from now. You want to have flexibility and if cap does go sky high you can land some high profile super stars because you didn't over pay on 4th options. Dumping over 10 million dollars into outside the top 40 NBA players is foolish IMO.

So there are only 40 players in the league worth 1/7th of your cap space? 15% of the cap is a reasonable price for long-term control of an above-average starter. Don't get me wrong, there are plenty of bad contracts out there, but if there are only 40 players in the league worth $10M then there would be about 5-10 teams who could never keep a good player past his rookie deal.

[MBunge]

Rubio doesn't get enough credit for his defensive prowess. He's also among the league leaders in steal rate (3.5 percent, second to Tony Allen among players with at least 1,000 minutes), and that's not the result of bad risks. Rubio has quick hands, and his size and wingspan allow him to contest shots even when beaten on the perimeter. Add in one of the best rebound rates for any point guard and ESPN's real plus-minus puts Rubio as the league's second-best point guard on defense.

That's a great example of the strength and weakness of stats.  Rubio is probably a better defender than some in this thread are making out but only someone who literally NEVER watches NBA basketball could think Rubio is the 2nd best defender at his position in the league.

Mike

Just keep in mind that nobody actually said he's 2nd best. Just that one useful stat ranks him that high, which is an indication that he's at least good.

Yes, because people have never used individual stats before to make silly claims about players or teams.  The point I'm making by using Rubio as an example, therefore, cannot possibly be applied to any other situation or argument.

Mike

[byennie]

Yes, because people have never used individual stats before to make silly claims about players or teams.  The point I'm making by using Rubio as an example, therefore, cannot possibly be applied to any other situation or argument.

Mike

Of course people make silly claims based on a single stat. However, inventing that hypothetical person in order to support your own argument is a strawman. Who is this imaginary person who never watches basketball saying Rubio is the 2nd best PG defender? 'Cause he's not in this thread.

[AidaCelt]

Seeing it was my initial comment about Rubio being a poor defender, I'll clarify what I meant... used too few words to sum up my thoughts.

I see Rubio as a lazy defender. Yes, the stats column shows steals but it doesn't show the gambles he takes, his defensive assignment getting inside the paint etc. Similar to Rondo, he has the ability to be a very good defender and shows it at times. Other times he gambles which then relies on a rim protector to back him up. Minnesota don't have that rim protector. As a team they are poor, and Rubio's gambles and inability to stay in front of his man (not really an inability but a lapse or choice to go for the steal) contributes to this.

[crimson_stallion]

horrible deal. would be almost unbelievable if it weren't minnesota doing it. rubio shot .381 last year, his pest percentage in an NBA season. that's $14M per year for a rich man's phil pressey:
rubio's career numbers, age 24, 3+ NBA seasons, 32 minutes a game: 10pts / 8 ast / 4 reb
pressey per 32 minutes, age 23, one NBA season: 6pts/6.5 ast/3 reb
and keep in mind pressey was playing spotty minutes on a really bad team.
horrible deal.

I think this deal officially makes Rubio a rich, stupid man's Phil Pressey. I thought this was a joke when I opened the thread.

Haha it's funny because I was just thinking....Phil Pressey can pretty much do everything Rubio can do, except Pressey is a far better defender 

[crimson_stallion]

P.s.

This deal makes Jeff Green's and Avery Bradley's contracts look like the bargains of the decade

[Who]

P.s.

This deal makes Jeff Green's and Avery Bradley's contracts look like the bargains of the decade

I think this Rubio contract could be a good indication of what Jeff Green could get on his next contract with the CBA increasing. 4 years $50+ million.

[Eddie20]

horrible deal. would be almost unbelievable if it weren't minnesota doing it. rubio shot .381 last year, his pest percentage in an NBA season. that's $14M per year for a rich man's phil pressey:
rubio's career numbers, age 24, 3+ NBA seasons, 32 minutes a game: 10pts / 8 ast / 4 reb
pressey per 32 minutes, age 23, one NBA season: 6pts/6.5 ast/3 reb
and keep in mind pressey was playing spotty minutes on a really bad team.
horrible deal.

I think this deal officially makes Rubio a rich, stupid man's Phil Pressey. I thought this was a joke when I opened the thread.

Haha it's funny because I was just thinking....Phil Pressey can pretty much do everything Rubio can do, except Pressey is a far better defender 

Don't ever quit your day job to go into scouting.

[byennie]

Seeing it was my initial comment about Rubio being a poor defender, I'll clarify what I meant... used too few words to sum up my thoughts.

I see Rubio as a lazy defender. Yes, the stats column shows steals but it doesn't show the gambles he takes, his defensive assignment getting inside the paint etc. Similar to Rondo, he has the ability to be a very good defender and shows it at times. Other times he gambles which then relies on a rim protector to back him up. Minnesota don't have that rim protector. As a team they are poor, and Rubio's gambles and inability to stay in front of his man (not really an inability but a lapse or choice to go for the steal) contributes to this.

I disagree a bit, but that's a perfectly reasonable assessment. I do also think it has to correlate a little with being on a team that's playing a lot of 110-105 type games by design, and fails to secure any interior defenders. You put Rubio on Indiana (for example) and I bet he'd suddenly 'become' All-Defense.

[PickNRoll]

Seeing it was my initial comment about Rubio being a poor defender, I'll clarify what I meant... used too few words to sum up my thoughts.

I see Rubio as a lazy defender. Yes, the stats column shows steals but it doesn't show the gambles he takes, his defensive assignment getting inside the paint etc. Similar to Rondo, he has the ability to be a very good defender and shows it at times. Other times he gambles which then relies on a rim protector to back him up. Minnesota don't have that rim protector. As a team they are poor, and Rubio's gambles and inability to stay in front of his man (not really an inability but a lapse or choice to go for the steal) contributes to this.

I have to chime in as a perennial Rubio hater.  I've watched their home games in person and he is really giving 110% on both sides of the ball this year.  You can't fault his effort.  Jump shot is markedly better too.  I still wouldn't have given him $14M, but that's just one small bump on the mountain of mistakes by TWolves GM's.  By all accounts they're overachieving this year.  Makes me wonder why the C's couldn't have swung a deal for Thad Young.

[D.o.s.]

It's a really good thing that they didn't waste their max deal on Kevin Love, huh?