Forsberg: Turner might be playing his way into starting role

[Kuberski33]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

[Rondo9]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

Why is everyone assuming that Turner takes Green's spot? Green is fine as a player I don't understand what more people want from him.

[Snakehead]

I hope this is aimed at lighting a fire under Jeff.

I like Turner but I like him off the bench.  I hope Jeff starts because then we will have truly outstanding spacing around Rondo and I would love to see how that plays.

Yes, it's great Turner gets in the paint but you know who does it better?  Rondo.  Without him, sure, get Turner big minutes.

I really want to see what Rondo can do in a line up with a lot of shooting that is willing to run.  A starting line up of Avery, Green, Sully, Olynyk could give him three point shooting at every position.  That I really want to see.

[Snakehead]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

Why is everyone assuming that Turner takes Green's spot? Green is fine as a player I don't understand what more people want from him.

They want him to be an underpaid All Star.

Jeff has his limitations but he has his strengths and he is fairly paid.  Most Celtics fans will never just accept this though.

[hpantazo]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

Why is everyone assuming that Turner takes Green's spot? Green is fine as a player I don't understand what more people want from him.

Turner fits the needs of this team much better. He provides an additional ball handler, he rebounds, moves the ball very well, creates shots, takes it aggressively to the hoop, makes things happen out on the floor. Besides Rondo, we have no one else that can do that.

Green doesn't rebound well for a guy his size, he has serious trouble passing out of the double team and has poor court vision all around, he is an average ball handler for his position, and does not create his own shots or shots for others, and he rarely drives to the hoop aggressively. He is very skilled and athletic, but he often doesn't make much out of those talents.

[nostar]

The Stiffs

Not sure what the issue with Sully/KO is. They are really good players

Where Sully falls short in his FG% he makes up for in rebounds. They aren't stars (yet) but I think Sully has a real shot at being an all star in this league. Sully is very comparable to Faried on the inside and has an outside game that Faried lacks completely.

Olynyk's next 1-2 years will decide if he's an all star or Spencer Hawes. Spencer Hawes is a pretty good player so I think Olynyk's floor is still pretty good.

I like our roster right now. I think we probably need a real center and an scoring wing wouldn't hurt but I'm pretty pleased. Our PG is one of the best in the league, our PFs are talented inside and out, our SGs are really good at defense and one can shoot pretty well. Last season, as a primary offensive option, Bradley shot as well or better from 3 than Dirk Nowitski and Kevin Durant. That is pretty excellent. Of players who shot at least 200 3PTs or more Bradley is 23rd in 3PT%. That is why he got his money by the way. He was actually a better shooter last year than Bradley Beal was.

[D.o.s.]

The Stiffs

Not sure what the issue with Sully/KO is. They are really good players

Where Sully falls short in his FG% he makes up for in rebounds. They aren't stars (yet) but I think Sully has a real shot at being an all star in this league. Sully is very comparable to Faried on the inside and has an outside game that Faried lacks completely.

Olynyk's next 1-2 years will decide if he's an all star or Spencer Hawes. Spencer Hawes is a pretty good player so I think Olynyk's floor is still pretty good.

I like our roster right now. I think we probably need a real center and an scoring wing wouldn't hurt but I'm pretty pleased. Our PG is one of the best in the league, our PFs are talented inside and out, our SGs are really good at defense and one can shoot pretty well. Last season, as a primary offensive option, Bradley shot as well or better from 3 than Dirk Nowitski and Kevin Durant. That is pretty excellent. Of players who shot at least 200 3PTs or more Bradley is 23rd in 3PT%. That is why he got his money by the way. He was actually a better shooter last year than Bradley Beal was.

I like your citations and your optimism is refreshing. I don't think we have a competitive team, at all, and I don't believe that we have found capable starters at more than two positions (Green and Rondo), but there's always the option for Sullinger's development to continue.

One thing though, that 200 3PTs is a pretty good case of cherrypicking. Out of all the players in the league that shot at least 201 threes.... Bradley's not on that list, because he didn't shoot 201. Durant still is. Dirk still is. Bradley Beal still is. That's not the reason Bradley got paid. I agree with "Primary offensive option" but the idea that he's a better shooter from deep than any of your examples isn't really born out.

Bradley got paid because, provided he stays healthy, he's a bargain, and even if he doesn't, the new TV deal means he'll be a bargain in two years anyway.

[Fred Roberts]

According to Jay King, Stevens just said this at practice:

Jeff Green will spend some time at the 4 this season. "I think Evan has to play," Stevens said

Writing on the wall.

https://twitter.com/ByJayKing/status/521686644312002560

No shocker here. Let your best players play. If Jeff and Turner turn out to be two of our top 5 (pretty logical possibility) then they'll both find their way to 30 minutes a night and potentially the starting lineup. Jeff can play 3/4. Evan can play 1/2/3. No reason they can't co-exist and help each other and the team be better.

Plus, I like the additional size. We shouldn't have Pressey or Smart starting for Rondo, so we might as well have Bradley, Turner, Green, Sully, Zeller in the starting lineup and have Turner act as point on offense. Key subs would be Smart, Thornton & KO, with Pressey, Young and flotsam competing for scraps.

[clover]

According to Jay King, Stevens just said this at practice:

Jeff Green will spend some time at the 4 this season. "I think Evan has to play," Stevens said

Writing on the wall.

https://twitter.com/ByJayKing/status/521686644312002560

No shocker here. Let your best players play. If Jeff and Turner turn out to be two of our top 5 (pretty logical possibility) then they'll both find their way to 30 minutes a night and potentially the starting lineup. Jeff can play 3/4. Evan can play 1/2/3. No reason they can't co-exist and help each other and the team be better.

Plus, I like the additional size. We shouldn't have Pressey or Smart starting for Rondo, so we might as well have Bradley, Turner, Green, Sully, Zeller in the starting lineup and have Turner act as point on offense. Key subs would be Smart, Thornton & KO, with Pressey, Young and flotsam competing for scraps.

I think KO is capable of delivering more than Zeller in the starting lineup and he needs minutes to develop. The question is whether he'll reassert himself aggressively--or have his starting spot taken from him until he does.

But I agree--with Green back Turner should fill in for Rondo.

[hwangjini_1]

According to Jay King, Stevens just said this at practice:

Jeff Green will spend some time at the 4 this season. "I think Evan has to play," Stevens said

Writing on the wall.

https://twitter.com/ByJayKing/status/521686644312002560

No shocker here. Let your best players play. If Jeff and Turner turn out to be two of our top 5 (pretty logical possibility) then they'll both find their way to 30 minutes a night and potentially the starting lineup. Jeff can play 3/4. Evan can play 1/2/3. No reason they can't co-exist and help each other and the team be better.

Plus, I like the additional size. We shouldn't have Pressey or Smart starting for Rondo, so we might as well have Bradley, Turner, Green, Sully, Zeller in the starting lineup and have Turner act as point on offense. Key subs would be Smart, Thornton & KO, with Pressey, Young and flotsam competing for scraps.

I think KO is capable of delivering more than Zeller in the starting lineup and he needs minutes to develop. The question is whether he'll reassert himself aggressively--or have his starting spot taken from him until he does.

But I agree--with Green back Turner should fill in for Rondo.

good point. a few weeks ago, before preseason, i would have tossed out something about how zeller's defense would possibly compensate for olly's offense. i dont know if i can say that anymore. i expected more out of zeller than i have seen in preseason, especially on defense.

zeller may change and improve once he gets used to the celtics' systems. but right now olly looks the better of the two.

[LooseCannon]

Maybe Turner doesn't have a realistic chance of starting if Green, Bradley, and Rondo are all healthy, but Stevens is hinting at the possibility as a way to motivate Turner.

[mmmmm]

I think the more likely scenario than Turner starting at SF (either for Green or to slide Green over to PF) is that, assuming Rondo isn't available for the first few weeks of the season, to start him at guard, playing point.   I think this is more an acknowledgement that Smart may not be ready to start just yet -- or they simply want Smart off the bench for now to take pressure off him.

What happens after Rondo comes back?  I just don't see Turner starting over any of Rondo, Bradley or Green at the 1-2-3 spots.  So I think he only plays with those three in a small-ball lineup and I seriously hope we don't _start_ many games with a small ball lineup.

[kozlodoev]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

Why is everyone assuming that Turner takes Green's spot? Green is fine as a player I don't understand what more people want from him.

They want him to be an underpaid All Star.

Jeff has his limitations but he has his strengths and he is fairly paid.  Most Celtics fans will never just accept this though.

Just because he's a "fine as a player" doesn't mean he would be guaranteed to start. Evan Turner is also a "fine as a player".

What "they" want him to be is someone who creates high-percentage offense for himself, because the next guy the starting lineup who can do that will be the first. Green can't do it. He can "consume" offence just fine (that is, score when the entire defense isn't focused on him) -- which is a fine skill to have, but that's not what this team needs.

So unless Green and his game proves to be some sort of a revelation, the team is better served by sitting him in favor of Turner -- at least as far as I am concerned.

[hwangjini_1]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

Why is everyone assuming that Turner takes Green's spot? Green is fine as a player I don't understand what more people want from him.

They want him to be an underpaid All Star.

Jeff has his limitations but he has his strengths and he is fairly paid.  Most Celtics fans will never just accept this though.

Just because he's a "fine as a player" doesn't mean he would be guaranteed to start. Evan Turner is also a "fine as a player".

What "they" want him to be is someone who creates high-percentage offense for himself, because the next guy the starting lineup who can do that will be the first. Green can't do it. He can "consume" offence just fine (that is, score when the entire defense isn't focused on him) -- which is a fine skill to have, but that's not what this team needs.

So unless Green and his game proves to be some sort of a revelation, the team is better served by sitting him in favor of Turner -- at least as far as I am concerned.

agreed. which raises a question i now ask of you. (and this is a real question since you are a good poster.) if the celtics played turner at the 2 or 3 spot, and complimented him with green at the 3 or 4 spot, would turner be able to take enough pressure off green for green to "consume" offense?

that is, do you think that as a pair the total would be more than the sum of the parts?

[MBunge]

Nothing better for a team than real competition for starting roles and playing time. Hope this lights a fuse under Jeff Green's ass and he realizes he needs to be aggressive and active every minute he is on the floor or else he will lose his spot and his minutes.

Periods of passivity/zoning out is part of Green's DNA and will never change.  That's not something you can coach out of someone at this stage of the game.  He is what he is.

Why is everyone assuming that Turner takes Green's spot? Green is fine as a player I don't understand what more people want from him.

They want him to be an underpaid All Star.

Jeff has his limitations but he has his strengths and he is fairly paid.  Most Celtics fans will never just accept this though.

Just because he's a "fine as a player" doesn't mean he would be guaranteed to start. Evan Turner is also a "fine as a player".

What "they" want him to be is someone who creates high-percentage offense for himself, because the next guy the starting lineup who can do that will be the first. Green can't do it. He can "consume" offence just fine (that is, score when the entire defense isn't focused on him) -- which is a fine skill to have, but that's not what this team needs.

So unless Green and his game proves to be some sort of a revelation, the team is better served by sitting him in favor of Turner -- at least as far as I am concerned.

I'm pretty sure most 76er fans who've seen Turner play WAAAAAAY more than 4 games would disagree with you.

I like what Turner's shown so far but a little brake-pumping is in order.

Mike