Chad Ford Mock 7.0 today Gordon and Porzingis

[hpantazo]

A lot if not most players do not get better. That's why the NBA Draft is littered with role players and busts every single year.

Sooner or later, that will sink in.

especially players that shoot 29%

[NorthernLightning]

A lot if not most players do not get better. That's why the NBA Draft is littered with role players and busts every single year.

Sooner or later, that will sink in.

You simply don't understand how rare of a package Aaron Gordon is. You might lump him in with dumb and disturbed athletes like Tony Mitchell, or you might lump him in with unrefined players that are not freak athletes, but you simply don't understand how rare it is for a player to have the entire package of traits that Gordon has.

And you will soon see the error of your ways.

[NorthernLightning]

A lot if not most players do not get better. That's why the NBA Draft is littered with role players and busts every single year.

Sooner or later, that will sink in.

especially players that shoot 29%

Shoots 29% eh? I heard he shoots 50% at 18 years old, but what do I know? I didn't search for the least flattering sub-category of a statistic and misrepresent it.

[colincb]

A lot if not most players do not get better. That's why the NBA Draft is littered with role players and busts every single year.

Sooner or later, that will sink in.

especially players that shoot 29%

Shoots 29% eh? I heard he shoots 50% at 18 years old, but what do I know? I didn't search for the least flattering sub-category of a statistic and misrepresent it.

He shoots 29% if he's not at the rim.

He's got a  much better chance of having his percentages go down in the NBA than up. Kid has no post game whatsoever, he'll be playing the SF, and he's not getting 46% of his shots at the rim when LBJ, who's a much stronger player and much better driver, gets 34%. He's going to get smacked by bigger guys before he gets to the basket. He's going to get defended a lot better too everywhere on the floor including beyond the arc, where he's a spot up shooter, not a shot creator. It doesn't matter how he did in college, it's how his game translates to the NBA.


http://hoop-math.com/Arizona2014.php

http://www.numberfire.com/nba/news/2380/lebron-james-knows-his-strengths-and-that-s-big-for-the-heat

[colincb]

double post

[knuckleballer]

A lot if not most players do not get better. That's why the NBA Draft is littered with role players and busts every single year.

Sooner or later, that will sink in.

especially players that shoot 29%

Shoots 29% eh? I heard he shoots 50% at 18 years old, but what do I know? I didn't search for the least flattering sub-category of a statistic and misrepresent it.

He shoots 29% if he's not at the rim.

He's got a  much better chance of having his percentages go down in the NBA than up. Kid has no post game whatsoever, he'll be playing the SF, and he's not getting 46% of his shots at the rim when LBJ, who's a much stronger player and much better driver, gets 34%. He's going to get smacked by bigger guys before he gets to the basket. He's going to get defended a lot better too everywhere on the floor including beyond the arc, where he's a spot up shooter, not a shot creator. It doesn't matter how he did in college, it's how his game translates to the NBA.


http://hoop-math.com/Arizona2014.php

http://www.numberfire.com/nba/news/2380/lebron-james-knows-his-strengths-and-that-s-big-for-the-heat

So the fact that he won't be 19 until September or that he was the best player, despite his deficiencies, for a team that spent much of the season ranked number 1 is not relevant at all.  Lets ignore the fact he was one of the most agile and fastest guys at the combine despite being 6'9". 

Let's call him a rich man's version of Tony Allen even though he is four inches taller and much more athletic.  Let's also ignore that he makes the right plays on offense while Tonly Allen runs around like an idiot... because he's only a rich man's Tonly Allen.

Winning California's best high school basketball player of the year twice and the Mc Donald's all American game MVP  means he has limited skills.  Afterall, an 18 year old man with an awesome work ethic, is unlikely to improve on his skills or develop more strength.

[D.o.s.]

Much more athletic than a pre-injury Tony Allen would be quite the sight -- are you talking about TA before or after he blew his knee out?

[knuckleballer]

Much more athletic than a pre-injury Tony Allen would be quite the sight -- are you talking about TA before or after he blew his knee out?

Before.  His vertical was 3 inches higher.  The thing with Gordon is he doesn't seem to have to make much of an effort to jump high or move fast.  It's on display throughout every game he plays.
How much he can develop his skills, we don't know.  But given his raw talents and basketball intelligence, I think he'll be a good player for a long time.  If he can develop his offensive skills, shooting in particular, he's a perennial allstar.

[greg683x]

I can't wait until this draft is over. This habit of constantly posting draftexpress vids and you tube vids on prospective players is getting nauseating, like these vids are the end all be all of how to judge these players. SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, sick of seeing them.

If the kid never fixes his shot he is a glorified Tony Allen only worse with his shooting. I want more from my #6 pick than a role player.

ahhh my god cant agree with this more.  Testify sir, testify

[celticsfan8591]

Apparently Exum has "refused" to work out for the Celtics: http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft-extended.php

If Exum's there at 6 I'd still jump all over him, workout or no workout.  He's clearly going to be the best player on the board at that point.  He most likely refused because he doesn't expect to go that low.  Even if he has some problem with Boston, he's not going to refuse to play in the NBA because he was picked by a team that's not atop his wish list.  I also hate the idea of letting a player in the draft essentially pick his team.

[knuckleballer]

I can't wait until this draft is over. This habit of constantly posting draftexpress vids and you tube vids on prospective players is getting nauseating, like these vids are the end all be all of how to judge these players. SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, sick of seeing them.

If the kid never fixes his shot he is a glorified Tony Allen only worse with his shooting. I want more from my #6 pick than a role player.

ahhh my god cant agree with this more.  Testify sir, testify

Don't worry, we'll go through this all over again next year. 

[footey]

Hard to defend Gordon as a good shooter. If he were, he would be in the top 3 discussion, given his other skill sets and athleticism. 

If I was forced to decide between Vonleh, Gordon and Randle, I choose Gordon.  This is based on watching them each play several games in college, and imagining who "feels" to me like his game is going to work in the NBA.  I don't feel that way with Vonleh or Randle.  I remember watching Indiana game vs. Michigan State this season, watching Payne outplay Vonleh, and wondering why he (Payne) was not getting the attention by the fans.  For Randle, he works extremely hard, but seems so limited in what he can do offensively, and for him to make those same back to the basket moves in the NBA?  The only guy who seems to have that game anymore and get away with it is Al Jefferson.  Randle does not strike me as being on that level, or that long.

Worth noting: Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson, pretty good players in their day, were not very good outside shooters when they came into the NBA.  They each improved, especially from 3 point range, over the years, through hard work and dedication.  So I reject Nick's assumption that players don't improve their shooting percentage that much. Or, for that matter, that having a below average outside shot relegates a player to bench role status.  That just does not square with the facts.

[Neurotic Guy]

Apparently Exum has "refused" to work out for the Celtics: http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-mock-draft-extended.php

If Exum's there at 6 I'd still jump all over him, workout or no workout.  He's clearly going to be the best player on the board at that point.  He most likely refused because he doesn't expect to go that low.  Even if he has some problem with Boston, he's not going to refuse to play in the NBA because he was picked by a team that's not atop his wish list.  I also hate the idea of letting a player in the draft essentially pick his team.

I wish I actually knew something other than what I've read about any of these players, but I don't.   So if, as all mocks and pundits suggest, Exum is in the top tier of talent in this draft, a fall to #6 would seem to leave the C's with a boatload of options.   LA would be salivating (according to rumors about a month ago) about a realistic chance to get Exum, and there could be a bidding war for the pick.  I think the C's will be in a great position to trade.  Perhaps the opportunity for Love comes more into play with Exum on the board at 6.

[NorthernLightning]

Most people have trouble believing there are more than 2-4 great prospects in any draft. And the media is always going to be talking about the top 3-4 prospects. That goes for any sport and any draft. That's just the way the media is, and that's just the way fans are.

They don't trust their own judgment so they convince themselves there are only 2-4 great players in any draft, and then pounce on anybody who suggests otherwise, like a pack of coyotes.

There's little risk in doing so. Even if we drafted Gordon and he had a good year, they would search for a span of games (probably in the first couple months of the season) and point out his struggles during that time, and insist the rest of the season was a fluke.

That buys them another year, and by year three nobody remembers all the people who bashed Gordon before the draft.

We see this now with Olynyk, whose post-All Star performance was just a "fluke", and all the people who hated the pick are buying themselves another year.

It's a very low risk position, in the herd.

[byennie]

If I was forced to decide between Vonleh, Gordon and Randle, I choose Gordon.  This is based on watching them each play several games in college, and imagining who "feels" to me like his game is going to work in the NBA.  I don't feel that way with Vonleh or Randle.  I remember watching Indiana game vs. Michigan State this season, watching Payne outplay Vonleh, and wondering why he (Payne) was not getting the attention by the fans.

Payne had 4 points (2-6), 5 boards, 2 turnovers and 4 fouls the only time he played against Indiana as a 23 year-old senior (Vonleh was an 18 year-old freshman). Vonleh wasn't great either (5 points 9 boards), but outplay seems a little strong...