Seriously overrating our players

[LilRip]

yeah, we do and i think a lot of other players on other teams go underrated as well. but that's what fans do.

ironically, i think we also underrate some of our less popular players, such as bass and especially jeff green. a bunch of posters on here are ready to give those 2 away for half a bag of doritos.

[aingeforthree]

There's nothing better than NBA hot stove, and its nice that the Cs have some great assets to bring to the table.  However, in reading a lot of trade proposals, I find that we really tend to overrate our own players. 
I'm a fellow green teamer, don't get me wrong, but we all need to be a little more objective in regards to our own guys value.  My biggest issue is with Sullinger.  While he is a nice player, I find it laughable to think that he is really a valuable "chip" is DA's arsenal.  Maybe it's because we got him so late in his draft class, but to think an overweight 22 year old with a history of back problems is a highly coveted asset is ridiculous.
I'd be curious to see how fans from other teams perceive this player.  I think we all know our biggest chips are the 1st round picks in this draft, and in the years to come.  Lets start to be more honest with ourselves.

Laughable ?

While many might overrate Sullinger, a lot of scouts had this guy easily pin pointed as a top 10 pick just a couple years ago. Some said even top 5. The talent is undeniable, & the only issue was his health. Laugh all you want, but this type of player can easily be paired with a pick to land something of value. He hasn't even sniffed what he can become.

People also laughed at the value of talent like Tony Allen & Gerald Green when they were Sullinger's age. They're not laughing anymore.

What most people underrate, is the war chest of picks Ainge has acquired. Package any of those beauties with any player on this roster & you can still land quality. The plethora of picks are huge in the entire scheme of this rumored trade business.

[Future Celtics Owner]

I think Sullinger deserves to have this offseason to work on his game and come back in shape. I think after that we only play him at pf, so he does not play out of position. Then and only then will we be able to evaluate him with greater accuracy.

[chambers]

OP has joined Celticsblog today. I also noticed he commented on the front page article that he had a friend who was an insider with the Celtics and said a Love deal was done.
Now he says we over rate everyone?
Bulls or T Wolves troll.

My money is on Bulls troll.

[Rondo9]

Let's not call him a troll.....

[clover]

I think we over rate our own players as most fan bases do, but other fan bases also under rate Sullinger immensely.
The kid just turned 22 years old and averages 17 and 10.5 rebounds per game playing out of position.
He's only had the chance to drop weight this off season now that his back is fixed.

Chicago fans are screaming that a package of Gibson, Butler and Mirotic is so much better than our package of Sully, Green,#6 and a future Brooklyn pick(and any other picks we throw in).

The hilarious part is that some Wolves fans that are desperate to 'win now' seem to think Mirotic is the next coming of Dirk Nowitzki when Bulls fans are hoping he'll give them a nice 20 minutes per game off the bench next year if he makes it over.

He does?

[byennie]

There may be better young players than Sully, but ask yourself this: how often do young players better than him actually get traded? Ray Allen went for Delonte West and Jeff Green (who hadn't played a game yet). Melo was traded for Chandler, Gallinari and picks. Al Jefferson is really the only one I can think of, and a 16/11 player with bad defense in his 3rd year isn't exactly head and shoulders above Sully. Better I think yes, but he was the centerpiece for Kevin Garnett after all.

It's all relative, folks... a player like Sullinger has his flaws, but 22 year olds that could give you at least 15/8 tomorrow are among the better assets you can find for your lame duck superstar. Anthony Davis isn't exactly available.

[Eddie20]

I find it hilarious how Bulls' fans overrate Gibson. The guy will be 29 this month and will get paid around 8.5M until 2017.

Sullinger just turned 22 in March and his rookie contract runs until 2016.

By the numbers (Sullinger on the left,Gibson on the right):

MPG - 27.6 - 28.7
FG% - 42.7 - 47.9
FT% - 77.8 - 75.1
PPG - 13.3 - 13.0
RPG - 8.1 - 6.8
APG - 1.6 - 1.1
SPG -  0.5 - 0.5
BPG - 0.5 - 1.4
TOV - 1.6 - 1.8
3's made - 56 - 0

So when comparing the C's and Bulls projected offer to the Wolves:

Sullinger > Gibson...the Wolves are in rebuilding mode so the far younger and far cheaper Sullinger has greater appeal.

#6 pick = Mirotic & #16 pick...this is probably equal value. Mirotic is highly touted, but not as valuable as the #6 in this draft. However, including the #16 makes it even.

#17 pick > # 19 pick...self explanatory

Unknown future pick(s) > Butler...this is hard to project as if it's one of the Nets picks then it's clearly the C's offer. If it's the Clippers pick then I'll favor Butler. However, Butler will be in a contract year this upcoming season, so the Wolves will find themselves in another unenviable (admittedly not as dire as Love) free agent decision. Still, if I'm the Wolves I would prefer the Clippers pick and a future protected C's pick to having to potentially overpay for Butler, who plays one of the easiest positions to fill in the league.

Note:
I didn't include any fillers from either team. Each has players they can send to make salaries match, but none present much, if any, value to the Wolves.

[obnoxiousmime]

I think Celtics fans see Sullinger going 5th in a redraft and start thinking his value is closer to the top 4 (A. Davis, Drummond, Beal, Lillard) of that list than the bottom 5 (Ross, Barnes, Waiters, Henson, T. Jones). The truth is he is somewhere in the middle but there's a gap between those top 4 guys and the rest of the class. He has conditioning problems and a potential back issue as well. Not trying to be negative but that's just what his value is around the league, which is ultimately what matters. Whether or not he is underrated and Celtics fans can see how he's secretly better than the perception is meaningless, unless the T'Wolves happen to feel the same way.

[greg_kite]

I don't know if people are overrating Sully and KO.  Nobody thinks either of them are as good as Big Al was.  The big trade chip we have for a Love trade is clearly the #6 pick.  The multiple first rounders we have coming in the next few years are probably considered better assets than Sully as well.

I see Sully's ceiling as somewhere between what Boozer is now (not his Utah days) and Mareese Speights.  Good enough to start on a stacked team as a role player but definitely not a team centerpiece.  This could maybe change if he went through a Perk like body change but I don't see that happening.

I think Olynyk has a higher ceiling than Sully.  He can play both the 4 and 5 and is a better shooter.  In some ways he's a better defender but he's not going to be any kind of stopper.  Similar to Sully he's not a star  but he could be a bigger role player.  The type of guy that hits big shots and makes big plays but isn't relied upon to do so.  Like the Shane Battier/Derek Fisher type of role player that makes you angry when they get that steal or hit the clutch three.  Though I think his biggest fault right now is his mentality that he shouldn't shoot it every time he gets it.  Once he's more aggressive scoring the ball he could get 16pts, 7 rebounds and 3 assists a game.  Not great but solid.

I wouldn't consider either player untouchable but Olynyk has more value because of his size and shooting ability.  There are more players like Sully that can be had for cheap than there are Olynyk. 

[Chief]

Let's not call him a troll.....

TP!!

[Celtics4ever]

My money is on Bulls troll.

He is an honest one.

[incoherent]

Honestly this post is way out of line.  If you are gonna rip Sullinger at least provide examples as to why you think he has no value.  22 year old 13ppg 8rpg in his rookie season. How is that bad?  Redraft 2012 and Sully goes like 4th or better 

[BballTim]

yeah, we do and i think a lot of other players on other teams go underrated as well. but that's what fans do.

  You follow our players closely and watch them play a lot, so you see all their flaws on a regular basis. You don't see much of players on other teams so you don't know about their flaws. That's why you underrate our players/overrate other players, but that's what fans do.

[celticsfan8591]

I find it hilarious how Bulls' fans overrate Gibson. The guy will be 29 this month and will get paid around 8.5M until 2017.

Sullinger just turned 22 in March and his rookie contract runs until 2016.

By the numbers (Sullinger on the left,Gibson on the right):

MPG - 27.6 - 28.7
FG% - 42.7 - 47.9
FT% - 77.8 - 75.1
PPG - 13.3 - 13.0
RPG - 8.1 - 6.8
APG - 1.6 - 1.1
SPG -  0.5 - 0.5
BPG - 0.5 - 1.4
TOV - 1.6 - 1.8
3's made - 56 - 0

So when comparing the C's and Bulls projected offer to the Wolves:

Sullinger > Gibson...the Wolves are in rebuilding mode so the far younger and far cheaper Sullinger has greater appeal.

#6 pick = Mirotic & #16 pick...this is probably equal value. Mirotic is highly touted, but not as valuable as the #6 in this draft. However, including the #16 makes it even.

#17 pick > # 19 pick...self explanatory

Unknown future pick(s) > Butler...this is hard to project as if it's one of the Nets picks then it's clearly the C's offer. If it's the Clippers pick then I'll favor Butler. However, Butler will be in a contract year this upcoming season, so the Wolves will find themselves in another unenviable (admittedly not as dire as Love) free agent decision. Still, if I'm the Wolves I would prefer the Clippers pick and a future protected C's pick to having to potentially overpay for Butler, who plays one of the easiest positions to fill in the league.

Note:
I didn't include any fillers from either team. Each has players they can send to make salaries match, but none present much, if any, value to the Wolves.

I mostly agree with you but leaving out defense is really unfair to Gibson.  Gibson's one of the best defensive bigs in the league and Sullinger is average at best on that end.  I think Gibson is pretty clearly a better player.  That said, I can see why a rebuilding team would prefer Sullinger.  I think the packages are pretty close in value overall; if you value flexibility the C's offer is better but from a pure talent standpoint you're probably better off with the Bulls'