Doesn't sound like Cuban agrees with kicking sterling out presently

[cb8883]

NBA should force Cuban to sell. Honestly feel like Sterling isn't the only owner that felt this way. Shame on Sterling and Cuban. If Cuban doesn't vote to eject Sterling he should lose his team and his Shark Tank deal. Racism is the worst thing that anyone can have in their heart. If you cannot get past this while having one of the greatest presidents of all time in office, that just happens to be African American then society as a whole has truly not evolved. Any owner that does not vote Sterling out is a racist and should lose their team as a result.

Sterling was racist, Cuban was honest.  Anybody who says that they treat every person the exact same way, regardless of how they look, is lying.

Also, in terms of your last sentence, it just strikes me as strange that you're arguing for tolerance, while at the same time being completely intolerant of anybody else's opposing viewpoint.  While nobody should defend racism, reasonable minds can disagree on whether Sterling's offense rises to one where he should lose his team.  I think the NBA is justified in its actions due to the contracts Sterling signed, and more importantly for the potential damage to the NBA brand.  However, people who disagree with me aren't necessarily, or even likely, racists.

My view point is that no one should defend ignorance. Racism is a pure form of ignorance. Cuban making the comment about Travon should be enough to lose his team in my opinion but he won't. You cannot have tolerance for racists. Discrimination is in this country and people like Sterling and Cuban are the reason it exists still. I also feel that on a social level that anyone who didn't vote for Obama is deep down someone who might not be an open racist but someone who holds tendencies. There is no reason the guy shouldn't at the very least get a third term to clean up Bush and implement health care. There will be books written on him being one of the greatest. I stand behind what I said about Sterling and a lesser extent Cuban.

I think this exemplifies the point Cuban was trying to make.

To those who see everyone the say...good on you.

But the reality is there's a very good chance one or more of your family has opinions that probably aren't right. There is also the fact that minorities are less economically endowed and inclined to commit crimes. The media also reinforces stereotypes.

So while consciously you want to treat everyone the same, most everyone, even the most well educated and respectable, are conditioned a certain way.

I agree to a certain extent but if you are not trying to solve the problem you're becoming part of it. Cuban's documented reluctance to do the right thing and then his Travon comments are not helping.

[Clench123]

NBA should force Cuban to sell. Honestly feel like Sterling isn't the only owner that felt this way. Shame on Sterling and Cuban. If Cuban doesn't vote to eject Sterling he should lose his team and his Shark Tank deal. Racism is the worst thing that anyone can have in their heart. If you cannot get past this while having one of the greatest presidents of all time in office, that just happens to be African American then society as a whole has truly not evolved. Any owner that does not vote Sterling out is a racist and should lose their team as a result.

Obama is one of the greatest presidents of all time?  Ok, dude lol.

Also if the only reason you voted for Obama was because of his skin color, then you might want to look in the mirror yourself.

[Clench123]

NBA should force Cuban to sell. Honestly feel like Sterling isn't the only owner that felt this way. Shame on Sterling and Cuban. If Cuban doesn't vote to eject Sterling he should lose his team and his Shark Tank deal. Racism is the worst thing that anyone can have in their heart. If you cannot get past this while having one of the greatest presidents of all time in office, that just happens to be African American then society as a whole has truly not evolved. Any owner that does not vote Sterling out is a racist and should lose their team as a result.

Sterling was racist, Cuban was honest.  Anybody who says that they treat every person the exact same way, regardless of how they look, is lying.

I hope we aren't blurring the line between preference and racism here.

[Clench123]

Maybe they both are secret members of the KKK...

Oh, I see you were just being sarcastic with your previous post

[Clench123]

I just hate the generalization here.  No, Mark, we are not ALL racists and prejudice.  I think it's an excuse closet racists use in justifying their racist acts and thoughts. 

Secondly, I don't think there is any equivalence between the black guy in a hoodie and a bald white guy with tattoos in the context of race.  If you change sides of the street when you see a bald white guy with tattoos, you probably changed because you're thinking this is probably one tough or crazy or badass or whatever.  Personally, those are my type of dudes.  But if you change streets because you see a black guy in a hoodie on the street, you probably change because you're thinking THEY rob and steal.  Big difference.

I lost a little respect for Mark Cuban here but in his own words, I want to know who the morons are.

lol wow

no words...

Yet you managed to say 3.  What is it about my post that is so outrageous or wrong?

[Roy H.]

NBA should force Cuban to sell. Honestly feel like Sterling isn't the only owner that felt this way. Shame on Sterling and Cuban. If Cuban doesn't vote to eject Sterling he should lose his team and his Shark Tank deal. Racism is the worst thing that anyone can have in their heart. If you cannot get past this while having one of the greatest presidents of all time in office, that just happens to be African American then society as a whole has truly not evolved. Any owner that does not vote Sterling out is a racist and should lose their team as a result.

Sterling was racist, Cuban was honest.  Anybody who says that they treat every person the exact same way, regardless of how they look, is lying.

I hope we aren't blurring the line between preference and racism here.

It's a blurred line, period.

There are black-and-white examples of racism.  Nobody is going to say that Neo-Nazis aren't racist.

However, in the situation Mark Cuban cited, is it racist to cross the street if you're in a city at night and you're approached by a guy who looks like a gang member?  Is it racist if you get nervous when you see a young Muslim guy speaking in Arabic on your plane?  Is it sexist if a woman in a dimly-lit parking garage gets nervous when she sees a male approaching toward her?

Those are blurred lines.  Your brain is certainly making judgments based upon another's characteristics, and is drawing on stereotypes.  You're profiling.  However, that doesn't mean necessarily that it's racism / sexism.

[indeedproceed]

I think it's fairly closed-minded to be scared of a young man who looks to your eyes to be Muslim speaking Arabic on a plane. It's flawed thinking. But I also think lots of people engage in that kind of flawed thinking.

The difference, for me, is that it's bigoted, or racist if the issue pertains to race, to not admit that it's a flaw, and a problem on your end.

Example (hypothetical): I get nervous when black teenagers come into my store, because I irrationally think everyone of them is going to rob me. I know that's wrong, and I'm ashamed of it.

Example (hypothetical): I get nervous when black teenager come into my store because I think every one of them is going to rob me. I know they're not all bad, but stereotypes are there for a reason.

One of these statements is a person's admission of a personality flaw that they wish they didn't have. One that they're hopefully going to work on. One of them is racism thinly disguised as illogical pragmatism or a flawed rationalization.

Actually I lost my point here, but I think it has to do with Marc Cuban?

[Roy H.]

Example (hypothetical): I get nervous when black teenagers come into my store, because I irrationally think everyone of them is going to rob me. I know that's wrong, and I'm ashamed of it.

Example (hypothetical): I get nervous when black teenager come into my store because I think every one of them is going to rob me. I know they're not all bad, but stereotypes are there for a reason.

One of these statements is a person's admission of a personality flaw that they wish they didn't have. One that they're hopefully going to work on. One of them is racism thinly disguised as illogical pragmatism or a flawed rationalization.

Is it a personality flaw for a store owner to be extra diligent in watching a teenage who comes into their store with baggy clothing with lots of pockets, in fear that that teenager will steal?

I think it's perfectly rational for somebody to make judgments based upon risk factors, even while acknowledging that such profiling is imperfect (and is going to be wrong the majority of the time).  I'm not sure that it's something that people need to be ashamed about, or even something that they necessarily need to work on, so long as they understand where that prejudice is coming from, and don't take further racist action.  It's only when you take that next step -- "I don't want teenagers in my store"; "I want that Muslim kicked off this plane"; "Let's stop and frisk that Hispanic"; "I don't want you hanging out with black people" -- that I have a huge issue.

[D.o.s.]

Why do so many people keep treating this as a moral decision by the NBA?  It's a business decision with a moral pretext.  No slippery slope is necessary - if someone threatens the financial well-being of the league by drawing the degree of negative response that Sterling's comments got, they'll be out too.  "But what about this other thing somebody said 10 years ago?"  Didn't get the attention, didn't threaten the business, so no response.

It just happens that racist, sexist, and, increasingly, homophobic statements are a very quick way of drawing that kind of negative response in today's market, far more so than in the past.

So it's not a slippery slope, gravity is just pulling us down this remarkably slick, downward-curved surface at increasing velocity!

Even if the NBA didn't view it as a moral decision (and they've done everything to frame it as a moral decision), it doesn't mean it isn't one.  Whether the sheriff gives over his prisoner to the mob because he sympathizes with their case or because he's afraid for himself, the effect is the same: the mob is validated and empowered.

Whatever you think about Sterling the man, the way his team is being taken from him stinks of Orwell.  A private phone conversation recorded and leaked and a tabloid media holding him up for endless 2-minute hates. The endless piling on and self-righteous denunciations. The thrill of ganging up on a dying old ogre and trampling him. The suspicious glares trained on those who express misgivings - like Cuban.

The ends may have been a long time coming for Sterling, but the means are exposing something far more sinister.

Have you read Orwell?  Because he's pretty concerned about government control, when here we have a collection of 29 rich business owners hanging a 30th out to dry (in that selling an asset for a billion dollars can possibly seen as such) for their own personal benefit.

It is nothing like Orwell.  We have private entities acting in their own self-interest.  Does it suck for Sterling that his bigotry was exposed to the point where others could no longer pretend it didn't exist?  Sure.  That's life.  He's free to say what he wants, and others are free to react how they want, and the NBA is free to favor the reaction of the majority of its sponsors, employees, and customers over Donald Sterling's wishes.  And Cuban is free to vote whichever way he wants.  If he doesn't want to vote Sterling out on freedom of speech grounds, either due to moral conviction or personal protection as an outspoken person, that's his prerogative.  If he thinks that the possible loss of sponsorship is going to hurt his own business, and wants Sterling out for that, even if he feels uncomfortable, that's his prerogative too.

This issue is not complicated.  Donald Sterling said some very offensive things.  The NBA is in danger of losing tens, maybe hundreds, of millions of dollars because of those things.  They are taking an action to prevent the loss of money.  No more, no less.  Certainly some owners were truly offended.  I'd bet Michael Jordan was.  Probably some other owners weren't as much, but don't want to lose the money, because they're not idiots.  There's no persecution of Donald Sterling.  There are fans who say "I don't want my money going there."  There are companies that don't want to be associated with it, so as not to lose those fans as customers.  And there are players who don't want to help a man who's so willing to denigrate them.  It is simply that most people find him revolting, and their dollars are talking.  No laws are being passed.  No one's rounding up the racists.  Orwellian this is not.

Saltlover, you're my hero.

[LooseCannon]

I also feel that on a social level that anyone who didn't vote for Obama is deep down someone who might not be an open racist but someone who holds tendencies.

  No offense, but that's a pretty idiotic comment. It's like saying that anyone who doesn't think Kevin Love is the best player in the nba is a racist. I don't see how anyone could realistically rate Obama's performance any higher than mediocre.

It is as understandable that someone might vote against for Obama for non-racist reasons as it is that someone could rate Obama as an above-average president.  I find both comments idiotic.

[Roy H.]

I also feel that on a social level that anyone who didn't vote for Obama is deep down someone who might not be an open racist but someone who holds tendencies.

  No offense, but that's a pretty idiotic comment. It's like saying that anyone who doesn't think Kevin Love is the best player in the nba is a racist. I don't see how anyone could realistically rate Obama's performance any higher than mediocre.

It is as understandable that someone might vote against for Obama for non-racist reasons as it is that someone could rate Obama as an above-average president.  I find both comments idiotic.

To all:  Let's use a word different than "idiotic", please.

[D.o.s.]

You really think the players stand to lose more than the ownership in a player's strike over something like this? That's sort of laughable.

I find it laughable that you think the players stand to lose less.

The owners are financially well off to the point of not NEEDING the NBA to make their money. The same cannot be said of most NBA players.

A strike would 100% hurt the players more than the owners in the end.

The NBA owners stand much more to lose than the players when it comes to the health of the NBA. The players can find other leagues, which would welcome them with open arms. The owners would watch the NBA collapse, because they don't have a product without the best basketball players in the world. That's my point.

[GreenWarrior]

if the players were to go to another league, would they want to know how the owners in these leagues would have voted in the Sterling case too?

[wdleehi]

I don't think any of the owners are comfortable with this.



They are setting a precedent where something you say can cost you your team. 



How comfortable do you think they are to opening that possibility?  Something you said could be used to force you to sell your business. 






But at the same time, I expect all will vote him out. 

[GreenWarrior]

I don't think any of the owners are comfortable with this.



They are setting a precedent where something you say can cost you your team. 



How comfortable do you think they are to opening that possibility?  Something you said could be used to force you to sell your business. 






But at the same time, I expect all will vote him out.

that is the point Cuban was trying to make.