Poll

Who do you like more between Gordon and Vonleh?

Aaron Gordon
14 (23.7%)
Noah Vonleh
45 (76.3%)

Total Members Voted: 57

Author Topic: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?  (Read 44908 times)

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Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2014, 04:35:06 PM »

Offline erisred

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Gordon is more skilled now, but like everyone is pointing out, Vonleh has a better body for the NBA and is progressing along very nicely.  I don't think Gordon will be as bad some people think, but Noah has to be the pick.
Yep, that's my thinking, too.

I think Vonleh has a lot more upside in the NBA due to his length and just needs time to grow into his body...like most big men.

Gordon isn't awful, but he's a 4 in a 3's body and players like that have a hard time making an impact in the Association.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2014, 04:39:30 PM »

Offline erisred

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Vinleh might be the better player but unless we trim down our PF postion hes gonna be on a team 5 deep at PF.
Vonleh should be able to play 5 in the NBA, and I think you could play Vonleh and Sullinger together. Vonleh has the length and should develop into a rim protector over time which is what the C's need next to either KO or Sully.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #17 on: February 10, 2014, 05:20:54 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Vote me one for Vonleh

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #18 on: February 10, 2014, 06:08:24 PM »

Offline Dog_Lover106

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Who do you like better between Gordon and Vonleh? And why?

This doesn't have to be answered from a Celtic point of view. I just want to know who you think is going to be the better pro player.
I have watched Vonleh play with Mass Rivals and at New Hampton extensively. Great kid, hard worker and very talented, but honestly he is barely 18 years old and he reclassified. He should be graduating from HS right about draft time.

This freshman class hype is turning into something like the MLB draft. I will really be surprised if Danny loads up on 18 and 19 years olds in the coming drafts. There are many upperclassmen far more skilled and NBA ready than the names that keep flying around here. Hope Noah stays in school another year.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2014, 06:57:42 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Gordon isn't awful, but he's a 4 in a 3's body and players like that have a hard time making an impact in the Association.


The thing is, I see more Andrei Kirilenko or Shawn Marion in his game than Michael Beasley or Derrick Williams.  You're right that guys without a defensive position in the NBA tend to struggle.  However, guys who can guard positions 3-5 in a pinch, as it seems Gordon probably can, are almost always valuable.
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Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2014, 07:19:13 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

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Who do you like better between Gordon and Vonleh? And why?

This doesn't have to be answered from a Celtic point of view. I just want to know who you think is going to be the better pro player.
I have watched Vonleh play with Mass Rivals and at New Hampton extensively. Great kid, hard worker and very talented, but honestly he is barely 18 years old and he reclassified. He should be graduating from HS right about draft time.

This freshman class hype is turning into something like the MLB draft. I will really be surprised if Danny loads up on 18 and 19 years olds in the coming drafts. There are many upperclassmen far more skilled and NBA ready than the names that keep flying around here. Hope Noah stays in school another year.

Doubt highly that Vonleh stays in school.

He has risen on many, many mock drafts over the past two months.

Far too much to lose if he doesn't come out.He could get "Sullingered".  Even if he's picked 6 or 7 (I have him at 5) how much can he go up. He sure could fall far more than he could rise.

Kid's probably still growing. Sully/Vonleh sound like the frontcourt of the future.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2014, 07:25:48 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Who do you like better between Gordon and Vonleh? And why?

This doesn't have to be answered from a Celtic point of view. I just want to know who you think is going to be the better pro player.
I have watched Vonleh play with Mass Rivals and at New Hampton extensively. Great kid, hard worker and very talented, but honestly he is barely 18 years old and he reclassified. He should be graduating from HS right about draft time.

This freshman class hype is turning into something like the MLB draft. I will really be surprised if Danny loads up on 18 and 19 years olds in the coming drafts. There are many upperclassmen far more skilled and NBA ready than the names that keep flying around here. Hope Noah stays in school another year.

It's not all about getting guys who are NBA ready.  The plan isn't to be as good as possible next season.  It's about finding guys who will be really good 2, 3, 4, 5 years down the line.

Drafting guys who are 18 or 19 actually tends to work out really well for teams because you maximize the amount of time that the player is under your control while they are in the their athletic prime, which is the 22-28 range.  The youngest players also tend to improve a lot in their first few years because they're still growing, so there's a better chance that the guy you select at the back end of the top 10 turns into a star.
You’ll have to excuse my lengthiness—the reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
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Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2014, 07:34:58 PM »

Offline Tr1boy

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Vonleh has little to no post skills. He has to develop it to be a true PF/C in the NBA.

But even without it, he has decent perimeter game for his size/can shoot the ball and at least can grab defensive rebounds/protect the tim.

Maybe worse case becomes like a Sam Perkins in the nba

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2014, 08:03:11 PM »

Offline Future Celtics Owner

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Noah is less of a risk. In order for Gordon to be effective he will have to play undersized at the 4 or get more skilled at the 3. Vonleh has the length and potential to be an Al Hortford type...possibly better.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #24 on: February 10, 2014, 08:40:00 PM »

Offline Dog_Lover106

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Who do you like better between Gordon and Vonleh? And why?

This doesn't have to be answered from a Celtic point of view. I just want to know who you think is going to be the better pro player.
I have watched Vonleh play with Mass Rivals and at New Hampton extensively. Great kid, hard worker and very talented, but honestly he is barely 18 years old and he reclassified. He should be graduating from HS right about draft time.

This freshman class hype is turning into something like the MLB draft. I will really be surprised if Danny loads up on 18 and 19 years olds in the coming drafts. There are many upperclassmen far more skilled and NBA ready than the names that keep flying around here. Hope Noah stays in school another year.

It's not all about getting guys who are NBA ready.  The plan isn't to be as good as possible next season.  It's about finding guys who will be really good 2, 3, 4, 5 years down the line.

Drafting guys who are 18 or 19 actually tends to work out really well for teams because you maximize the amount of time that the player is under your control while they are in the their athletic prime, which is the 22-28 range.  The youngest players also tend to improve a lot in their first few years because they're still growing, so there's a better chance that the guy you select at the back end of the top 10 turns into a star.
I know Vonleh. You could walk into any gym in the Boston or New Hampshire area and see him play in for the past 3 years. He is a talent, but no way is Noah an impact player in the NBA in two years. 4 or 5 years down the line maybe, but the rookie contract is then up? Rondo may be gone in 4 years or have diminished.

So you want to develop young players who are not ready to play in the NBA now, only to ultimately have to match a restricted offer sheet just to "keep them under your control" when they are ready? This is why Danny took Olynyk and why he had Draymond Green in for two workouts. This is not a Utah Jazz rebuilding plan, I guarantee you.

Bradley was 19 and has developed well, but not an impact player as of yet. Now he will cost 6 to 8 million per to keep "under our control". So the patient and development of a fantastic young prospect may have been wasted.

You have all been told how great the freshman class is. That is the extent of the draft analysis here. People tell you how great these guys are, so you do not take the time to look at two, three year and four players that are better players now and may be better players in the future. Not like the second and third year players are in their thirties or something?

Timing is everything, Indiana has two players that have developed well on the cheap. Accordingly, they are a contender this year. Paul George and Lance Stephenson are making 4 million combined this year and are top twenty five players. Next year those two will cost over 25 million combined. Their window may only this year.

Same at OKC, when all their young talent developed to championship level, Harden and Ibaka had to be resigned. OKC, traded a top ten player in the league, because you cannot afford to have three max players anymore.

If Danny takes two 18 year players in the draft this year, I will say I am wrong. Do not think it will happen.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #25 on: February 10, 2014, 08:52:17 PM »

Offline Spilling Green Dye

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I don't know who Vonleh is, but I'm not impressed with Gordon. 

Do you know how sometimes you watch a few clips and see some troubling things that tell you a lot?  So far that's only happened to me this season with Gordon.  He caught the ball wide open and then proceeded to stare at the ball while doing a simple dribble, took forever to gather, and shot the ball.  The entire play was identical to those people I've seen who almost never play ball and need to stare at it in order to successfully dribble.  That was one of about 4 plays with him.

There seems to be a very big dropoff in talent this draft from the top 4 to the field.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #26 on: February 10, 2014, 09:00:13 PM »

Offline Dog_Lover106

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Who do you like better between Gordon and Vonleh? And why?

This doesn't have to be answered from a Celtic point of view. I just want to know who you think is going to be the better pro player.
I have watched Vonleh play with Mass Rivals and at New Hampton extensively. Great kid, hard worker and very talented, but honestly he is barely 18 years old and he reclassified. He should be graduating from HS right about draft time.

This freshman class hype is turning into something like the MLB draft. I will really be surprised if Danny loads up on 18 and 19 years olds in the coming drafts. There are many upperclassmen far more skilled and NBA ready than the names that keep flying around here. Hope Noah stays in school another year.

Doubt highly that Vonleh stays in school.

He has risen on many, many mock drafts over the past two months.

Far too much to lose if he doesn't come out.He could get "Sullingered".  Even if he's picked 6 or 7 (I have him at 5) how much can he go up. He sure could fall far more than he could rise.

Kid's probably still growing. Sully/Vonleh sound like the frontcourt of the future.
Vonleh has not risen at all, unless you just wait around for "mock drafts" to be revised, as a basis for judging basketball talent. No secret with Noah, he has been a top 5 to 10 national prospect since he was 15 years old.

I saw Roy Williams, Coach K, Calapari and Boeheim at his Mass Rivals games when he was 16. He easily could rise, as he is playing out of position at Indiana and only turned 18 in August.

Right now he is the same age and a better player than Okafor, Turner and Alexander, so he could easily a top pick next year.


Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #27 on: February 10, 2014, 09:15:43 PM »

Offline Dog_Lover106

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I don't know who Vonleh is, but I'm not impressed with Gordon. 

Do you know how sometimes you watch a few clips and see some troubling things that tell you a lot?  So far that's only happened to me this season with Gordon.  He caught the ball wide open and then proceeded to stare at the ball while doing a simple dribble, took forever to gather, and shot the ball.  The entire play was identical to those people I've seen who almost never play ball and need to stare at it in order to successfully dribble.  That was one of about 4 plays with him.

There seems to be a very big dropoff in talent this draft from the top 4 to the field.
Noah Vonleh is from Haverill and played his AAU basketball with the Mass Rivals program for Vin Pastore. Noel, Selden, Carter Williams, Jake Layman played with BABC AAU for Leo Papile.

Vonleh played prep at New Hampton School in New Hampshire with Olivier Hanlan (BC) and Zack Auguste (Notre Dame). Vonleh is now playing his freshman year at IU.

Actually, I think it is a deep draft. IMO, you really need to see these guys play in person, rather than weighing hype and the mock drafts so heavily. Lots of great players this year, even in the second round. I guess I am the only one on this board who thinks that it is the top five that is perhaps overhyped.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #28 on: February 10, 2014, 09:21:03 PM »

Offline green147

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Vonleh all day. I like Gordon a lot. He played Pro-Am ball down the street from me last year in SF, but I'm always worried about tweeners who can't shoot jumpers (just look at Derrick Williams). I hope Gordon does well, but Vonleh is a beast. Chad Ford loves him too and said recently that he could see Vonleh sneaking into the top 5.

Re: Aaron Gordon or Noah Vonleh?
« Reply #29 on: February 10, 2014, 09:29:20 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Noah

Rocks it all day .