Zack Lowe's take on the Crawford/Brooks trade

[Eddie20]

Agreed with everything he said until the last paragraph saying we "downgraded our backup pg spot to phil pressey."

Did he forget about Bayless? Other than that minor knitpick of trade irrelevance he was spot on.

He could be seeing Bayless as a backup 2 though.

[dreamgreen]

Good read. Wish we were able to dump some long term debt in this deal, but what he says makes sense.

[bballee]

I think people are truly underestimating Crawford's role in preventing team chemistry. He is really not a player that makes others want to work harder.

I understand that Bayless is more of a streaky shooter than Crawford. However, I think players with such comparable skillsets sometimes flourish depending more on the environment than the talent they possess. I can't get a few images out of my head of Crawford overreacting to fumbled passes by Humphries and Olynyk this season. The team's decision making at the end of quarters or with the shot clock winding down should improve almost automatically with his departure.

Call me crazy, but I think we are going to be better because of this trade.

I'm with JoJo on this one.  I think that even with his unfamiliarity with the personnel and plays, in one week Bayless has gotten the C's into a more cohesive offense than Crawford.  Also I've enjoyed the ball moving instead of pounded near mid-court through half the shot clock.  Put me in the addition by subtraction crowd, and the team ball emphasis.

[obnoxiousmime]

I guess 2nd rounders are more valuable than they used to be. Also, I misunderstood the trade to be potentially 2 2nd rounders, not 3, so that makes it a little better.

And of course the more picks you have, the better chance you might hit on one. Ainge's track record isn't so great with 2nd rounders though, right? Besides Glen Davis, has there been any success stores? Ryan Gomes was OK. So is E'twaun Moore. Gabe Pruitt, Kris Joseph, Luke Harangody, Orien Greene, Justin Reed, Brandon Hunter, Darius Songaila not so much.

[colincb]

SI also gave us a B+ vs a B- for GS and MIA for this deal:

http://nba.si.com/2014/01/15/jordan-crawford-toney-douglas-trade-grades/

[obnoxiousmime]

I guess 2nd rounders are more valuable than they used to be. Also, I misunderstood the trade to be potentially 2 2nd rounders, not 3, so that makes it a little better.

And of course the more picks you have, the better chance you might hit on one. Ainge's track record isn't so great with 2nd rounders though, right? Besides Glen Davis, has there been any success stores? Ryan Gomes was OK. So is E'twaun Moore. Gabe Pruitt, Kris Joseph, Luke Harangody, Orien Greene, Justin Reed, Brandon Hunter, Darius Songaila not so much.

I forgot about Leon Powe. I wouldn't consider him a bust but he wasn't a big hit either. Managed to play 5 years in the league, at least.

[saltlover]

I guess 2nd rounders are more valuable than they used to be. Also, I misunderstood the trade to be potentially 2 2nd rounders, not 3, so that makes it a little better.

And of course the more picks you have, the better chance you might hit on one. Ainge's track record isn't so great with 2nd rounders though, right? Besides Glen Davis, has there been any success stores? Ryan Gomes was OK. So is E'twaun Moore. Gabe Pruitt, Kris Joseph, Luke Harangody, Orien Greene, Justin Reed, Brandon Hunter, Darius Songaila not so much.

I forgot about Leon Powe. I wouldn't consider him a bust but he wasn't a big hit either. Managed to play 5 years in the league, at least.

Ryan Gomes still is kicking around the NBA.

The important point is most of Ainge's recent second round picks have been in the 50's.  At least one of Philly's will be no worse than about 40, since they'd be a lottery team (as otherwise we'd get their first-rounder).

But I don't expect him to do much than use second-rounders as trade assets, since we have so many firsts.  Maybe the 2015 Philly 2nd rounder, if we don't get their first, but that's it.

[KGs Knee]

I guess 2nd rounders are more valuable than they used to be. Also, I misunderstood the trade to be potentially 2 2nd rounders, not 3, so that makes it a little better.

And of course the more picks you have, the better chance you might hit on one. Ainge's track record isn't so great with 2nd rounders though, right? Besides Glen Davis, has there been any success stores? Ryan Gomes was OK. So is E'twaun Moore. Gabe Pruitt, Kris Joseph, Luke Harangody, Orien Greene, Justin Reed, Brandon Hunter, Darius Songaila not so much.

I forgot about Leon Powe. I wouldn't consider him a bust but he wasn't a big hit either. Managed to play 5 years in the league, at least.

Leon Powe and Glen Davis were both well worth their respective draft positions, if for nothing else, than their combined contributions off the bench during our 2008 title run.

[pearljammer10]

SI also gave us a B+ vs a B- for GS and MIA for this deal:

http://nba.si.com/2014/01/15/jordan-crawford-toney-douglas-trade-grades/

Great read. Seeing those draft picks on paper is pretty wild to look at.

[snively]

I guess 2nd rounders are more valuable than they used to be. Also, I misunderstood the trade to be potentially 2 2nd rounders, not 3, so that makes it a little better.

And of course the more picks you have, the better chance you might hit on one. Ainge's track record isn't so great with 2nd rounders though, right? Besides Glen Davis, has there been any success stores? Ryan Gomes was OK. So is E'twaun Moore. Gabe Pruitt, Kris Joseph, Luke Harangody, Orien Greene, Justin Reed, Brandon Hunter, Darius Songaila not so much.

I forgot about Leon Powe. I wouldn't consider him a bust but he wasn't a big hit either. Managed to play 5 years in the league, at least.

Leon Powe was amazing while he lasted.  One of the best bench players in the league in 08 and 09. 

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

We just keep finding ways to put our players in good situations. FA, play for us and if you don't like it here we won't throw you to a bad spot for you.


Craw and Brooks (especially) are in a good spot, "contending" team and a team that fits what they both do to a T! PP and KG to contenders (I still think they are even with what's gone down so far). Clee to an excellent situation for him. Wow! If I'm any of those players I am happy with what the organization did for me!

[Dog_Lover106]

Figured I'd make this a separate thread as it's somewhat lengthy and I think Lowe explains it perfectly.

The best subplot of my day: Boston fans railing on Twitter that this is a horrible deal. Umm … it’s Jordan Crawford. Do you not think the other 29 teams watch the NBA? Do you think 29 other GMs are Googling “Jordan Crawford,” seeing his Eastern Conference Player of the Week honor, and asking their owner how many first-round picks they might give up for him? Do you think those GMs are unaware Brooks hasn’t been able to get on the floor at all this season for a very bad NBA team?

There was zero chance Boston was getting a first-round pick for Crawford and Brooks. Zero. The Bulls didn’t even get a guaranteed first-round pick for Luol Deng. The Magic didn’t get one for J.J. Redick. Teams are hoarding first-round picks like Ron Swanson hoards his buried gold. And as I’ve noted before, there just aren’t many contenders or even ambitious playoff teams with a massive need at backup point guard. Crawford’s a nice little piece, but he has been very bad for most of his NBA career, and just so-so in this career year.

This is a small bounty for Boston. The second-rounder from Miami is a nice little addition, but the real prize is the first-rounder the Sixers gave Miami two drafts ago in exchange for Arnett Moultrie.

However, this is not an automatic first-rounder, and may end up as a fake first-rounder. It’s lottery-protected in each of the next two seasons, meaning the Sixers keep it if they miss the playoffs. If they miss the postseason both this year (duh) and next, the pick morphs into two second-rounders that would go to Boston.

Never underestimate the horribleness of the Eastern Conference. The Sixers will almost certainly have two lottery picks in this draft — their own and the one they acquired from the Pelicans for Jrue Holiday. That pick is top-five protected, and given New Orleans’s injury issues, it could fall somewhere around no. 8 or no. 9. Nail those picks, get Nerlens Noel healthy, and sign the requisite cap-fodder veterans, and it’s not out of the realm of possibility that Philly crawls into a low-end playoff spot next season — sending Boston a first-rounder in the process.

But Philly isn’t done trading. They’ve amped up their feelers on Thaddeus Young in the last week, per several league sources, and other execs view it as a lock that Evan Turner will be on the block — if he isn’t already. If Philly dumps enough veterans and opts against replacing them next season with equal quality, they could be pretty bad again.

But even three second-rounders is a nice haul for two players Boston wasn’t going to use long-term. Anthony’s $3.8 million deal for next season is the price, and in raw terms, that is more than the combined Year 1 salaries of three second-rounders. But Boston will have a solid chunk of cap space this summer after dumping Courtney Lee, and they could get something like max-level room if they find a taker for Brandon Bass before the trade deadline. Anthony cuts into that space a tad, but the Cs weren’t going to get that Philly pick without Miami (and Anthony) getting involved in the deal.

Using max-level cap space in a straight free-agency signing isn’t really even part of the plan here, anyway. Boston simply wants to remain flexible enough to take in salary via trade while piling up assets. This deal does the job. Teams are valuing second-round picks more highly than ever. They produce cheap players with some upside, and teams can structure their contracts in all kinds of favorable ways outside the rookie scale for first-round picks. Anthony himself will become an expiring contract this season, just another little trade ingredient for the Cs.

Losing Crawford will also make Boston worse this season, increasing their lottery odds. Rajon Rondo will be back soon to take over at point guard, but he’ll be rusty, and Boston just downgraded the backup point guard spot dramatically. Phil Pressey tries hard, but guys who shoot 24 percent and turn the ball over a lot are not exactly helpful NBA players.

This is something very much like a win-win-win, a small-scale move that could carry real meaning down the line for two contenders.

I get there with be no max F/A coming but what about the 10.3 million TPE which expires in July? Really thought after the Lee deal, that Danny was maneuvering to get further under luxury tax threshold so as to use the TPE before July. Would seem that taking on Anthony's player option would make this less likely?

I really do not like this deal. Was happy to move Lee because of the length of his deal, but why immediately take back Anthony's extra year?

I would like to build some upside assets now. Why not seek a young S/G prospect like Austin Rivers, McLemore or any one else still on a rookie deal that might develop? That is what scouts are for, finding the next Jeremy Lamb, Alec Burks or Wes Matthews, even if we have to give up the NJ or LAC pick with a Crawford etc to do it. The NBA is a shooters league more than ever. Look at GSW, Phoenix, Houston and Portland. They all have deep shooters.

My bet would be to find one young player like Rivers, McLemore, Waiters (at least call) that has not yet emerged who might be had for a late first and expiring. That option may be better than anything that you can get at 15 to 25 in the draft this year or next with the NJ or LAC pick. This would be a start and then hope that some size comes with our future picks or through bigger trades. I would love to have a Utah type roster by end of next year.

Even Kendall Marshall would of been worth a look. Lakers are a mess and he is not a shooter, but he is playing 28 minutes a game and averaging 10 and 9. What are we going to do if Rondo has to take it slow or develops some initial pain or swelling suddenly playing starter minutes 3 to 4 days a week? If he takes a few games off, we have 3 guards total, including a free agent and a guy who has been here a week.

Just sick of this dead wood roster of mainly garbage and lots of future conditional draft picks. Yes, great potential in this draft, but other than say Embiid, Randle, Payne, McDermott, Kane, Fair and a few others older guys. I do not see how even the most highly touted freshman will be able contribute much next year.

Can you imagine Vonleh or Gordon trying to match up with Aldridge, Davis, Duncan, Bosh, Dirk, Josh Smith or Love? Wiggins or Parker on Melo, George, Durant, Joe Johnson or Lebron? Not happening next year based on what I have seen.

I am really hoping Danny has some immediate plan for TPE's, expirings and all the draft picks? I would like to go the way of Golden State and get some young shooters first. Rondo will find them and Sullinger can muck in up with rebounding and garbage baskets like David Lee does. Then hope a Embiid, Towns, Okafor or Turner falls in our lap in the next two years.

[Lucky17]

TPE can still be used. The likely scenario has always been either on Draft Night, or during the high days of the FA season in July 2014 to land a FA in a sign and trade scenario.

Kendall Marshall could not have been acquired until Ainge made a deal to lower payroll costs, because the team could not cross the luxury tax threshold. Once the Lee deal happened, things loosened up quite a bit, as today's trade demonstrates. Likely more to come.

[LooseCannon]

I would like to build some upside assets now. Why not seek a young S/G prospect like Austin Rivers, McLemore or any one else still on a rookie deal that might develop? That is what scouts are for, finding the next Jeremy Lamb, Alec Burks or Wes Matthews, even if we have to give up the NJ or LAC pick with a Crawford etc to do it. The NBA is a shooters league more than ever. Look at GSW, Phoenix, Houston and Portland. They all have deep shooters.

Wes Matthews was undrafted, so I'd start scouring the D-League.

Teams generally give more leeway to their own first-round picks so if you are looking for a guy on his rookie deal, you are generally searching for someone whose team has given up on him, not just someone who is not performing.  Someone who is playing badly but still getting the rotation minutes of an 8th or 9th man is usually someone who the team hasn't completely given up on.  Your best bet is to look for a second- or third-year player who is still being assigned to the D-League.

[the_Bird]

On a tangentially-related side note...  if the NBA is really worried about teams tanking for draft positioning, they ought to reconsider "conditional" draft picks such as this.  The NBA doesn't want teams to intentionally lose games to pick up a couple extra ping-pong balls, which I understand.  What Philly has done with this conditional first rounder, though, is to give themselves a HUGE incentive to be the 9th - or 10th-best team in the conference these next two years, not the 8th.  How hard's Philly really going to push to be a fringe-playoff team next year, if it's going to cost them their 1st rounder?