Ray Allen: Kevin and Paul still don't speak to me

[mqtcelticsfan]

There is a difference between the two situations that Ray seems to be missing, and that's how much of a difference a year made. Allen leaving is one of the main things that led to the trade, because our window was officially closed at that point. With Ray on board, maybe we go a little bit further in the playoffs last year and ride out another year. Not that it would have necessarily been the best thing for the franchise, but that's why it was different.

With that said, I don't know why Pierce and KG would be like that to Ray, unless they just never liked him. He was still a huge part of the Celtics while he was here, and he took an opportunity to help a different team win a title. We can go on about how he's a traitor, but that's just us being ridiculous fans.

[BballTim]

"He doesn’t understand" - that's the crux of it. Ray Allen still doesn't understand, after a year and a half, how he betrayed Pierce & KG, and Celtics fans everywhere.

  He also doesn't see that we haven't heard about KG or PP having issues with the other players, coaches and management.

[mgent]

What he means by they were in the same situation is Ainge made it clear to all 3 of them that they were getting traded.  How they left was completely different, but can anybody dispute that they weren't all in the same situation?

Before you inevitably bash Ray in this thread, think about what you would do if given the choice between the possibility of being traded to a lottery team and the guarantee of being on a title-contender.  I personally would take the risk and stay on the Celtics for one last chance at a ring, but I admit my opinion means nothing because I don't have the experience of either situation.

Ray has done absolutely everything he could've done to show remorse and that it was literally "just business, not personal."  He went as far as to tap KG on the shoulder.  There is one thing EVERY basketball player learns as early as the playground, and that's to leave it on the court.  You can hate somebody's guts in the game, but the second the game ends you shake hands and you go back to being best friends.  Life is completely separate from basketball.  One day those 3 will talk again, even if it's not til after KG and Paul retire.

[angryguy77]

Poor ray

[manl_lui]

not surprised, he did betray the team and the fans of Boston. I don't expect them to talk to Ray anytime soon. However, Ray is right, 2008 was a moment they all share. I expect them to talk when all is said and done

[ronaldo943]

Of course Doc talked to you like you are on his team. YOU ARE ON HIS TEAM. It is called the team of traitors. PP and KG were shipped out of town against their will, they went because management wanted them to go. YOU AND DOC, not so much.

Are you upset with management for their egregious breach of loyalty, then?

this is not about management. This thread is about Ray Allen and his refusal to move on.

Lol KG was not shipped against his will.

[action781]

I still disagree with Ray in thinking that there is a difference in being traded and openly choosing another team for less money in the open market.

I don't entirely blame Ray for leaving because of all the trade rumors he was dealing with (i.e. the uncertainty that if he signed there that he'd actually remain there), the loss of his starting position (yes, I realize he woudn't start in Miami either, but there's a difference in playing behind DWade and Avery Bradley), and maybe he really disliked Rondo as has been reported.

And I also don't blame KG and Pierce for not speaking with him.  If one of my close friends quit my rec league team to go join the #1 team in our league, I'd be pretty p---ed off about that.

So I don't blame Ray, I don't blame KG and Pierce.  Neither are wrong, it just is what it is and I still disagree with Ray's attempts to compare the situations.

[RJ87]

What he means by they were in the same situation is Ainge made it clear to all 3 of them that they were getting traded.  How they left was completely different, but can anybody dispute that they weren't all in the same situation?

Before you inevitably bash Ray in this thread, think about what you would do if given the choice between the possibility of being traded to a lottery team and the guarantee of being on a title-contender.  I personally would take the risk and stay on the Celtics for one last chance at a ring, but I admit my opinion means nothing because I don't have the experience of either situation.

Ray has done absolutely everything he could've done to show remorse and that it was literally "just business, not personal."  He went as far as to tap KG on the shoulder.  There is one thing EVERY basketball player learns as early as the playground, and that's to leave it on the court.  You can hate somebody's guts in the game, but the second the game ends you shake hands and you go back to being best friends.  Life is completely separate from basketball.  One day those 3 will talk again, even if it's not til after KG and Paul retire.

I must've watched an entirely different sequence of events.

Ray was offered a no-trade clause. We were actively trying bring Ray back to reload for another run, he chose half the money to go to the team we were trying to beat.

A year later, Danny decided to blow it up and allowed KG and Paul the opportunity to play for a ring. Together at that.

To me, those are two distinctdistinctly different situations with entirely different circumstances.

People can knock Danny and management all they want, but the facts are that they had no obligation to trade Paul and KG to the same team. They could've traded Paul anywhere without consulting him. They didn't and that was a choice. Obviously,  there is some respect and loyalty there or Paul could've ended up on a team like Cleveland, Washington, or Milwaukee simply vying for a playoff berth instead of competing for a championship.

And as far as the "it's business, it's not personal" - you have to think they would've talked to Ray by now if that was true.  I think there were more issues behind the scenes than us fans will ever know about. One thing that constantly comes to mind whenever the Ray Allen issue comes up is how Doc claimed at the time that it was Ray's idea for Avery to stay in the starting lineup but it came out after he left that Ray was really unhappy coming off the bench.

[pokeKingCurtis]

This guy's gotta learn.

Some things should be discussed with Flo Allen, not the media.

This is one of those things.

[Clench123]

After all these time, the guy still haven't got a clue.  I hope he's just playing dumb or something or trying not to face the truth of the situation, because it'll be truly sad for a grown ass man to be this stupid.   

Conscience is something you can't get rid of and it's true that if you convince yourself long enough, you'll start believing your own ****.

I believe every single time Ray open that second shinning case to look at that shinning ring that says "HEAT" on it, he'll be forced to recall how he sold his soul to get.  How he stabbed two good friends in the back, how he turned his back on a franchise that helped him (as he helped it), and how he shat on all Celtics fans. 

Goodluck living with yourself, Judas.

[D.o.s.]

What he means by they were in the same situation is Ainge made it clear to all 3 of them that they were getting traded.  How they left was completely different, but can anybody dispute that they weren't all in the same situation?

Before you inevitably bash Ray in this thread, think about what you would do if given the choice between the possibility of being traded to a lottery team and the guarantee of being on a title-contender.  I personally would take the risk and stay on the Celtics for one last chance at a ring, but I admit my opinion means nothing because I don't have the experience of either situation.

Ray has done absolutely everything he could've done to show remorse and that it was literally "just business, not personal."  He went as far as to tap KG on the shoulder.  There is one thing EVERY basketball player learns as early as the playground, and that's to leave it on the court.  You can hate somebody's guts in the game, but the second the game ends you shake hands and you go back to being best friends.  Life is completely separate from basketball.  One day those 3 will talk again, even if it's not til after KG and Paul retire.

I'd agree with that.

Ray Allen was being dangled in trade talks for almost his entire tenure as a Celtic. I don't hold any ill-will against him as a person for making the decision he made to go to Miami in free agency. It's the same freedom of employment that we all enjoy--if you don't like your job, you are well within your rights to find one that suits you better.

As a Celtics fan, though, I root for him to fail at every basketball related opportunity.

[Rhyso]

Of course Doc talked to you like you are on his team. YOU ARE ON HIS TEAM. It is called the team of traitors. PP and KG were shipped out of town against their will, they went because management wanted them to go. YOU AND DOC, not so much.

Are you upset with management for their egregious breach of loyalty, then?

this is not about management. This thread is about Ray Allen and his refusal to move on.

Lol KG was not shipped against his will.

Maybe "against his will" isn't the correct words for it, but he was definitely pushed out the door as much as someone can be who has a no trade clause.

[Clench123]

What he means by they were in the same situation is Ainge made it clear to all 3 of them that they were getting traded.  How they left was completely different, but can anybody dispute that they weren't all in the same situation?

Before you inevitably bash Ray in this thread, think about what you would do if given the choice between the possibility of being traded to a lottery team and the guarantee of being on a title-contender.  I personally would take the risk and stay on the Celtics for one last chance at a ring, but I admit my opinion means nothing because I don't have the experience of either situation.

Ray has done absolutely everything he could've done to show remorse and that it was literally "just business, not personal."  He went as far as to tap KG on the shoulder.  There is one thing EVERY basketball player learns as early as the playground, and that's to leave it on the court.  You can hate somebody's guts in the game, but the second the game ends you shake hands and you go back to being best friends.  Life is completely separate from basketball.  One day those 3 will talk again, even if it's not til after KG and Paul retire.

I'd agree with that.

Ray Allen was being dangled in trade talks for almost his entire tenure as a Celtic. I don't hold any ill-will against him as a person for making the decision he made to go to Miami in free agency. It's the same freedom of employment that we all enjoy--if you don't like your job, you are well within your rights to find one that suits you better.

As a Celtics fan, though, I root for him to fail at every basketball related opportunity.

I think it's a fallacy and a joke to compare their jobs (or any entertainment job for that matter) to an average joe's job.  Yea, they should be able to enjoy the "freedom" we all enjoy as far as our work goes but their's goes beyond "just a job."  When what you do for a living is displayed in front of the masses and the sole purpose of what you do is to draw all types of reaction from those masses, then you owe it to them and to what you do to do the right thing. 

What he does has a direct impact on people's emotion and that's why people take it personal when role models or people in this line of work messes up.  When you don't do the right thing, you deserve to be criticized for it.  It's an entertainment business, people decides. 

There's this weird thing called courtesy and integrity and Ray crossed it big time here.

He was dangled in trade's talk through his tenure in Boston.  But so was everyone else and that is a fact.  If he wants to know about being dangled in the trade talk, he should ask his nemesis Rondo.  Everyone was on the block.  That is a very weak excuse if you ask me

[D.o.s.]

What he means by they were in the same situation is Ainge made it clear to all 3 of them that they were getting traded.  How they left was completely different, but can anybody dispute that they weren't all in the same situation?

Before you inevitably bash Ray in this thread, think about what you would do if given the choice between the possibility of being traded to a lottery team and the guarantee of being on a title-contender.  I personally would take the risk and stay on the Celtics for one last chance at a ring, but I admit my opinion means nothing because I don't have the experience of either situation.

Ray has done absolutely everything he could've done to show remorse and that it was literally "just business, not personal."  He went as far as to tap KG on the shoulder.  There is one thing EVERY basketball player learns as early as the playground, and that's to leave it on the court.  You can hate somebody's guts in the game, but the second the game ends you shake hands and you go back to being best friends.  Life is completely separate from basketball.  One day those 3 will talk again, even if it's not til after KG and Paul retire.

I'd agree with that.

Ray Allen was being dangled in trade talks for almost his entire tenure as a Celtic. I don't hold any ill-will against him as a person for making the decision he made to go to Miami in free agency. It's the same freedom of employment that we all enjoy--if you don't like your job, you are well within your rights to find one that suits you better.

As a Celtics fan, though, I root for him to fail at every basketball related opportunity.

I think it's a fallacy and a joke to compare their jobs (or any entertainment job for that matter) to an average joe's job.  Yea, they should be able to enjoy the "freedom" we all enjoy as far as our work goes but their's goes beyond "just a job."  When what you do for a living is displayed in front of the masses and the sole purpose of what you do is to draw all types of reaction from those masses, then you owe it to them and to what you do to do the right thing. 

What he does has a direct impact on people's emotion and that's why people take it personal when role models or people in this line of work messes up.  When you don't do the right thing, you deserve to be criticized for it.  It's an entertainment business, people decides. 

There's this weird thing called courtesy and integrity and Ray crossed it big time here.

He was dangled in trade's talk through his tenure in Boston.  But so was everyone else and that is a fact.  If he wants to know about being dangled in the trade talk, he should ask his nemesis Rondo.  Everyone was on the block.  That is a very weak excuse if you ask me

Not a fan of free agency, I take it?

Ray was traded to Memphis for OJ Mayo. Memphis backed out at the eleventh hour--after Ray had already been told he was traded. That's a little bit more concrete than a guy getting floated in rumors.

Anyway, it's for the fans to get emotionally involved in sports teams, not the players. If a player is treated well by an organization, that's icing on the cake. But a job is still a job, no matter how lightly you might take theirs.

Is their livelihood playing a children's game? Yes. Are they in the 99th percentile of people who play a children's game? Yes. Are people at that level of excellence paid commensurately across most professions? Yes. A D-League player makes, what, $15,000 a year? To stretch the analogy--if you've got a room full of Ivy League professors and academic researchers, they're getting paid much more than the kindergarten staff for a reason. Doesn't mean that their job isn't any more or less of one than the other.

[saltlover]

If Ray doesn't sign with Miami do they break up the band?  If Ray stays, Danny doesn't sign-and-trade for Lee.  This gives the C's more trade chips to bring in a pg when Rondo goes down last year, and another ball-handler/scorer in Ray himself.  Furthermore, with a no-trade clause, it's less likely Ainge will ship out the others this offseason as he did, since that's one more veteran, difficult-to-trade contract on his team.  So yes, it's very different.