Why was Jeff Green on the bench late in the 4th?

[jade88]

I thought this was the beginning of the tank fest. Jeff Green was having an awesome night with 25 points, 5 rebs, 2 assists, a steal, and a block.

The game is within a  single point with a little over 5 minutes left and we come back from a time out with Jeff Green on the bench! What in the hell was that about?

That was a game we might have given away imo.


Thoughts on this decision?

[Mr October]

Sneaky tank job. I think Stevens has the green light to experiment with lineups to see how different combinations of players handle the pressure of the 4th quarter.

Then when Toronto has momentum, bring in Green to save a little face with 3-4 minutes to go. Loose by a few points, and add some ping pong balls to the pile.

I have no problem with his. Honestly we/he want to see what these players have in the 4th, and see who can be primed for trades, or developed into keepers.

[slamtheking]

I thought this was the beginning of the tank fest. Jeff Green was having an awesome night with 25 points, 5 rebs, 2 assists, a steal, and a block.

The game is within a  single point with a little over 5 minutes left and we come back from a time out with Jeff Green on the bench! What in the hell was that about?

That was a game we might have given away imo.

Thoughts on this decision?

It was definitely questionable.  probably one of two explanations.
1. he took tips from Doc regarding substitution patterns
2. He saw a leftover policy from Doc's days as coach that all the star players are limited to how many minutes they can play (unless they're old and it's a meaningless game, them play them a lot).   

[Celtics18]

Jeff Green played 20 minutes in the second half.  Coach Stevens had to take him out for a 4 minute rest in the middle of the fourth after riding him hard through the come back late in the third into early in the fourth.

In retrospect, Coach Stevens even admitted that he maybe should have rested him a little earlier so he could bring him back a little earlier.  However, if you are pointing to Jeff Green's minutes last night as an example of a "tank" strategy, you weren't paying very close attention. 

[Fafnir]

Jeff Green had played the entire third quarter and the first 3 and a half minutes of the fourth quarter.

Olynyk came in for him with 8:38 left and Green returned 4 minutes later. The C's went from a 1 point Celtic lead to a 6 point deficit.

So playing Jeff Green 20 minutes out of 24 in the second half is "sneaky tanking" now? Seeing what you want to see, you can't play your players 48 minutes a game.

Edit: Stevens also rested him at a similar point in the second quarter. Just a normal substitution pattern in a loss.

[hpantazo]

Stevens admitted to making a few mistakes himself last night. It's expected, he is still learning on the job as an NBA coach. Hopefully he learns to remove Bass and Lee from the rotation after a few more games too.

[Celtics18]

Stevens admitted to making a few mistakes himself last night. It's expected, he is still learning on the job as an NBA coach. Hopefully he learns to remove Bass and Lee from the rotation after a few more games too.

Huh?  Brandon Bass was one of our most valuable players last night.

[LooseCannon]

Because Stevens is not Tom Thibideau and won't run his players into the ground.

[jade88]

Stevens admitted to making a few mistakes himself last night. It's expected, he is still learning on the job as an NBA coach. Hopefully he learns to remove Bass and Lee from the rotation after a few more games too.

Bass was nothing short of awesome last night. He was like 5/5 from the field last night.

Bass is a very good NBA player.

Courtney Lee is a D League player, and i'm being dead serious. Hate him being on our team and getting minutes. I'd rather watch Marshon.

[jade88]

Jeff Green had played the entire third quarter and the first 3 and a half minutes of the fourth quarter.

Olynyk came in for him with 8:38 left and Green returned 4 minutes later. The C's went from a 1 point Celtic lead to a 6 point deficit.

So playing Jeff Green 20 minutes out of 24 in the second half is "sneaky tanking" now? Seeing what you want to see, you can't play your players 48 minutes a game.

Edit: Stevens also rested him at a similar point in the second quarter. Just a normal substitution pattern in a loss.

I'd rather he rest guys early in the quarter. Bottom line is Green left the game at a very in opportune time.

[Celtics18]

Jeff Green had played the entire third quarter and the first 3 and a half minutes of the fourth quarter.

Olynyk came in for him with 8:38 left and Green returned 4 minutes later. The C's went from a 1 point Celtic lead to a 6 point deficit.

So playing Jeff Green 20 minutes out of 24 in the second half is "sneaky tanking" now? Seeing what you want to see, you can't play your players 48 minutes a game.

Edit: Stevens also rested him at a similar point in the second quarter. Just a normal substitution pattern in a loss.

I'd rather he rest guys early in the quarter. Bottom line is Green left the game at a very in opportune time.

Fair enough.  Stevens might have ridden him too long to start the second half.  He even admitted as much in the post game interview, but I think it completely misses the mark to call it a "tank" strategy.

Stevens was coaching to win.  He may not have done everything right, in retrospect, in his first NBA game, but I have no doubt he was coaching that game to win it. 

[Snakehead]

Jeff Green had played the entire third quarter and the first 3 and a half minutes of the fourth quarter.

Olynyk came in for him with 8:38 left and Green returned 4 minutes later. The C's went from a 1 point Celtic lead to a 6 point deficit.

So playing Jeff Green 20 minutes out of 24 in the second half is "sneaky tanking" now? Seeing what you want to see, you can't play your players 48 minutes a game.

Edit: Stevens also rested him at a similar point in the second quarter. Just a normal substitution pattern in a loss.

I'd rather he rest guys early in the quarter. Bottom line is Green left the game at a very in opportune time.

The argument could be made either way.  It wasn't a tank move, regardless.

Going to be a long year on these boards!

[sed522002]

I don't understand how this is a tank job. Stevens wanted to win that game. In the post game he talked about the whole rest thing. They expended a lot of energy for that comeback and Jeff needed the rest.

The coach sees things that we can't from the tv.

[Mr October]

Jeff Green had played the entire third quarter and the first 3 and a half minutes of the fourth quarter.

Olynyk came in for him with 8:38 left and Green returned 4 minutes later. The C's went from a 1 point Celtic lead to a 6 point deficit.

So playing Jeff Green 20 minutes out of 24 in the second half is "sneaky tanking" now? Seeing what you want to see, you can't play your players 48 minutes a game.

Edit: Stevens also rested him at a similar point in the second quarter. Just a normal substitution pattern in a loss.

We will see if this is just normal substitution experimenting with a new team, or a sneaky way to tank as the season rolls on. Gut instinct after one game had me thinking of the early Doc days and the ol' ML Carr days.

Another example of a sneaky tank move, would be to continue to let Avery Bradley run the offense. It is a legit move, because with Rondo out on a lottery bound team, you might as well keep developing Bradley's skills as a combo guard. Yet at the same time, Bradley is so bad on offense as a point guard that you are already putting your team at a disadvantage. Win-win for the quest for pingpong balls and player development.

And yes Green played a nice minute total. But Stevens should be smart enough to know that you shouldn't play your best player for 15-16 minutes straight, only to sit him the next 4 in the middle of the 4th while the other team goes on a momentum shifting run. He should have subbed him out for a break in the 3rd, and then a smaller one in the 4th.

And when Green or any other young best player on a team gets that hot you might as well play them extra minutes, and take advantage of butting 1-2 minute rest breaks with timeouts and quarter breaks. Then when Green regresses to his more passive mode you can play him just 30 minutes on that night.

Again, it is just one game. We will see how this plays out.

[LooseCannon]

If Green got his rest earlier and the Celtics lose the game, people would be complaining that Stevens short-circuited the team's comeback by sitting Green instead of sticking with what was working.