Why is it that the only solution is "get bad quickly"?
This trade will successfully make us bad and will have a possibility, but NOT a guarantee a franchise player.
That fact that this team will be clean slated completely, that even after we land this franchise player in the draft, we would still be miles away from contending to the point it will take years and this franchise player will not develop properly because he will have no supporting cast, and a ton of expectation and pressure in his shoulders.
We're not even sure if these "assets" can be turned into a very good player, let alone if we're only getting decent players from these "assets", my god...
While it's a possibility that sucking = franchise guy, there is also a possibility that we may not be able to recover from this suckingness (if that's even a word) because we completely gutted the team.
Remember, Duncan had Robinson coming in, Rose had Deng and Noah, Kyrie had Varejao and Jamison. Heck, It'll be great to have a Superstar, but not at the expense of a supporting crew, or he'll end up like Kevin Love. This is what this trade is going to to do to us IMO.
You keep choosing to support your own jaded argument with hypocritical examples.
Duncan was the number one pick.
Kyrie was the number one pick.
Rose was the number one pick.
How do we get the number one pick if we can't get to the lottery? Please explain.
No one is saying we'll 100 % get the number one pick. Or if we do, it will work out. I've put this up three times now. Have you ignored it everytime? If so, please don't ignore it again. It's a list of the last 10 years 2003-13 NBA finals teams.
I'm not saying tanking always works out and you have to be very lucky but if we look at the last 10 years of NBA title winners or teams that made the finals- they got there with one of their 'franchise' players being drafted by their own team during a rebuilding/bottom of the league phase.
examples:
Spurs: Duncan
Lakers: Kobe
Heat: Wade
Celtics: Pierce
Magic: Howard
Cavs: Lebron
Nets: Jason Kidd (one day after the draft for Marbury and the 7th pick), Kneyon Martin
Mavs: Dirk
In fact the only team that didn't have their own lottery draft pick or a trade within 1 day of that years draft is the Pistons. Their break actually came when they traded Grant Hill for Ben Wallace from the Wizards and started to build around him. They got a big break with him and they also nailed the 23rd pick with Tayshaun Prince who was a key piece to that team obviously.
You can't win forever and eventually you have to hang up your shoes and rebuild. There are no key free agents this off season. We basically have to wait two seasons until any are available. At the same time, Rondo is going to be a free agent.
You did not get my point.
My point is even though they had bad records to get those number 1 overall picks, they still have all star or near all star level talent in that team to act as a support system for those #1 picks to make the rebuild transition easier.
Your idea is to basically gut the team to get a higher chance to nab this Superstar. And let's assume we do, what happens now? We are left with him and a bunch of role players for the next few years and the transition from sucking to winning will take a longer because this superstar we drafted does not have at least one legit help, talent wise, moving forward. (see Kevin Love)
The teams those #1 picks landed did not have to gut their team to the bear bones and it worked well for them (Kyrie's is still out though). Can you imagine if the Spurs and Bulls had to trade Robinson, Deng and Noah just land Duncan and Rose. What would those teams be and how would Duncan and Rose turn out without that supporting cast?
All I'm saying is you can be bad, but don't dig yourself in a really big hole that might be hard to get out. Leave some helping hand behind.
The problem is that leaving a helping hand behind lessens your chance of getting the player that all of this was worth doing for.
eg: If the Spurs didn't lose so many games when David Robinson went down, they don't get Duncan. They get a different pick and end up with Keith Van Horn.
If you're going to suck, then fine. Suck, but do it properly.
Your point about getting help for the superstar before he arrives is bogus because you need a superstar either way.
The superstar is more likely to attract guys like Love, Marc Gasol. Shaq went to the Heat because of Wade. Shaq went to the Cavs because of Lebron. Lebron went to the Heat because of Wade. Even the Thunder drafted Durant and then built around him.
You're claiming that Verajao and Jamison are stars?
They are role players. They are interchangeable and completely recplaceable.
Noah and Deng weren't stars when Rose joined. None of them were All Stars.
Having role players in place doesn't make sense because you don't know what pick you'll get until a few months before the actual draft. Even when you know what pick you'll get you don't know who'll be available unless you're number one. The lottery is about drafting the best player available or the most likely to be a superstar (if there is someone like that in the top 5).
What if you need a big man but the best player available is like Shaq and you already have a potential All Star big man on your team? Or if you have Kevin Durant already on the Thunder but you still suck and then the next years pick is Lebron James?
We have guys that will hopefully help if we do land a top 3 pick. Sully, Bradley, Olnyk.
Since you're so against the rebuild or tank, what do you propose? You seem to be the first one to say how terrible it is yet offer no answer as to how this Celtics organization is going to work it's way to another championship.
Again, of that list of NBA finals teams over the last 10 years , 9 of them drafted their own superstar/franchise player and then built around him.
-Robinson left the Spurs but they drafted Parker and Ginobli to complement Duncan.
-Boston had Pierce so they tanked, picked up Al Jeff, Jeff Green with high draft picks, and then went after KG and Ray Allen because they had Pierce in place.
You're digging yourself a hole trying to defend your argument but it doesn't make sense.
Your upset about the fact we have to rebuild and it's a form of denial.
The facts are in front of you and you are ignoring them.
The greatest teams of the past 20 years all drafted their own stars as rookies and built around them.
It's a fact.
Very rarely do teams 'rebuild' without a legitimate superstar in place already.
They have to draft that superstar.
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