Simmons List--Best Point Guard Alive

[D.o.s.]

He calls it a Championship belt, meaning that the title is fluid. Anyway, I think we can all discuss this list, offer throughts, suggestions, and counterarguments (including the inevitable "NO RONDO?!?!?!" outrage) that is sure to come as only Boston fans can dissect Simmons-y things.

1952-60: Bob Cousy
1960-69: Oscar Robertson
1969-72: Walt Frazier
1972-73: Tiny Archibald
1973-74: Walt Frazier
1974-76: Tiny Archibald
1976-77: Pete Maravich5
1977-79: Gus Williams
1979-80: Micheal Ray Richardson6
1980-81: Tiny Archibald
1982-91: Magic Johnson
1991-92: Tim Hardaway
1992-94: John Stockton
1994-96: Penny Hardaway
1996-98: Gary Payton
1998-2004: Jason Kidd
2004-07: Steve Nash
2007-09: Chris Paul
2009-10: Steve Nash
2010-11: Derrick Rose
2011-12: Chris Paul
2012-13: Tony Parker
(http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9399191/legacy-check)


Well? What do we think?
Aside from "NO RONDO?!?!?!" of course.

[SHAQATTACK]

ROndo has alot career left

Most of these guys played a LONG TIME to earn this respect.

If Rondo continues to impress , like KIdd and Stockton did for many years to come , no reason he can't claim some glory in this group.  He needs to rack up more years , as he is not quite CP3 or Rose ...based on his sucky shooting
but if RONDO outlasts these guys and plays for years like KIDD or Parker, Stockton and leaves playing at a high level then ...he'll be right there/

[D.o.s.]

Right, but ins't in possible that because the point guard position is so stacked right now in the NBA Rondo never has a dominant season?

You can replace Rondo with Westbrook, Curry, etc. if that makes you feel better. What do you think Rondo need to do to earn the seasonal title without any question?

[jambr380]

No Thomas on the list? Hard to believe with two straight championships. I get the Magic love, but one or two years of Isaiah would have been appropriate.

...and what's with the extra year of Nash in 09-10?

[lightspeed5]

he wont get it next season because he'll be out until december probably

[D.o.s.]

No Thomas on the list? Hard to believe with two straight championships. I get the Magic love, but one or two years of Isaiah would have been appropriate.

...and what's with the extra year of Nash in 09-10?

That was the year CP3 went down with his knee injury, I think.

[Yogi]

No Thomas on the list? Hard to believe with two straight championships. I get the Magic love, but one or two years of Isaiah would have been appropriate.

...and what's with the extra year of Nash in 09-10?

That was the year CP3 went down with his knee injury, I think.

It's ok.  Bill Simmons is on Bill Simmons worst list makers  alive list for 2013.

[nickagneta]

he wont get it next season because he'll be out until december probably

Rondo has been doing two a days since mid May. All indications publicly have him returning for training camp. can we please stop with the misinformation regarding Rondo missing a half season to whole season because everything reported is to the contrary.

[D.o.s.]

No Thomas on the list? Hard to believe with two straight championships. I get the Magic love, but one or two years of Isaiah would have been appropriate.

...and what's with the extra year of Nash in 09-10?

That was the year CP3 went down with his knee injury, I think.

It's ok.  Bill Simmons is on Bill Simmons worst list makers  alive list for 2013.

Nick, as far as Rondo's knee goes, I'll bet you ten tommy points that, if he comes back for the start of the season, it takes him until January to really look like himself again.

Which is nebulous, sure, but I think we'll both know when it happens.

[CelticG1]

he wont get it next season because he'll be out until december probably

Rondo has been doing two a days since mid May. All indications publicly have him returning for training camp. can we please stop with the misinformation regarding Rondo missing a half season to whole season because everything reported is to the contrary.

Its not crazy to think it may take a little longer or we being him along slower.

I'd be stoked if he was back that early

[Celtics18]

I would have given Rondo '11-'12, but, oh well. 

[nickagneta]

he wont get it next season because he'll be out until december probably

Rondo has been doing two a days since mid May. All indications publicly have him returning for training camp. can we please stop with the misinformation regarding Rondo missing a half season to whole season because everything reported is to the contrary.

Its not crazy to think it may take a little longer or we being him along slower.

I'd be stoked if he was back that early

No I don't think its crazy to expect him to probably not be 100% playoff quality good Rondo right away, but that's a whole lot different than saying he won't be playing for half or all of next year which some people keep stating over and over again despite reports to the contrary.

Its also quite possible(judging by Adrian Peterson's recovery) that he will be in All-NBA form straight from the start of the season. For now Rondo and the C's are saying he will be there for training camp and expect him to be playing to start the season, and I think that's what we should expect.

[RyNye]

He needs to rack up more years , as he is not quite CP3 or Rose ...based on his sucky shooting

Career numbers, here:

Derrick Rose - 46.4% from the field
Chris Paul - 47.3% from the field
Rajon Rondo - 48.1% from the field

Just saying.
It is about time that people put away this Rondo can't shoot thing. Yes, he isn't a 3-point shooter (not that he takes a lot of attempts). And he's a bad free throw shooter. But he is an elite midrange shooter (his shooting splits from around 15feet are second among point guards only to Tony Parker) and he's a good finisher.

[BUTerrier]

Honestly, I think Magic is a no-doubt Hall-of-Famer and probably one of the best players of the 1980s. But to suggest he should get the PG title over Stockton for the later part of the 1980s is silly.

Here's Magic v. Stockton in the 87-88 season: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1988&p2=stockjo01&y2=1988

In 88-89: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1989&p2=stockjo01&y2=1989

In 89-90: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1990&p2=stockjo01&y2=1990

In 90-91: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1991&p2=stockjo01&y2=1991

(And, for debate's sake, Hardaway vs. Stockton in 91-92: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=hardati01&y1=1992&p2=stockjo01&y2=1992)

Was Magic a better PLAYER than Stockton? Overall, yes. But was he a better POINT GUARD? I'd say he wasn't. So he got a bunch more rebounds and scored more points; Stockton got a ton more assists and steals. Stockton led the league in assists in every season from 1987 to 1996, and he averaged over 14 assists per game in the 89-90 and 90-91 seasons.

I'm not trying to claim Stockton can leap over tall mountains, but how does Magic get the PG belt over Stockton for those seasons?

[BballTim]

Honestly, I think Magic is a no-doubt Hall-of-Famer and probably one of the best players of the 1980s. But to suggest he should get the PG title over Stockton for the later part of the 1980s is silly.

Here's Magic v. Stockton in the 87-88 season: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1988&p2=stockjo01&y2=1988

In 88-89: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1989&p2=stockjo01&y2=1989

In 89-90: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1990&p2=stockjo01&y2=1990

In 90-91: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=johnsma02&y1=1991&p2=stockjo01&y2=1991

(And, for debate's sake, Hardaway vs. Stockton in 91-92: http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=hardati01&y1=1992&p2=stockjo01&y2=1992)

Was Magic a better PLAYER than Stockton? Overall, yes. But was he a better POINT GUARD? I'd say he wasn't. So he got a bunch more rebounds and scored more points; Stockton got a ton more assists and steals. Stockton led the league in assists in every season from 1987 to 1996, and he averaged over 14 assists per game in the 89-90 and 90-91 seasons.

I'm not trying to claim Stockton can leap over tall mountains, but how does Magic get the PG belt over Stockton for those seasons?

  Magic was a significantly better point guard than Stockton. If you actually watched the games back then (don't know if you did) you could probably argue that Isiah was better than Stockton as well for much of that time.