Wouldn't you want to tank too with this upcoming 2014 draft class?

[badshar]

Your blind certainty staggers me. You're absolutely sure and it makes you chuckle the notion of Wiggins and Parker not becoming HOF talent? These kids are like,17. Are you that naive? What I wrote isn't even controversial as I see it.

you're being pessimistic. its not a sure thing but its very close to a sure thing. You're right, there were people like sebastian telfair who were supposed to be the next big star, but scouts are getting better and the overall opinion is that these 2 are good.

Fwiw, the last few players I've seen getting hyped as the "next big thing" have all pretty much lived up to the hype.  The first I remember since really deeply following this league was probably Yao Ming in 2001.  Yao had his issues, but in his peak he was averaging 25, 11 and 2.  He was supposed to be "can't miss".  He was a fine player.   LeBron was pegged as a phenom in High school.  He surpassed expectations.   Durant was considered a phenom.  Oden was hyped for his potential and size, but Kevin Durant was considered as "can't miss" as a player can get.  His College Freshman stats were better than pretty much any player ever.    And now Wiggins.  He's the first guy i've seen get this level of praise since Durant, LeBron and Yao.   He would be going #1 straight out of High scool.  This isn't someone they are saying is "raw" and a "prospect with potential"... this is someone they are saying is another "can't miss" superstar prospect.  It seems in the rare instances when the experts find a guy like this... they seem to pan out accordingly.  I will say that since 1997, the players to be labelled as "future superstar can't miss prospects" were Duncan, Yao, LeBron, Durant and now Wiggins.  To be fair, I'll add Oden in there as well. Oden was probably the only one who didn't live up to expectations. 

There are #1 picks every year (Blake Griffin, Anthony Davis, D Rose, Irving, etc) who receive high levels of praise... but none on the level of Duncan, Yao, LeBron, Durant and Wiggins.  Have a little respect for the people scouting these guys. They seem to know what they are doing.

Well you can't really blame Oden for his knees getting injured. We don't know what he could have been had he not gotten injured.

[lightspeed5]

Imagine a Rondo/Wiggins/Jordan fast break.

[Celtics Insider]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

[lightspeed5]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

John Wall had all those issues you mentioned: injury, bad coach, and bad chemistry with teammates, and he's still a very productive star in the league.

Wiggins and Parker would have the same outcome, the only thing those things do is become a obstacle to their ceiling.

[Celtics Insider]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

John Wall had all those issues you mentioned: injury, bad coach, and bad chemistry with teammates, and he's still a very productive star in the league.

You completely missed my entire point. No player is a "sure-thing".

[lightspeed5]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

John Wall had all those issues you mentioned: injury, bad coach, and bad chemistry with teammates, and he's still a very productive star in the league.

You completely missed my entire point. No player is a "sure-thing".

no player except wiggins, lebron, yao, and duncan. 

[lightspeed5]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

John Wall had all those issues you mentioned: injury, bad coach, and bad chemistry with teammates, and he's still a very productive star in the league.

You completely missed my entire point. No player is a "sure-thing".

no player except wiggins, lebron, and yao. 

[hpantazo]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

well, following your logic then, you can say the exact same thing about trading for Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, Lebron James, etc. They can get injured, not get along with a coach, just decide to go on autopilot and collect money, etc.

[Neurotic Guy]

Seems like it would be nice to have 2 or 3 picks in the 2014 draft.  Getting the Clips 1st and then perhaps swinging a Pierce deal to net another would be great. 3 picks (even if 2 are low picks) is nice to have in a talented draft class.  Perhaps a chance to make up for the 2001 debacle. 

[Celtics Insider]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

well, following your logic then, you can say the exact same thing about trading for Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, Lebron James, etc. They can get injured, not get along with a coach, just decide to go on autopilot and collect money, etc.

Except they're seasoned NBA veterans who have proven themselves, not high school players...

[hpantazo]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

well, following your logic then, you can say the exact same thing about trading for Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, Lebron James, etc. They can get injured, not get along with a coach, just decide to go on autopilot and collect money, etc.

Except they're seasoned NBA veterans who have proven themselves, not high school players...

does that mean that they are immune to injury, arguments with coaches and teammates, and flat out coasting?

If anything, they are more likely to break down physically, be stubborn with coaches and teammates, and be happy with what they've already accomplished.

Few examples: Tracy McCgrady, Vince Carter, Grant Hill, Bernard King, Jermaine Oneal (he was a legit top young center at one point) Yao Ming, Sheed, the list can go on

Heck, even Dwight Howard, back injury, flip-floping on organizations, and never taking blame or showing leadership

[Celtics Insider]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

well, following your logic then, you can say the exact same thing about trading for Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, Lebron James, etc. They can get injured, not get along with a coach, just decide to go on autopilot and collect money, etc.

Except they're seasoned NBA veterans who have proven themselves, not high school players...

does that mean that they are immune to injury, arguments with coaches and teammates, and flat out coasting?

If anything, they are more likely to break down physically, be stubborn with coaches and teammates, and be happy with what they've already accomplished.

Few examples: Tracy McCgrady, Vince Carter, Grant Hill, Bernard King, Jermaine Oneal (he was a legit top young center at one point) Yao Ming, Sheed, the list can go on

Heck, even Dwight Howard, back injury, flip-floping on organizations, and never taking blame or showing leadership

You are being ridiculous. High school players are not on the same level as NBA veterans until they prove otherwise by playing in the NBA.

Here's Wiggins' NBA resume:

-Played well in high school
-....
-....
-???
-...

[hpantazo]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

well, following your logic then, you can say the exact same thing about trading for Chris Paul, Dwight Howard, Lebron James, etc. They can get injured, not get along with a coach, just decide to go on autopilot and collect money, etc.

Except they're seasoned NBA veterans who have proven themselves, not high school players...

does that mean that they are immune to injury, arguments with coaches and teammates, and flat out coasting?

If anything, they are more likely to break down physically, be stubborn with coaches and teammates, and be happy with what they've already accomplished.

Few examples: Tracy McCgrady, Vince Carter, Grant Hill, Bernard King, Jermaine Oneal (he was a legit top young center at one point) Yao Ming, Sheed, the list can go on

Heck, even Dwight Howard, back injury, flip-floping on organizations, and never taking blame or showing leadership

You are being ridiculous. High school players are not on the same level as NBA veterans until they prove otherwise by playing in the NBA.

Here's Wiggins' NBA resume:

-Played well in high school
-....
-....
-???
-...

Lebron or KG or Kobe before coming to the NBA...

played well in high school

What's your point? Talent is talent.

[Smartacus]

Just because there's a high chance that he'll be a star doesn't mean he WILL be (Wiggins).

For all you know, he'll come in, shoot .350% from the field and average 4 PPG in 35 minutes. You just never know.

That's not at all likely.  That's not giving enough credit to the basketball experts watching these guys.  This isn't a common thing when they say someone is a phenom.  They aren't just making this stuff up.   Barring major injury or drug problems, there's no way Wiggins comes in and averages 4 ppg in 35 minutes on 35% shooting.

Okay, you can maintain that irrational belief. I'll save my judgement on him until he actually produces in the NBA.

You cannot seriously believe that ANYONE knows what the future holds for ANY player. Just educated guesses.

everyone knew Lebron would be great, Tim Duncan would be great, Shaq would be great, KG would be great, etc. Sure, there are always unkowns in the draft, but once in a while there are sure things, and the 2014 draft has 2 of them.

No one is a "sure-thing". Anything can happen that can change any player's circumstances and turn their career for the better or worse. Maybe an injury. Maybe a bad coach/GM/owner. Maybe bad chemistry with their teammates. Maybe the media attention and hype gets to their heads. Maybe they have a bad stretch and have a big mental lapse. You just never know. Nothing is absolute.

John Wall had all those issues you mentioned: injury, bad coach, and bad chemistry with teammates, and he's still a very productive star in the league.

You completely missed my entire point. No player is a "sure-thing".

Ya know you've thrown out a lot of STRONG critisiques this thread yet no offer no SOLUTIONS. Do you want to be signing MEDIOCRE vets and end up in the eighth seed doldrums?

You can put your head in the sand and pretend that their isn't franchse claiber talent heading into the NBA a year from now.  The rest of us will evaluate players based on talent and the potential to lead us to championships rather than what they've done on crappy nba bottom feeder teams.

[hpantazo]

Yea, I can understand the argument against tanking for moral/ethical reasons, I certainly can appreciate that, but denying that the 2014 draft has a lot of talent is just not smart imo.