Why are we even debating rebuilding?

[ctrey]

As Bill Parcells famously said "You are what you are". We were one game over .500 for the regular season and we lost in the first round of the playoffs. Yes, it was a valiant fight and we certainly took a beating with injuries.

Even when we had Rondo and the rest we were actually under .500. This team was mediocre last year and there is no denying it.

Now I know that one cannot just wave a wand to rebuild this team. However if there is a year to end up in the lottery 2014 is it. The draft will easily be ten players deep. So even if you do not end up number one you will have a great crack at an outstanding player.

Additionally I think we actually owe it to Pierce and KG to send them somewhere they could have a fighting chance for another ring. Yes, it will be awful to see them depart but I think that if we are honest with ourselves there is no way we will be competing for a title with the two of them on our team alone and there is no realistic way to get them legitimate help. Honestly neither of them should be playing more than 25 to 30 minutes a game and we need more of them than they can give at this point. On teams closer to a title however they could be the difference.

To me the way forward is clear. We are not winning a title with this team and without trading both KG and Pierce we stay in the horrible middle of the road area in the NBA. Just good enough to squeak into the playoffs but not good enough to win. Also not bad enough to get the kind of draft picks that really can turn you around. I would like to think we could attract top flight free agents but there is no evidence that is the case. The Celtics must build through the draft and trades. It is the best way forward.

It was a pleasure to watch this team fight like they did this year. However the party is over and it is time to move on. Pierce and KG can not win here now. They should be moved somewhere they can help get one more ring. There is no shame or loss in that. It is the right thing to do. For both of them and the organization.

[bfrombleacher]

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=64659.msg1464278;topicseen

This thing has the forum split just about down the middle.

Neither side can convince anyone from the other side that they're right (although the LarBrd33 2014 Draft thread was pretty interesting and looked like it was going somewhere, neither side conceded).

[kgainez]

with the way GSW, the Bulls, and the Pacers are playing, I'm looking forward to leaving this team to the younger guys. Doesn't have to be a full rebuild, get some good pieces for kg and or pp and keep rondo, green, ab, sully.

mmm
and possibly a new coach lol

[LGC88]

Too many bad contracts right now.
Keeping it together, let JG AB and JS learn from KG and PP next season and let them play more than the vets. Hopefully we won't make the playoff and have a chance to heat the 8-10th draft pick. The year after that, you can compete for many years. No need to blow it off. Besides, Boston need to sell tickets and number  5 & 34 jerseys.

[Celtics4ever]

This thing has the forum split just about down the middle.

We all know this is how Ainge makes his decisions by visiting Celtic's Blog and seeing what we think.

We are not going to contend next year, period.  KG is having an extensive surgery on his ankles.  You can only go to the well so many times.   I think PP has earned to do what he wants.

Too many bad contracts right now.
Keeping it together, let JG AB and JS learn from KG and PP next season and let them play more than the vets. Hopefully we won't make the playoff and have a chance to heat the 8-10th draft pick. The year after that, you can compete for many years. No need to blow it off. Besides, Boston need to sell tickets and number  5 & 34 jerseys.

I doubt it will be this easily.   Usually rebuilds are long and take a long time.  I do think we are in better shape than we were when Bird, McHale and Parrish left.   Though we don't have a Reggie Lewis level player, Jeff Green shows some potential in that regard.   Rondo is a better guard than any of those teams had and Sully is a promising big so it may not be as bad.  I always liked watching Rondo and I like Jeff Green as well.  Rondo has potential for an awesome pass and you never know when Green will throw it down.   I think they need a reliable shooter to spread the floor and a big center who can board.  I do not know if they will win anything but they will be fun to watch.  But I even enjoyed watching Perk, Gomes and Jefferson play for us.

[clover]

This thing has the forum split just about down the middle.

We all know this is how Ainge makes his decisions by visiting Celtic's Blog and seeing what we think.

We are not going to contend next year, period.  KG is having an extensive surgery on his ankles.  You can only go to the well so many times.   I think PP has earned to do what he wants.

Too many bad contracts right now.
Keeping it together, let JG AB and JS learn from KG and PP next season and let them play more than the vets. Hopefully we won't make the playoff and have a chance to heat the 8-10th draft pick. The year after that, you can compete for many years. No need to blow it off. Besides, Boston need to sell tickets and number  5 & 34 jerseys.

I doubt it will be this easily.   Usually rebuilds are long and take a long time.  I do think we are in better shape than we were when Bird, McHale and Parrish left.   Though we don't have a Reggie Lewis level player, Jeff Green shows some potential in that regard.   Rondo is a better guard than any of those teams had and Sully is a promising big so it may not be as bad.  I always liked watching Rondo and I like Jeff Green as well.  Rondo has potential for an awesome pass and you never know when Green will throw it down.   I think they need a reliable shooter to spread the floor and a big center who can board.  I do not know if they will win anything but they will be fun to watch.  But I even enjoyed watching Perk, Gomes and Jefferson play for us.

I don't see how any player can have earned the option to decide in an option year whether he comes back as a declining, $15M bench player.

But I can enjoy an earnest rebuilding period.

[celtics2]

The Celtics will not rebuild. Their story is an old one. One practiced over and over again. The same crew will be back for sure. So keep the crying towels and ref complaints handy. This is Boston at it's best. No regards for the fan. They brag about tradition but mock it behind closed doors. Keep the gurneys, crutches and canes at the ready and a home for the wayward. Doc will continue to manage this crew. Who else would want to? Who else would listen to him?

[BballTim]

The Celtics will not rebuild. Their story is an old one. One practiced over and over again. The same crew will be back for sure. So keep the crying towels and ref complaints handy. This is Boston at it's best. No regards for the fan. They brag about tradition but mock it behind closed doors. Keep the gurneys, crutches and canes at the ready and a home for the wayward. Doc will continue to manage this crew. Who else would want to? Who else would listen to him?

  So they owe it to the fans to suck instead of trying to win?

[BASS_THUMPER]

hard to let go

[pearljammer10]

hard to let go

Without question. Especially when Pierce averaged 19, 6 and 5 this year shooting a big below his career average from the field and above it from behind the three line.

[slamtheking]

there really isn't much debate.  for a full rebuild, Danny really has to jettison the mediocre players we have tied up for another 2 years: JET, Bass, Lee, AB. If they're kept here (and I don't see Danny finding any takers this offseason), they're just good enough to keep us from falling too far into the lottery, if at all, even if PP and KG are gone.

since Danny gambled by locking this crew up for a 3-year stint, he's pretty much locked in at least until after next year when these guys become expiring deals and he might be able to move them. 

I don't see a rebuild as really feasible in time for the 2014 draft but possibly for 2015 assuming the underperformers can be moved out. The 2015 draft (at this point) figures to be pretty decent as good players realize they'll slide too far in 2014 and go back to school for another year to improve their position.

[wdleehi]

It is not so simple.



Most trades I hear for KG or Pierce ends up being a collection of role players, many overpayed. 


Either the Celtics get a strong building block, cheap talent with an expiring contract or sit on the big name players.




I still think the best way forward is work to move the role players.  Set the team up with Rondo, young cheap talent and cap flexibility when Pierce and KG retire. 

[Moranis]

I still think the best way forward is work to move the role players.  Set the team up with Rondo, young cheap talent and cap flexibility when Pierce and KG retire.

and how is that supposed to happen.  Ainge can't move those guys this summer unless he takes on a worse contract or includes value. 

[BballTim]

I still think the best way forward is work to move the role players.  Set the team up with Rondo, young cheap talent and cap flexibility when Pierce and KG retire.

and how is that supposed to happen.  Ainge can't move those guys this summer unless he takes on a worse contract or includes value.

  I don't think he's trying to move them but it's hard to imagine that he'd have trouble moving Lee. It's hard to say with Bass, his contract going forward is much less than Baby got from Orlando, so it's not impossible that some team would bite.

[wdleehi]

I still think the best way forward is work to move the role players.  Set the team up with Rondo, young cheap talent and cap flexibility when Pierce and KG retire.

and how is that supposed to happen.  Ainge can't move those guys this summer unless he takes on a worse contract or includes value.

Never said it would be easy.  The team has to be patient.