Do You Think Jeff Green Can Still Be Better,.. Or Just Trade Him For Josh Smith?

[LooseCannon]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

[CelticConcourse]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

I like Jeff because he still leads the league in awesomeness by a considerable margin. Josh Smith isn't even close, in my favorite stat.

[KGs Knee]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

I like Jeff because he still leads the league in awesomeness by a considerable margin. Josh Smith isn't even close, in my favorite stat.

Lol..at least you're honest about it 

[LooseCannon]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

I like Jeff because he still leads the league in awesomeness by a considerable margin. Josh Smith isn't even close, in my favorite stat.

Is there a top ten ranking for that stat I can peruse?

[Atzar]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

That's pretty surprising to me.  I think the main advantage that WS has over PER is its improved emphasis on defense, but I consider Smith to be a better defender than Green.  I might have to dig into that a little bit later.

[Fafnir]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

Negative offensive win shares. For their career their offensive win shares are pretty similar.

[indeedproceed]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Only gives him negative win shares offensively. Anyway you cut it, it was an off-year for Smith in general.

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

Wrong, I like WS better, but I like Smith between the two players. Offensively he's had a bit of a rough year, especially with his FT shooting and 3pt shooting (as in he should take less 3's), but defensively he remained solid. It leads me to believe this is a role issue, not a performance issue.

[indeedproceed]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

That's pretty surprising to me.  I think the main advantage that WS has over PER is its improved emphasis on defense, but I consider Smith to be a better defender than Green.  I might have to dig into that a little bit later.

Winshares for the year:
Smith: 4.3
Green: 4.7

DefWS:
Smith: 4.5
Green: 2.8

Your prior assumptions are correct.

[Atzar]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

That's pretty surprising to me.  I think the main advantage that WS has over PER is its improved emphasis on defense, but I consider Smith to be a better defender than Green.  I might have to dig into that a little bit later.

Winshares for the year:
Smith: 4.3
Green: 4.7

DefWS:
Smith: 4.5
Green: 2.8

Your prior assumptions are correct.

That makes sense.  Thanks for the clarification. 

[nickagneta]

Neither player is a number one scoring option, both are probably best suited with a pass first PG that can set them up or defer to the number 1 option.

Where I think the biggest difference between the two is that Smith is demonstrably better at rebounding, defense, and having a proven ability to play well in the playoffs. I hate to say it but those areas, to me, have always been effort and toughness stats.

I think Smith has at times "Antoine Walker" disease with his shot selection but his defense, rebounding and ability to show when it matters most makes him preferable to have on this team than Green.

But I honestly, don't want either player on this team. Trade Green but for someone better than Smith.

[LooseCannon]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

Negative offensive win shares. For their career their offensive win shares are pretty similar.

Yeah, that's that I meant to type, obviously.  One of the criticisms of PER is that it rewards players who jack up a lot of bad shots.  Jeff Green is never going to be your #1 scorer type because he is never going to willingly take a lot of bad shots.  Paul Pierce is a guy who would if he saw no better way, but has the self control to avoid doing so on a regular basis when there are better ways to play. 

I think putting Josh Smith on a team where he is the highest-paid player would be giving him the green light to shoot whenever he feels like it, so I expect him to score more points at a less efficient rate.  If you think his defense is good enough to compensate for that, then go ahead and give him a max contract, but I have my doubts.

[KGs Knee]

PER rates Josh Smith higher.  WS rates Jeff Green higher (and, in fact, gives Josh Smith negative win shares).

Who you like better as a player is probably related to which stat, PER or win shares, you like better.

That's pretty surprising to me.  I think the main advantage that WS has over PER is its improved emphasis on defense, but I consider Smith to be a better defender than Green.  I might have to dig into that a little bit later.

Winshares for the year:
Smith: 4.3
Green: 4.7

DefWS:
Smith: 4.5
Green: 2.8

Your prior assumptions are correct.

This confirms my belief Smith is the superior player.  His defensive WS is noticeably better.  Put Smith in an offensive role that suits him, and his offensive numbers would likely return to his career averages, or possibly even improve.

Not sure I'd trade Green for Smith, when factoring in the money difference, though.  Didn't feel that way earlier in the year.

[LooseCannon]

If the Celtics acquire Josh Smith, can we look forward to Doc Rivers playing him as the center in a smallball lineup?  If you find that idea abhorrent, do you count that as a reason against trying to acquire Smith?

[SHAQATTACK]

If the Celtics acquire Josh Smith, can we look forward to Doc Rivers playing him as the center in a smallball lineup?  If you find that idea abhorrent, do you count that as a reason against trying to acquire Smith?

I was hesitant to say it , but  now that you have brought it up , this is the main reason I don't want Josh Smith .  I'm scared Doc will do exactly this , huge money wasted and still not have a true center....

If the Celtics get a really good BIG , and want Smith at the 4 then thats cool.   

No more small ball .

[Who]

If the Celtics acquire Josh Smith, can we look forward to Doc Rivers playing him as the center in a smallball lineup?  If you find that idea abhorrent, do you count that as a reason against trying to acquire Smith?

Atlanta used Josh Smith as the center position quite a bit last season while Al Horford was out and a small bit this season too. It's not an ideal option but it is workable.

I expect Doc would be willing to use Smith there at times if the Celtics had a lack of quality alternatives at the five spot. I don't think Doc would do so otherwise.