The latest on Ray's "reasons" for leaving from Jackie MacMullan

[BballTim]

If pierce had gone to New Jersey, they'd have Deron/Joe/Pierce/Hump/Lopez

They'd be better overall.

That's true. And the Celtics would not have made it to Game 7 of the ECF last year, and wouldn't be as good this year.

Who would have been the pick at #6? Actually, KG might well have retired or signed elsewhere.

That's all true. Probably would've been Drummond.

Call me CRAAAAAZY, but for a number of reasons, I'd actually bite on trading Pierce for Drummond right now.

#1 - Boston's roster is flawed.  We have 4 shooting guards, we're paying a starting SF to come off the bench, a 37 year old PF and a couple mediocre bigs in Sullinger and Bass.  I'd love a legit center prospect.

#2 - When it comes to raw center prospects, there's not much better than Drummond.  Total physical freak...6-10 270 pounds of pure raw athleticm.  Only 19 years old. 

#3 - He's actually already showing signs in Preseason.  16 MPG he's averaged 8.4 points, 5.3 rebounds, 1.3 blocks with 61% shooting.  In the one game he got 25 minutes, he put up 19, 10 and 2.  Huge prospect right there.

#4 - At the time it would have been about shedding massive amounts of salary.  For the sake of argument, trading Pierce (16.7 mil this year) for Drummond (2.3 mil this year) saves us 14 mil.  Doesn't really matter at this point, because of the Terry, Bass and Green contracts... so not like it would put us under the cap to make a run at Josh Smith in this upcoming offseason. Still. 

#5 - We are already paying Jeff Green starters money... might as well start him at his natural SF position. 

#6 - Pierce is 35 years old.  If the idea was the rebuild around Rondo, getting a 19 year old big man prospect makes a bit of sense. 

PG - Rondo (26), SG - Bradley (21), SF - Green (26), PF - Sullinger (20) and C - Drummond (19) would be a nice foundation for a rebuild.

  Every roster in the nba is at least somewhat flawed. You don't trade a shot at a title for a prospect in order to have a better core in the future unless the prospect is a can't miss superstar.

[crimson_stallion]

True... we theoretically came close to making the finals until LeBron took over...

But this year isn't last year. And Pierce isn't getting any younger.  WE've been beaten by Miami two years in a row.  I wouldn't feel too bad prepping for the future.  And like I said, Jeff Green can start at SF.  We are already paying him like a starter.

You're right, this year isn't last year.

1. Paul Pierce isn't playing on a hurt MCL
2. We don't have a 37 year old Ray playing >30 mins on bone spurs
3. Jeff Green is not out due to heart surgery
4. Chris Wilcox is not out due to heart surgery
5. Our best player off the bench isn't an injured M Pietrus
6. Our top backup guards are not Marquis, E'twaun and Dooling
7. Our top backup big man is not Ryan Hollins

[MBunge]

Not sure what some people's obsession is here with trading away a winning team for young talent that require 3 or 4 years of development to be competitive NBA players.

Rebuilding sucks. Losing games sucks.

It's the "fantasization" of sports.  It's not enough to watch the games.  Everybody's got to play GM.

Mike

[celticinorlando]

ray wanted the ball more. Ray's beef is with Doc more than anyone. Doc saw that he could not defend anymore.

Ray Allen left because he was benched and b/c he was not getting all the shots he wanted.

It says he didn't go to the heat to get back at boston but that is utter BS. He knows what he is doing.

I think signing Ray would have been a nice little ending but I am 100 percent sure Doc didn't want him back. And guess what...Boston is better without him

[MBunge]

  Minutes were an issue, and so was his lack of touches.

And in the real world, Ray averaged about 34 minutes and got nearly 11 shots a game.  True, he was playing a smaller role in the offense, but that was clearly because he just wasn't getting it done on the court.

Mike

[Fafnir]

  Minutes were an issue, and so was his lack of touches.

And in the real world, Ray averaged about 34 minutes and got nearly 11 shots a game.  True, he was playing a smaller role in the offense, but that was clearly because he just wasn't getting it done on the court.

Mike

Combine that with not liking your PG/Coach much as a result of this (can't be your fault at least not entirely that's not how humans work) and the GM trying to trade you for 3 years straight I can understand how he came to his decision.

[MBunge]

  Minutes were an issue, and so was his lack of touches.

And in the real world, Ray averaged about 34 minutes and got nearly 11 shots a game.  True, he was playing a smaller role in the offense, but that was clearly because he just wasn't getting it done on the court.

Mike

Combine that with not liking your PG/Coach much as a result of this (can't be your fault at least not entirely that's not how humans work) and the GM trying to trade you for 3 years straight I can understand how he came to his decision.

Decision to leave?  Sure.  To leave for less money and fewer minutes with the team that's just beaten you in the playoffs for the last 2 years?  No.

Mike

[edwardjkasche]

Ray just sounds more and more like an insecure child.

He's whining like he got traded from a contender to a lottery team, when in fact he chose to go from one contender to another.  We don't need to know his reasons for leaving.  He left.  Good riddance.  Moving on with Terry, Lee, and Bradley.

He sounds like he would have went to whichever team kissed his butt the most.  Last time he was a free agent he says the entire organization contacted him to come back.  This time, "only" KG, Pierce, and Ainge did.  Wow!  "Only" two future HOFs and your GM. 

You know what's most telling about all his talking?  If he was truly happy and excited to be in Miami, all he would be talking about are his new teammates, his new role, and his new organization.  Alas, he's not.  He can't stop talking about them Celtics.

[csfansince60s]

Ray just sounds more and more like an insecure child.


You know what's most telling about all his talking?  If he was truly happy and excited to be in Miami, all he would be talking about are his new teammates, his new role, and his new organization.  Alas, he's not.  He can't stop talking about them Celtics.

+1....spoiled child is more like it, and spot on with that last paragraph

[bdm860]

Ray just sounds more and more like an insecure child.


You know what's most telling about all his talking?  If he was truly happy and excited to be in Miami, all he would be talking about are his new teammates, his new role, and his new organization.  Alas, he's not.  He can't stop talking about them Celtics.

+1....spoiled child is more like it, and spot on with that last paragraph

Eh, I disagree. 

1.  Reporters and interviewers are asking him questions about Boston.  It's not like he's just going on twitter or posting youtube videos just saying this stuff.

2.  It's not an all-or-nothing situation.  I've moved, I've switched jobs, I've dated different people.  You can be happy where you're at, and still talk about the past.  I have no problem reminiscing about old jobs/co-workers/girlfriends, whether they're fond memories or bitter ones.  I imagine most of us are the same way.  Actually I've ate lunch with a co-worker every day this week, and every day one of us said "when I used to work at..." or "at my old job...".  It's ok to talk about your past jobs.

3.  Here's Garnett talking about Minnesota, is this really that different?
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1125227-kevin-garnett-bad-mouths-the-minnesota-timberwolves-why

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/story/2012-03-30/kevin-love-minnesota-timberwolves/53903356/1

Man this sounds pretty similar to Ray:

Timberwolves executives were unhappy with Garnett's demeanor behind the scenes and Garnett seethed over a perceived lack of loyalty from the organization,

So Garnett says I have nothing good to say, while Ray says why he was unhappy.  Not that much of a difference.

People continually asked Shaq and Kobe about their feud, years after the fact. Didn't mean they weren't over each other.

[Interceptor]

Finally some confirmation about the no-trade clause. I had my doubts that it was in the table, which in some regards is why I defended Ray Allen for leaving (never defended on how he left, he's always been dead to me).

Indeed. Where are the Allen apologists to comment on this one? There's no longer any doubt that this was on the table, you can't call it an "unsourced rumor" anymore now that Ainge has confirmed it directly (although Wyc already hinted at it before).

Allen has steadily looked worse and worse from the day the news broke. Money argument: gone. He took less from Miami. Trade argument: gone. We know that was a no-trade, not a trade kicker or somesuch. Argument that it was a rift between Allen and the org: gone. None of his old teammates support him at all, to a man, beyond the usual platitudes.

It was his ego. Scumbag Ray Allen.

[CelticHooligan3]

A longer version of the article:

"Ray plays down the rift
Despite departure and a recent war of words, he says he'll always be a Celtic"

http://espn.go.com/boston/nba/story/_/id/8551446/ray-allen-plays-rift-boston-celtics

Well, it's nice to see him say that...I just hope that he  defuses this back and forth mess that he's stooped to all of a sudden...

Ray - don't get caught up in the hype that is called MIAMI.....that is NOT you...

Just let this stuff GO...don't tarnish your legacy (in my eyes), by continuing on with the war of words.

It takes a second party to create a "war of words", GreenFaith. The Boston side has mostly been silent. I know your a ray guy, but even you can concede the fact he's truly tarnishing his image among this organization, and its entire fan base.

[Bombastic Jones]

ray wanted the ball more. Ray's beef is with Doc more than anyone. Doc saw that he could not defend anymore.

Ray Allen left because he was benched and b/c he was not getting all the shots he wanted.

It says he didn't go to the heat to get back at boston but that is utter BS. He knows what he is doing.

I think signing Ray would have been a nice little ending but I am 100 percent sure Doc didn't want him back. And guess what...Boston is better without him

I agree with everything you say except the part about Doc wanting him back.  I think Doc is always candid, and has stated he wanted him back.

For me the key quote from Ray in the article is when he was talking about '08:

we had so many players that understood their roles, and everyone just came in and did their part. It was 'Don't do too much; just do what you need to do to help the team win.'

It strikes me that he was applauding that group for accepting their role in order to make the team better, but when it came time for him to do that same thing he couldnt.  He lost trust in Doc, and therefore he was correct to move on.  The way he did it - for me - is the part I cant look past.  Will never forget what he did for us, but also strongly believe he is not 'a Celtic for life'.  NO WAY the C's should hang #20 in the rafters; I dont worry about that though since 7 isnt up there and they are pretty similar (5 seasons, 1 championship).

[edwardjkasche]

Reporters and interviewers are asking him questions about Boston.  It's not like he's just going on twitter or posting youtube videos just saying this stuff.

True, but, come on!  Just because a reporter asks you a question (that happens to be the same one 50 other reporters just asked you!) doesn't mean you have to answer it, or expound on your answer, or continue to beat a dead horse.

Allen could have, time and again, passed on a question or said he already answered it.  Instead, he's digging up ridiculously old and unreliable trade rumors to defend his switching teams.

You don't see the Celtics talking about Allen every day.  They're asked every day, but they pass and move the conversation along.  Coach Rivers even said their best move is to just let Allen keep talking.

You know why the Celtics don't waste their breath talking about Allen?  It's because they've moved on and they're excited about the Celtics.

[OsirusCeltics]

From Doc Rivers: "Let Ray keep talking"

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/celtics/post/_/id/4698194/rivers-let-ray-keep-talking