Doc hinting at starting Sullinger over Bass?

[bfrombleacher]

let me be the first to give you some backlash...haha
KG is the MAN, not the 6th man.  I want KG setting the tone at the start of every game and playing with Rondo and PP.  I can't think of any reason to not start KG that helps our team.  I mean his minutes are already getting monitored.

ill be honest... I have been thinking about KG being the 6th man lol... I know I will get a lot of backlash for this but with rondo scoring like he is it wouldn't be a bad idea. then you can reserve KG for playoff time baby! and maybe add some more years to him.

rondo
AB
PP
Sully
Darko

It gives KG more preparation time. Maybe.

[blink]

preparation time?  not sure what you mean?

I think if one is trying to argue that KG needs more rest during the season, I feel it would be better for him to have the occasional night off than come off the bench.  I just don't think that coming off the bench saves his body any better than having his minutes monitored.  Plus it makes the team worse.

let me be the first to give you some backlash...haha
KG is the MAN, not the 6th man.  I want KG setting the tone at the start of every game and playing with Rondo and PP.  I can't think of any reason to not start KG that helps our team.  I mean his minutes are already getting monitored.

ill be honest... I have been thinking about KG being the 6th man lol... I know I will get a lot of backlash for this but with rondo scoring like he is it wouldn't be a bad idea. then you can reserve KG for playoff time baby! and maybe add some more years to him.

rondo
AB
PP
Sully
Darko

It gives KG more preparation time. Maybe.

[bfrombleacher]

preparation time?  not sure what you mean?

I think if one is trying to argue that KG needs more rest during the season, I feel it would be better for him to have the occasional night off than come off the bench.  I just don't think that coming off the bench saves his body any better than having his minutes monitored.  Plus it makes the team worse.

let me be the first to give you some backlash...haha
KG is the MAN, not the 6th man.  I want KG setting the tone at the start of every game and playing with Rondo and PP.  I can't think of any reason to not start KG that helps our team.  I mean his minutes are already getting monitored.

ill be honest... I have been thinking about KG being the 6th man lol... I know I will get a lot of backlash for this but with rondo scoring like he is it wouldn't be a bad idea. then you can reserve KG for playoff time baby! and maybe add some more years to him.

rondo
AB
PP
Sully
Darko

It gives KG more preparation time. Maybe.

I mean he could be preparing his knees and warming up instead of starting the game. Just trying to justify what he was saying, not saying it's too big a difference (games start at night anyway so he'll have the entire day to prepare).

I'm with the people who say it doesn't matter too much who starts, though. The players who get the minutes and finish the games are more important.

Although KG might be the exception to the rule. He hypes everyone up and starting him might even be beneficial (the argument was that bringing him in as the 6th man might be beneficial).

I must kind-of-sort-of disagree with one thing you said though, that KG should start just because he is "the man". I know he is but then again it does not matter. I just think everyone is overlooking this. If somehow KG's 6th man relegation benefits the team, I'm pretty sure he'd do it. Egos are left at home with these guys.

But otherwise, yes, there is no reason.

[bfrombleacher]

Here is what Doc thinks on the matter, by the way:
http://www.celticstown.com/2012/10/10/doc-is-considering-moving-a-starter-to-the-second-unit/

We can slide Kevin over to the four to start games. The first half of the year I don’t know if that’s a bad thing, so Kevin doesn’t have a wrestling match the entire season with the bigs. There’s a lot of thoughts. We may go to a transitional starting lineup, have three different starting lineups. We’ve put a lot of thought into it, we’ll just figure it out.

Slightly unrelated but I myself think KG lasts longer at the 5. Bruising bigs that fit Doc's category of "wrestlers" are few and far between...

Bynum, Dwight? (not really a "wrestling" post player, but definitely will drain KG)...Al Jeff, Gortat and Cousins might be but games against them (barring a trade) probably won't matter.

[crimson_stallion]

I think there's an argument to be made that the starting lineup needs scoring punch more than the bench.  At this point in their careers, Terry and Green may be better at getting a shot off on their own than Pierce and KG (collectively). 

I disagree.

Our starting lineup will always be better offensively firstly because we have more dominant scorers (Rondo, Pierce, KG) but moreso because the starters have Rondo directing the offense.

The second unit will play 10-15 minutes with somebody other than Rondo running the offense, and you can guarantee that the offensive efficiency will drop as a result.

Also that starters will be dominant defensively as they always are, so offense is not as critical.  The defense should still be very good defensively, but nowhere near as dominant as the starters.

For those two reasons we need all the consistent scoring punch we can get off the bench to hold (or better yet increase) the lead while our starters rest.

I think Terry, Lee, Green and Bass would make the most dominant offensive second unit in the NBA by far, while Milicic manning the middle helps to ensure we don't get soft on defense - plus his passing will be a nice asset on that unit too.

[crimson_stallion]

Doc could also be talking about starting Green over Pierce.

And then using who to back up Pierce? I don't see this happening, as it hurts our second unit way too much at the SF spot.

For now, my speculation would be Avery playing point-guard for second unit. which makes a lot of sense.

Did you see Doc's recent comment a couple of days ago on this topic?  He basically said his biggest regret of the past few years was was trying to force Bradley to play PG.   

He said Bradley is a natural SG, and that by trying to force him to play the point halted his growth as a player, and that it wasn't until he let him play his natural position that he really started to shine. 

He also said he doesn't like to see Terry and Lee bringing the ball up for the same reason (they are better when playing off the ball) but I think he'd rather use Terry or Lee there rather then use a young Avery Bradley and risk limiting his development. 

Because Bradley is so effective with the starting unit and Terry is our #1 scoring option off the bench, it wouldn't surprise me if Doc goes a little unorthodox and uses a combinaton of Courtney Lee and Jeff Green to facillitate the offense on that second unit. Possibly using Lee to bring the ball up and then passing off to Green to initiate the play.

He was really suited more for being the scoring punch off the bench as our sixth man. His numbers didn't really improve that much when he was inserted into the starting 5

I agree entirely about Bass being better on the bench, but will he really be the 6th man?  I think more likely the 8th man, as I think both Terry and Green are above Bass on the depth chart when we go to the bench. 

Wow - having Jason Terry, Jeff Green and Brandon Bass coming off the bench...and Courney Lee as your 9th man? That's just insane!!

Courntney Lee would be a starter or a 6th man for any team not named San Antonio (Ginobilli, Jackson), OKC (Harden) or Miami (Ray Allen).

[Yoki_IsTheName]

If that's the case, i love it.

I think Bass coming off the bench fits him perfectly. He's an energy spark along with Terry, and another scoring option.

I hope him going to the bench does not kill some of his confidence though. Then again, he was supposed to be a bench guy from the start until JO went, you know, JO.

[GreenFaith1819]

I wouldn't read too much into Doc's comments..just my opinion.

Over the last few years, I've seen Doc experiment with our lineups...do IMO crazy substitutions...play people longer than what WE thought they should've played, etc, etc.

I've seen threads on here grilling Doc for it, lol.

I'm sure Doc will continue to tinker with the lineups, even moreso now. We have perhaps our best bench since 07-08.

I can honestly see Doc using maybe 10-15 games this season to experiment with lineups. Some of those experiments WILL cost us some games, but I trust Doc Rivers. Whatever he does with the lineup will be in the best interests of BOS, and will leave us better prepared to play well into June of 2013.

As for Bass over Sully? As much as I love Sully, I'd be shocked if he starts over Bass. As others here have mentioned (Who, I think), Bass is a better defender than Sully.

But he may not be for long, though. Sully is a Basketball Sponge.

[mctyson]

I don't see us putting Darko in the starting line up, just not good enough to earn it. Plus Doc has said that KG is going to stay at C.

Is there any reason to think that Darko is that much worse than Jermaine O'Neal was?  Because I remember him starting a ton at center.

[mctyson]

With Garnett's 5-5-5 minute distribution, I think Doc can get Sully just as much minutes alongside KG off the bench as he can with Sully in the starting lineup.

How do you figure?  20 of KG's 30 mpg are with the starters typically - the 5 at the beginning and end of each half.  I think if you want Sully getting 20 mpg without exposing him defensively, you've got to start him.

Here is what we know about the lineups and rotations:

1) Doc is going to do everything possible to limit KG's minutes. 

2) This year, for the first time, Pierce will probably be a sub-30 minute player.

3) Doc is going to obsess over 2 major weaknesses from last season: rebounding, and our 2nd unit scoring

4) The #1 goal is to get our entire lineup to the playoffs without injury

5) Rondo will be the only player getting over 30 minutes a game

So - how does that affect Bass vs. Sully and other starting lineup choices?  My guess is that Doc will want Bass on the floor with the 2nd unit more often for his shooting and scoring ability.  That might lead to Sully eventually starting, to keep the rotations consistent.

[SHAQATTACK]

Yup I agree for the C's to have ANY hope in the playoffs KG and PP HAVE TO BE THERE .   Green and Sully , BASS and Darko and Wilcox should see alot of minutes .

Bass is a natural off the bench role guy . But he's done good job filling in as a starter as well.

AS somebody once said , you can't have enough bigs. They seem to evaporate as the season progresses.

[nostar]

I like Bass off of the bench EXCEPT that it will kill his trade value. Ever since we signed Sullinger I've been on the "trade Bass" bandwagon. I like Bass, I think he's a good player, I think he's a top tier 2nd unit guy, but we need things more than PF right now. KG, Sullinger and Green can all play the pick-and-pop PF role. It's a strange amount of redundancy when what we really need is a backup PG or a safety net at SF.

I think more likely what you'll see is Bass starting but losing the minutes battle with Sullinger, maybe not to start the year but by Jan/Feb you'll see Sullinger's knack for rebounding and BBIQ sort of force Doc's hand. If he benched Ray Allen for the good of the team...

It's no secret that I'd like Scott Machado on the C's as soon as humanly possible. I'd give up Bass for him, which imo is fair value for an undrafted guy who made a good showing in camp. To make the salaries work we might have to work another team in. I thought up something that would get us a backup PG and SF for Bass and a 2nd round pick:

BOS trades Bass for Mbah a Moute
BOS sends a 2nd round pick and Kris Joseph to HOU for Scott Machado

Obviously this is a trade that would have to be mid-season because Bass can't be traded until the January 15th but it solves both of our 3rd string deficiencies while not losing much of our depth.

The Machado trade could happen as early as December 15th.

[celtics2]

sully starting the 2nd preseason game should have been a big wakeup call to the sully doubters.

All this talk about bass being known and sully being an unknown entity. sullys been a known entity to doc since sullys sophomore or junior year of high school. Docs been a big fan for at least 4 years.

Sully would have started over bass last year if he had come out and celtics traaded for a top 4 pick.

Sully will get better and better, Bass has maxed out in my opinion. Handled things very well in the Knicks game. But..............what about his back?? He dropped to what 21st in the draft? Should we be using him cautiously?

[lightspeed5]

Sully scored the team high  points against the knicks. 14 pts also chipping in 7 rebounds.

[SHAQATTACK]

I think Sully will eventually be starting. But, I believe Doc will make Sully take it away from Bass during the regular season or rather earn it., out of respect for Bass if nothing else.