Brook Lopez to sign 4-year, $61 million contract with Nets

[Brendan]

Ah, the classic straw man. Let's get away from the fact you basically said Lopez is $4-$5 million player and focus on something else to avoid looking silly. Nice try but too late.

I never said Lopez was a top 5 center, I said 'some could make the case' using criteria that excludes PF's who play out of position.

It seems like you are playing the straw man here.  Let's get away from the fact that you said "PF's you listed playing out of postion making up the majority of your list" and focus on something else to avoid looking silly.  Nice try but too late.

Please name 5 guys from the 8 I listed that are power forwards playing out of position.  After all, that would be a majority.  Please enlighten me, straw man, who are the five PF's amongst:

Dwight, Bynum, KG, Chandler, Horford, Hibbert, Gasol, Al Jefferson.

And what if I think a big man who averages 6 rebounds a game, can't play defense, and broke his foot twice last year is a $5 million dollar player.

Dwight, Bynum, Chandler, Hibbert, M. Gasol = all definitely Centers
Al Jefferson = hard to classify as PF based on career, but from C's days I see why
KG = no longer a PF, but historically he's been one, I expect he'll play >75% of minutes at C next year
Horford = best argument on list, I think he'd be better at PF, but again, he plays mostly C

[celtsfan84]

Ah, the classic straw man. Let's get away from the fact you basically said Lopez is $4-$5 million player and focus on something else to avoid looking silly. Nice try but too late.

I never said Lopez was a top 5 center, I said 'some could make the case' using criteria that excludes PF's who play out of position.

It seems like you are playing the straw man here.  Let's get away from the fact that you said "PF's you listed playing out of postion making up the majority of your list" and focus on something else to avoid looking silly.  Nice try but too late.

Please name 5 guys from the 8 I listed that are power forwards playing out of position.  After all, that would be a majority.  Please enlighten me, straw man, who are the five PF's amongst:

Dwight, Bynum, KG, Chandler, Horford, Hibbert, Gasol, Al Jefferson.

And what if I think a big man who averages 6 rebounds a game, can't play defense, and broke his foot twice last year is a $5 million dollar player.

Dwight, Bynum, Chandler, Hibbert, M. Gasol = all definitely Centers
Al Jefferson = hard to classify as PF based on career, but from C's days I see why
KG = no longer a PF, but historically he's been one, I expect he'll play >75% of minutes at C next year
Horford = best argument on list, I think he'd be better at PF, but again, he plays mostly C

TP.

That's exactly how I would break them down.  Horford is really the only strong case for a PF playing out of position, but he has started at Center for a playoff team practically his whole career.  

Al Jefferson is too slow-footed to be a PF and has started at Center for Utah and Minnesota.

KG is probably a Center from now on and I could probably add Tim Duncan to the list.  They no longer have the athleticism of their prime years but can still protect the basket as Centers.

Your breakdown is exactly how I see it.

[celtsfan84]

Ugh.  Well, I guess the Nets will never have cap space and the Russian billionaire can afford to overpay.

That's about $10 million a year too much for my liking, but then again Prokhorov made $10 million while I was typing this post.

So you think Lopez is about a 3 million a year player?

No, I don't.  Why do you ask?

Well, the starting amount of the contract is MAX $12,922,194, so we'll have to see what the details of this agreement is.

But for the time being, he'd be making that amount next season.

No, the maximum for a player of his experience is 25% of the cap. Which is 14.5 million this season.  And he is eligible for 7.5% annual raises.  Which gets him in the 18 million range by the end of the deal.

It's not exactly 25% of the cap, it ends up being lower. And considering that the cap remained unchanged from last year from what I'm seeing, then the maximum salary should be the same I'd say, so: $12,922,194.

I'll have to await the details, and see how the annual raises factor into it.

Woj says it is 5 for 78.  And you should also be aware that the first year of the contract is almost always smaller than all future years. It will be bigger in Year 2, 3, 4, and potentially 5.

I don't know how they'll arrive at 78, will have to look on how he gets a bump in that final year.

But for 4 at 58 million is also being discussed. That's a 4th year at 16 million, and ends up being 14.4 a year while the 5 year one puts it in 15.6 million a year.

Regardless, I was poking a bit fun at your 10 million a year too much, it's all good.

I think he's worth the Max at this stage of his career and the current make-up of the Nets. They already got the star players under contract, a good time to solidify your team with a center of this caliber (as much as I don't care for Lopez).

Player worth is always circumstantial, and it's why I don't pay too much attention to it, other than how it applies to that particular team's situation, and in this situation, a max contract for Lopez is the way to go.

Below is from Larry Coon's Salary Cap FAQ, which was just uploaded.  You were right on the 12.9 and it being less than 25% of the cap.  It looks like they upped the max for 2012-2013 though, probably due to the lockout, to start at 13.6 (a 5.8% increase).

They use a different cap calculation to determine the maximum salaries, which is based on 42.14% of projected BRI rather than 44.74%. For this reason, the maximum salaries are not actually 25%, 30% or 35% of the cap, and instead are a slightly lower amount. For example, even though the salary cap for 2011-12 is $58.044 million and 25% of this amount is $14.511 million, the 0-6 year maximum salary is actually $12,922,194. In addition, for 2012-13 a 5.8% increase in maximum salaries was agreed to, even though the salary cap stayed the same as 2011-12.

I see your point on locking up a Center, and even though I think it is an overpay, it won't hurt Brooklyn.  They'll be over the cap regardless of Brook and have a billionaire owner and he fills one of their few missing positions.

But is it wise to give up on Dwight so early?  This extension means they can't trade him until December.

Years in NBA Defined maximum salary 2011-12 2012-13
0 - 6 25% of cap $12,922,194 $13,668,750
7 - 9 30% of cap $15,506,632 $16,402,500
10+ 35% of cap $18,091,071 $19,136,250

[JSD]

I would say Brook Lopez is worth somewhere in the $10-12 million range.

That would be $50-60 million over five years vs the $78 million he got from Brooklyn. So overpaid by at least $18 million ($3 million per annum).

He is 24 years old and has room to improve. So I have him a little higher thinking that $13 million was about right based on further development. Lopez gets a bad rap defensively and needs to get better, but the Nets of the last few years havent exactly been a defensive breeding ground either. I remember Roy H. posting about Gerald Green numbers being inflated on the worst defensive team in the league, and that was with Brook on the sidelines. So it's not as though he was the weak link. Now that he has a solid defensive backcourt in front of him and Humphries on the way out, I bet both his defense and rebounding go up next season and he lives up to and beyond that 1st year money. I also see the Nets in the playoffs for the first time in a while.

[JSD]

I think he's worth the Max at this stage of his career and the current make-up of the Nets. They already got the star players under contract, a good time to solidify your team with a center of this caliber (as much as I don't care for Lopez).

Player worth is always circumstantial, and it's why I don't pay too much attention to it, other than how it applies to that particular team's situation, and in this situation, a max contract for Lopez is the way to go. -BudweiserCeltic

Tp nailed it.

I might feel differently about this contract if applied to a different roster makeup or team cap situation, but I think the nets made the right decision based on their situation.

[jdz101]

Good work lockout. Achieved plenty.

[BudweiserCeltic]

The Nets put an ultimatum out to get the Howard deal done. Either the Magic agree on a deal today, or it's off. This is directly related to Lopez possible signing, and the looming threat that Lopez might sign an offer sheet elsewhere, particularly with Portland now that Indiana looks to match on Hibbert.

[celtsfan84]

The Nets put an ultimatum out to get the Howard deal done. Either the Magic agree on a deal today, or it's off. This is directly related to Lopez possible signing, and the looming threat that Lopez might sign an offer sheet elsewhere, particularly with Portland now that Indiana looks to match on Hibbert.

Very interesting.  Perhaps even more interesting is the rumor that Houston would sign him to an offer sheet, thus immediately killing any Dwight to Brooklyn talks.

If Brooklyn matches the offer sheet, they have to keep Brook Lopez for the year.

[StartOrien]

"I had no idea he was worth that much! We must have him!" - Orlando management

[SHAQATTACK]

Thats why  Boston took Melo..... the price of Average centers in the NBA has skyrocketed.

Melo will be worth a huge amount in 3 years.  Maybe sooner once KG works his magic on him.

[Vermont Green]

I agree here fully, and if the extension is signed they can't trade him until December, so this almost certainly eliminates them from the Dwight derby.

At least out of the sweepstakes this year.  Unless they give Lopez a no trade clause, he could be salary ballast for a S&T for Howard next year.

In fact, it could be already all planned out.  You (Dwight) get yourself traded to Houston this year and then we will give Houston Lopez and a bunch of draft picks and you can come to Brooklyn next year.  We can wait another year.  We will be much improved anyway.

[Fafnir]

Good work lockout. Achieved plenty.

Lockout was always about luxury tax penalties and the overal amount of money the owners got.

Those penalties are being phased in over time and the owners are setup to get more of the money as revenue grows.

[indeedproceed]

The Nets put an ultimatum out to get the Howard deal done. Either the Magic agree on a deal today, or it's off. This is directly related to Lopez possible signing, and the looming threat that Lopez might sign an offer sheet elsewhere, particularly with Portland now that Indiana looks to match on Hibbert.

Very interesting.  Perhaps even more interesting is the rumor that Houston would sign him to an offer sheet, thus immediately killing any Dwight to Brooklyn talks.

If Brooklyn matches the offer sheet, they have to keep Brook Lopez for the year.

And if they don't match it, they lose a huge part of the package they could offer Orlando.

GOOOOOOO, Rockets!

[StartOrien]

Good work lockout. Achieved plenty.

Lockout was always about luxury tax penalties and the overal amount of money the owners got.

Those penalties are being phased in over time and the owners are setup to get more of the money as revenue grows.

And to give them a better safety net when they give out miserable contracts like this.

[CelticG1]

When was Brook lopez good? I feel like he's been talked about so much as a top player but he's not. Has he been an all-star? Hasn't he had big time injuries?

I honestly wouldn't want him at all. Im just not enamored by him or Chris Kaman or Spencer Hawes or other guys who suck but are tall. And guys who suck, play for lucky teams and people get excited about them scoring 20 points