Courtney Lee wants to taste playoffs, sees that with Celtics

[j804]

^it wasn't the money man if Ray wanted to be here he would have 

[saltlover]

Not sure Dooling can only be signed for $2.7m - haven't seen that, but have seen his cap hold is closer to $4m.

Per Larry Coon's CBA FAQ:

"If a team is over the cap and re-signs its Larry Bird or Early Bird free agent with a raise greater than 20%, in order to trade the player in a sign-and-trade arrangement, then the player's outgoing salary for trade purposes is either his previous salary or 50% of his new salary, whichever is greater. The team receiving the player always uses his new salary."

Dooling made $2,246,400 last season.  A 20% raise of that is $2,695,680, or approximately $2.7 million.  He can be paid more, but unless we start paying him $5.5 million for a season, $2,695,680 is the most his salary can count for in a trade.  That's where this number comes from.

[Brendan]

I certainly hope you guys are right and I think that certainly is within Boston's best interest to do so. 

However, I still go back to my point above.  If we're going to pay essentially 8 million dollars for Lee this year (5 million in salary and 3 million to Houston) and give up a first round pick, I wonder why Danny didn't up his offer to Ray to 7 or 8 million a year. 

It may not have been enough to keep him, but maybe it would've. 

Again, a minor quibble, I still want Lee and certainly would be willing to give up a first rounder in a weak draft to make it happen. 

I think Lee >>> Allen in Danny's mind.

I don't think Danny will do: $5m in salary to Lee (which is actually $10m since over the tax) + $3m in cash + first round draft pick for Lee. From a cash stand point that's 13m for Lee plus a pick.

[Brendan]

Not sure Dooling can only be signed for $2.7m - haven't seen that, but have seen his cap hold is closer to $4m.

Per Larry Coon's CBA FAQ:

"If a team is over the cap and re-signs its Larry Bird or Early Bird free agent with a raise greater than 20%, in order to trade the player in a sign-and-trade arrangement, then the player's outgoing salary for trade purposes is either his previous salary or 50% of his new salary, whichever is greater. The team receiving the player always uses his new salary."

Dooling made $2,246,400 last season.  A 20% raise of that is $2,695,680, or approximately $2.7 million.  He can be paid more, but unless we start paying him $5.5 million for a season, $2,695,680 is the most his salary can count for in a trade.  That's where this number comes from.

Thank you. I havent brushed up fully on new CBA. This helps explain why we weren't in on a Camby and Lee deal too.

TP4U sir.

-B

[saltlover]

I certainly hope you guys are right and I think that certainly is within Boston's best interest to do so. 

However, I still go back to my point above.  If we're going to pay essentially 8 million dollars for Lee this year (5 million in salary and 3 million to Houston) and give up a first round pick, I wonder why Danny didn't up his offer to Ray to 7 or 8 million a year. 

It may not have been enough to keep him, but maybe it would've. 

Again, a minor quibble, I still want Lee and certainly would be willing to give up a first rounder in a weak draft to make it happen. 

I think Lee >>> Allen in Danny's mind.

I don't think Danny will do: $5m in salary to Lee (which is actually $10m since over the tax) + $3m in cash + first round draft pick for Lee. From a cash stand point that's 13m for Lee plus a pick.

Thanks for the TP.

I look at it this way -- Danny's probably going to spend right up to the apron, which should be between $74.3 million (CBA minimum) and $77 million (depending what the BRI was last season.  The highest BRI estimate I've seen would put the apron at $76.9 million.)  He's not going over, because then he can't pay Terry the full MLE.  So from a cash standpoint, he has to fit Lee into that budget, but otherwise he was already spending the money.  The $3 million is certainly extra, but even adding $3 million to the rockets on top of $77 million apron takes you to $80 million, or pretty much what their payroll was last year (a little over $79 million.)  The $3 million is extra, but the salary to Lee and any tax penalties were already in his budget.

Also, it should be mentioned that the apron is, which Danny can't exceed if he's giving JET the MLE, is set at $4 million above the luxury tax level.  So essentially the most the Celtics can pay this year in luxury tax is $4 million.

[snively]

Despite the first round pick issue, we're still going to have to get Houston to take back as much salary as we agree to give Courtney Lee.  That might not prove an easy task. 

Why?  If we are giving them a pick, that will make it worth it.  We can also send $3 million cash to offset the salary.

Assuming that Wyc and Co. are willing to throw in 3 million, I think it could work.  But this goes back to my post above.  If we're going to pay 3 million to Houston and 4-5 million to Lee, shouldn't we have just upped the offered to Ray to 2 years 14 or 15 million and see if we could've overwhelmed him into staying.  It may not have worked, but it would've been simpler than this and not required giving up any assets. 

I just don't know if Houston is going to want a late first rounder in a weak draft to take back 3-5 million dollars of salary of players they may not want (such as Keyon Dooling signed and traded to that salary as some have suggested). 

If we're willing to offset the salary, that could work.  I certainly hope it does. 

Houston just signed and traded Camby for Toney Douglas, two non-guaranteed guys, 2nd round picks and cash. 

That's almost an exact parallel to our potential Dooling, Moore, Williams, cash and 2nd round pick(s) offer for Lee.

I'm pretty optimistic this gets done.

[Fafnir]

I'm pretty optimistic this gets done.

If Lee (and Dooling!) are willing to sign for a contract in that dollar range for years the C's/Rocket's are willing to give I am too.

I'm not at all confident that the C's bid will be the highest, or that he'll decide to sign and trade here in the end. Houston and the Celtics respectively will be able to work out a trade without issue.

[wahz]

I certainly hope you guys are right and I think that certainly is within Boston's best interest to do so.  

However, I still go back to my point above.  If we're going to pay essentially 8 million dollars for Lee this year (5 million in salary and 3 million to Houston) and give up a first round pick, I wonder why Danny didn't up his offer to Ray to 7 or 8 million a year.  

It may not have been enough to keep him, but maybe it would've.  

Again, a minor quibble, I still want Lee and certainly would be willing to give up a first rounder in a weak draft to make it happen.  

I think Lee >>> Allen in Danny's mind.

I don't think Danny will do: $5m in salary to Lee (which is actually $10m since over the tax) + $3m in cash + first round draft pick for Lee. From a cash stand point that's 13m for Lee plus a pick.

I think you are right. He is younger which will help as the contract goes by. He is as tall. He is quicker. He is a better defender. He dribbles better. And he doesn't hate Rondo, yet.

Kidding about the Rondo part. I think.

[Brendan]

...snip...

I think you are right. He is younger which will help as the contract goes by. He is as tall. He is quicker. He is a better defender. He dribbles better. And he doesn't hate Rondo, yet.

Kidding about the Rondo part. I think.

I think Ray Allen plays bigger, big enough to get some run at SF, Lee not so much. Just my take though. That would have mattered on a team that already has three small guys getting run at guard (Rondo, Bradley, JET.)

[celtic -_- pride]

Despite the first round pick issue, we're still going to have to get Houston to take back as much salary as we agree to give Courtney Lee.  That might not prove an easy task. 

Why?  If we are giving them a pick, that will make it worth it.  We can also send $3 million cash to offset the salary.

Assuming that Wyc and Co. are willing to throw in 3 million, I think it could work.  But this goes back to my post above.  If we're going to pay 3 million to Houston and 4-5 million to Lee, shouldn't we have just upped the offered to Ray to 2 years 14 or 15 million and see if we could've overwhelmed him into staying.  It may not have worked, but it would've been simpler than this and not required giving up any assets. 

I just don't know if Houston is going to want a late first rounder in a weak draft to take back 3-5 million dollars of salary of players they may not want (such as Keyon Dooling signed and traded to that salary as some have suggested). 

If we're willing to offset the salary, that could work.  I certainly hope it does. 

Houston just signed and traded Camby for Toney Douglas, two non-guaranteed guys, 2nd round picks and cash. 

That's almost an exact parallel to our potential Dooling, Moore, Williams, cash and 2nd round pick(s) offer for Lee.

I'm pretty optimistic this gets done.

am i the only person that likes moore and wishes him to stay even though there really is no room for him?

[j804]

Despite the first round pick issue, we're still going to have to get Houston to take back as much salary as we agree to give Courtney Lee.  That might not prove an easy task. 

Why?  If we are giving them a pick, that will make it worth it.  We can also send $3 million cash to offset the salary.

Assuming that Wyc and Co. are willing to throw in 3 million, I think it could work.  But this goes back to my post above.  If we're going to pay 3 million to Houston and 4-5 million to Lee, shouldn't we have just upped the offered to Ray to 2 years 14 or 15 million and see if we could've overwhelmed him into staying.  It may not have worked, but it would've been simpler than this and not required giving up any assets. 

I just don't know if Houston is going to want a late first rounder in a weak draft to take back 3-5 million dollars of salary of players they may not want (such as Keyon Dooling signed and traded to that salary as some have suggested). 

If we're willing to offset the salary, that could work.  I certainly hope it does. 

Houston just signed and traded Camby for Toney Douglas, two non-guaranteed guys, 2nd round picks and cash. 

That's almost an exact parallel to our potential Dooling, Moore, Williams, cash and 2nd round pick(s) offer for Lee.

I'm pretty optimistic this gets done.

am i the only person that likes moore and wishes him to stay even though there really is no room for him?

Yes.

[j804]

Still no update on him?

[cman88]

Still no update on him?

I have a feeling that we wont be hearing anything until Asik/Lin get taken care of...remember if the Bulls/Knicks refuse to match the offers they have on the table to them

the Rockets are going to have to clear some cap space which is when these deals most likely will go down. Right now everything is in a waiting period