Rondo is ruining it for the Celtics

[celtsfan84]

I've learned from CelticsBlog in my time posting here never to question Rajon Rondo.  He is better than Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, and perhaps every point guard in NBA history (while orchestrating a miserable offense). 

[scaryjerry]

Yup like I imagined how the thread would protect Rondo to the ends of the earth

When Pierce or Ray does bad, they get all the blame for the loss

When Rondo does bad its "Um well, the Miami defense changed up on him. Players weren't getting open"

In case you didn't know, Pierce is playing off of Rondo. The offense runs through Rondo as everyone can agree. So when Rondo doesn't get his other teammates involved by dribbling for a majority of the shot clock, it stagnates the offense
People bring up 5-18 for Pierce. Some of it was his fault obviously, but when you have a point guard that gives it to you at the end of the shot clock, its going to be a low percentage shot for Pierce. Look at the initial reaction instead of the end result (a missed shot or stats)

Alot of fans say Rondo is the best player on the Celtics, and the main reason of how the offense is run. So when he puts his teammates in bad positions with his turnovers, non-aggressiveness, and stagnating the offense with constant dribbling, its his teammates fault. You can't have it both ways

Actually youre dead wrong...rondo gets more criticism then all the otther celtics combined
this thread is an embarrasment

[mr. dee]

I've learned from CelticsBlog in my time posting here never to question Rajon Rondo.  He is better than Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, and perhaps every point guard in NBA history (while orchestrating a miserable offense). 

And I learned here that everytime we lose a game, we should point a finger to Rondo even if he is not the problem. We should blame the economic crisis on Rondo too.

[scaryjerry]

I've learned from CelticsBlog in my time posting here never to question Rajon Rondo.  He is better than Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, and perhaps every point guard in NBA history (while orchestrating a miserable offense). 

Right...Because rondo has never been questioned around here! gee youre just so smart and rondo is to blame for everything/
Rondo is more heavily criticized by his own fanbase then any other player in the league and theres people talking about that not being allowed? unreal

[celtsfan84]

I've learned from CelticsBlog in my time posting here never to question Rajon Rondo.  He is better than Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, and perhaps every point guard in NBA history (while orchestrating a miserable offense). 

And I learned here that everytime we lose a game, we should point a finger to Rondo even if he is not the problem. We should blame the economic crisis on Rondo too.

Yup, and his four 1st Quarter turnovers and 8 for 20 shooting against what was labeled as a "great matchup" for him sure helped us win the game.

Instead, we should praise him as the greatest thing since sliced bread when we win and make excuses for him and say "nobody's perfect" when we lose.

By that same logic, anyone in the world can be the best in the league.

No one is blaming the economic crisis on Rondo.  How about maybe we start at one or two games?

[celtsfan84]

I've learned from CelticsBlog in my time posting here never to question Rajon Rondo.  He is better than Derrick Rose, Chris Paul, and perhaps every point guard in NBA history (while orchestrating a miserable offense). 

Right...Because rondo has never been questioned around here! gee youre just so smart and rondo is to blame for everything/
Rondo is more heavily criticized by his own fanbase then any other player in the league and theres people talking about that not being allowed? unreal

I never said Rondo is to blame for everything.  I've seen many on this forum state he is the best point guard in the league.  My suggestion for the best point guard in the league is to run one of the best offenses in the league.  Reasonable request.

You're so smart and Rondo is to blame for nothing.  He's the best point guard in the world and the best at running an offense that we struggle to break 80 points on a consistent basis.

I wonder how often Magic failed to break 80 points.

[CelticsFanNC]

The problem with the the it's rondo's fault theory is that PP and RA didn't shoot poorly on bad looks created by Rondo. They shot poorly on good looks they have made their entire careers.

Saying anyone on this team get criticized by the fan base even close to as much as Rondo does is ludicrous   

[Celtics18]

Yup like I imagined how the thread would protect Rondo to the ends of the earth

When Pierce or Ray does bad, they get all the blame for the loss

When Rondo does bad its "Um well, the Miami defense changed up on him. Players weren't getting open"

In case you didn't know, Pierce is playing off of Rondo. The offense runs through Rondo as everyone can agree. So when Rondo doesn't get his other teammates involved by dribbling for a majority of the shot clock, it stagnates the offense
People bring up 5-18 for Pierce. Some of it was his fault obviously, but when you have a point guard that gives it to you at the end of the shot clock, its going to be a low percentage shot for Pierce. Look at the initial reaction instead of the end result (a missed shot or stats)

Alot of fans say Rondo is the best player on the Celtics, and the main reason of how the offense is run. So when he puts his teammates in bad positions with his turnovers, non-aggressiveness, and stagnating the offense with constant dribbling, its his teammates fault. You can't have it both ways

It didn't happen the way you saw it.  This is why when you are asked to point to examples of Rondo dribbling the ball at the top of the key for a majority of a possession before dishing to a teammate, you won't be able to do it.

I'm not saying that Rondo had a stellar game by his own standards.  He didn't.  But, he continues to be the best (or arguably second best) player on the Celtics team.  

He has to play better for the Celtics to have any chance of winning this series.  That I absolutely agree with, but he and Garnett and Pierce are going to need more help from the rest of his teammates.  

Again, please point to some possessions where Rondo dribbled the ball for a majority of the shot clock before dishing the ball to a teammate for a desperation last second shot.  Check the game tape.  I challenge you to find these possessions.

[OsirusCeltics]

Yup like I imagined how the thread would protect Rondo to the ends of the earth

When Pierce or Ray does bad, they get all the blame for the loss

When Rondo does bad its "Um well, the Miami defense changed up on him. Players weren't getting open"

In case you didn't know, Pierce is playing off of Rondo. The offense runs through Rondo as everyone can agree. So when Rondo doesn't get his other teammates involved by dribbling for a majority of the shot clock, it stagnates the offense
People bring up 5-18 for Pierce. Some of it was his fault obviously, but when you have a point guard that gives it to you at the end of the shot clock, its going to be a low percentage shot for Pierce. Look at the initial reaction instead of the end result (a missed shot or stats)

Alot of fans say Rondo is the best player on the Celtics, and the main reason of how the offense is run. So when he puts his teammates in bad positions with his turnovers, non-aggressiveness, and stagnating the offense with constant dribbling, its his teammates fault. You can't have it both ways

It didn't happen the way you saw it.  This is why when you are asked to point to examples of Rondo dribbling the ball at the top of the key for a majority of a possession before dishing to a teammate, you won't be able to do it.

I'm not saying that Rondo had a stellar game by his own standards.  He didn't.  But, he continues to be the best (or arguably second best) player on the Celtics team.  

He has to play better for the Celtics to have any chance of winning this series.  That I absolutely agree with, but he and Garnett and Pierce are going to need more help from the rest of his teammates.  

Again, please point to some possessions where Rondo dribbled the ball for a majority of the shot clock before dishing the ball to a teammate for a desperation last second shot.  Check the game tape.  I challenge you to find these possessions.

Because that is a trick question, I won't be baited into that
There were so many examples. Just watch the replay of that game in the 3rd quarter (Its always on NBA TV) and see for yourself
That trick question is like saying "point to a time where Ray Allen is running off screens"

If Paul Pierce would even DARE hold the ball for more than 10 seconds dribbling the ball, the whole thread would blast him for ruining the game for the Celtics. It'll be "Oh Pierce is playing that iso ball. Omg Pierce pass the ball. That iso ball never works, why is Doc allowing Pierce to do that??"

[ChainSmokingLikeDino]

Yup like I imagined how the thread would protect Rondo to the ends of the earth

When Pierce or Ray does bad, they get all the blame for the loss

When Rondo does bad its "Um well, the Miami defense changed up on him. Players weren't getting open"

In case you didn't know, Pierce is playing off of Rondo. The offense runs through Rondo as everyone can agree. So when Rondo doesn't get his other teammates involved by dribbling for a majority of the shot clock, it stagnates the offense
People bring up 5-18 for Pierce. Some of it was his fault obviously, but when you have a point guard that gives it to you at the end of the shot clock, its going to be a low percentage shot for Pierce. Look at the initial reaction instead of the end result (a missed shot or stats)

Alot of fans say Rondo is the best player on the Celtics, and the main reason of how the offense is run. So when he puts his teammates in bad positions with his turnovers, non-aggressiveness, and stagnating the offense with constant dribbling, its his teammates fault. You can't have it both ways

It didn't happen the way you saw it.  This is why when you are asked to point to examples of Rondo dribbling the ball at the top of the key for a majority of a possession before dishing to a teammate, you won't be able to do it.

I'm not saying that Rondo had a stellar game by his own standards.  He didn't.  But, he continues to be the best (or arguably second best) player on the Celtics team.  

He has to play better for the Celtics to have any chance of winning this series.  That I absolutely agree with, but he and Garnett and Pierce are going to need more help from the rest of his teammates.  

Again, please point to some possessions where Rondo dribbled the ball for a majority of the shot clock before dishing the ball to a teammate for a desperation last second shot.  Check the game tape.  I challenge you to find these possessions.

Because that is a trick question, I won't be baited into that
There were so many examples. Just watch the replay of that game in the 3rd quarter (Its always on NBA TV) and see for yourself
That trick question is like saying "point to a time where Ray Allen is running off screens"

If Paul Pierce would even DARE hold the ball for more than 10 seconds dribbling the ball, the whole thread would blast him for ruining the game for the Celtics. It'll be "Oh Pierce is playing that iso ball. Omg Pierce pass the ball. That iso ball never works, why is Doc allowing Pierce to do that??"

Give the strawmen a rest. No one is denying Rondo didn't play his best game and has to play better. But the whole "if Ray did this and if Paul did that they would be destroyed" is a fiction and means nothing. If you think the loss yesterday was all Rondo that is confirmation bias. Where are those threads right now?
Did Ray of Paul play well offensively? No. But I'm not going to throw them under the bus. And you shouldn't do the same with Rondo. Two wrongs don't make a right and all that. If you honestly don't think Rondo gets scapegoated around here a lot I guess we will agree to disagree. He deserves criticism but he deserves fair criticism. Playing the persecuted contrarian when that isn't the case does nothing but forestall discussion and debate. 

[BballTim]

He's a good player - who is sometimes great. You cannot expect greatness from him other than in short bursts in the way you do a Paul or Deron. When you accept that, you can appreciate the skills he does bring to the table.

  If you're claiming that Paul plays great from beginning to end and Rondo only plays great in short spurts, consider that Rondo's "uneven" play (15/7/12) is equal to CP3's "best effort" (18/5/8). I guess Paul's effort and consistency must be *almost* enough to make up for Rondo's superior point guard skills. Or maybe you're wrong about how Rondo's consistency and effort stack up to CP3's.

[CoachBo]

Rondo was hardly the dominant problem faced by the Celtics last night.

Yet, it is simply beyond discussion that he takes games, plays and sequences off with growing frequency - the definition of uneven play.

And trying to measure uneven play with statistics fails in total to take into account the impact of that uneven play on the other four people on the floor, and is - as usual - a stilted attempt to defend Rondo.

Numbers don't measure effort. Ever. He's been accurately characterized earler in this thread - a good player who can be great ... when he wants to be.

And yes, the humor of "Rondo Infallibility" lives on on Celtics Blog. Kudos to the moderators for some even-handed analysis of the subject out front, but some of you are never going to admit that Rondo isn't the best point guard in the history of the game.

[Celtics18]

Yup like I imagined how the thread would protect Rondo to the ends of the earth

When Pierce or Ray does bad, they get all the blame for the loss

When Rondo does bad its "Um well, the Miami defense changed up on him. Players weren't getting open"

In case you didn't know, Pierce is playing off of Rondo. The offense runs through Rondo as everyone can agree. So when Rondo doesn't get his other teammates involved by dribbling for a majority of the shot clock, it stagnates the offense
People bring up 5-18 for Pierce. Some of it was his fault obviously, but when you have a point guard that gives it to you at the end of the shot clock, its going to be a low percentage shot for Pierce. Look at the initial reaction instead of the end result (a missed shot or stats)

Alot of fans say Rondo is the best player on the Celtics, and the main reason of how the offense is run. So when he puts his teammates in bad positions with his turnovers, non-aggressiveness, and stagnating the offense with constant dribbling, its his teammates fault. You can't have it both ways

It didn't happen the way you saw it.  This is why when you are asked to point to examples of Rondo dribbling the ball at the top of the key for a majority of a possession before dishing to a teammate, you won't be able to do it.

I'm not saying that Rondo had a stellar game by his own standards.  He didn't.  But, he continues to be the best (or arguably second best) player on the Celtics team.  

He has to play better for the Celtics to have any chance of winning this series.  That I absolutely agree with, but he and Garnett and Pierce are going to need more help from the rest of his teammates.  

Again, please point to some possessions where Rondo dribbled the ball for a majority of the shot clock before dishing the ball to a teammate for a desperation last second shot.  Check the game tape.  I challenge you to find these possessions.

Because that is a trick question, I won't be baited into that
There were so many examples. Just watch the replay of that game in the 3rd quarter (Its always on NBA TV) and see for yourself
That trick question is like saying "point to a time where Ray Allen is running off screens"

If Paul Pierce would even DARE hold the ball for more than 10 seconds dribbling the ball, the whole thread would blast him for ruining the game for the Celtics. It'll be "Oh Pierce is playing that iso ball. Omg Pierce pass the ball. That iso ball never works, why is Doc allowing Pierce to do that??"

Falsity, falsity, falsity.  Please, just give me one single example of Rondo holding or dribbling the ball for more than 20 seconds (which you have amusingly now changed to 10).  I've watched a replay of the game, and it didn't happen.

You are wrong.  It's not a trick.  I don't blame you for refusing to be baited into backing up a claim that you can't back up due to its falseness.

I'm not blaming Pierce.  Yes, he struggled, but he's got a brutal match up, and I think he'll keep grinding and find ways to have a positive influence despite going head to head against the most dangerous player on the planet.  The red herrings are getting you nowhere.  The fact remains that your initial claim was false.  I've watched the tape to confirm that.  You're wrong.  Step up and admit it.

[CelticsFanNC]

I think Rondo proved in the 2nd half of this season that he can be a consistently GREAT player when he plays with guys who can consistently get out in front of him in the open court.   When he finally had that for the first time in his career he played consistently great basketball.   I don't see his inconsistency issues as an effort issues. It's a style of play Issue

I think he wants to be great every night. It's not about effort or want to because when he had athletes who were able to run the court with him he was consistently great.  Right now we have no one on the active roster that helps Rondo do what he does best

[Celtics18]

Rondo was hardly the dominant problem faced by the Celtics last night.

Yet, it is simply beyond discussion that he takes games, plays and sequences off with growing frequency - the definition of uneven play.

And trying to measure uneven play with statistics fails in total to take into account the impact of that uneven play on the other four people on the floor, and is - as usual - a stilted attempt to defend Rondo.

Numbers don't measure effort. Ever. He's been accurately characterized earler in this thread - a good player who can be great ... when he wants to be.

And yes, the humor of "Rondo Infallibility" lives on on Celtics Blog. Kudos to the moderators for some even-handed analysis of the subject out front, but some of you are never going to admit that Rondo isn't the best point guard in the history of the game.

Strawmen, strawmen, strawmen.  Nobody--not even me or BBalTim--has ever claimed that Rondo is infallible.  I've never used that term.  

When people make wildly inaccurate claims whose inaccuracy can easily be disproven, I am willing to point it out, however.  It's as simple as that.

I obviously appreciate Rondo as a player more than many of the posters on CelticsBlog.  That's cool.  Not everybody is going to see things the same way or agree on everything.  

When some of us make arguments to dispute some of the crazy stuff that gets written about our players on here, the main counter argument seems to be that we are just blind worshippers and "fan boys."  Fine, make that claim.  But, back up your opinions with something a little more meaty, please.  For goodness' sake.

Talk about lazy.  Come on, Coach, you can do better.