Chris Paul is the best player in the NBA

[mqtcelticsfan]

The argument isn't even about Chris Paul. If you look at the beginning of this thread YOU and other Lebron HOMERS brought up Lebron when I said Chris Paul is the best player. Did I title the post "Chris Paul is the best and Lebron isn't"? No.

Saying that Chris Paul is the best player in the NBA implies that LeBron James is not the best. There can only be one best player in the NBA. Us bringing up LeBron is to be expected in this thread, because he's the best player in the NBA.

Its only when I don't go against the agenda and dogma that Lebron is unquestionably the best player. Sorry theres people with other opinions on whos the best player, as hard is that for you to believe. I know, its hard to swallow

It's "hard to swallow" because the evidence at hand doesn't support your conclusion.

It boggles my mind that we praise "gawdy" stats instead of leadership and clutch performance. In my opinion (omg is that illegal?) I hold that higher than gawdy stats. Alot of people worship stats too much, it doesn't tell the whole story. Yes Lebron can average 35 ppg. But how much of that is in the 4th quarter? If he scores 40 in the first 3 quarters then scores 2 points in the 4th with a total with 42 pts, that wouldn't matter to anyone? Would you just overlook that?

Hyperbole aside in your example, I'd still take the guy who scores 42 points a game even if 40 of the 42 came in the first three quarters. You want to know why? Because those 42 points still count as 42 freaking points. You are underselling the importance of the first 75% of the game. Even if LeBron never went off in the 4th quarter (which is false, by the way) I'd still claim he is the best player in the league.

No one is doubting Lebron's skill and talent. But its his lack of performance in the important moments that makes him not as good as other players

Chris Paul, on the other hand, has won multiple titles to offset LeBron's statistical dominance. You can't use such immeasurable things as clutch and winning without some sort of winning history to fall back on.

[fairweatherfan]

Chris Paul, on the other hand, has won multiple titles to offset LeBron's statistical dominance. You can't use such immeasurable things as clutch and winning without some sort of winning history to fall back on.

Just for kicks I looked up LeBron and Paul's respective playoff records.  Want to guess which guy is 59-37 with 11 series wins and which guy is 12-14 with 1?  Both individual stats and team performance at every level majorly favor LeBron.

But I get a strong vibe that this "debate" has little to do with Paul and a lot to do with expressing a really, really powerful dislike of LeBron.  Then again, I did see SportsCenter in the airport a couple months ago - it was on mute but it might've been enough to permanently brainwash me.

[OsirusCeltics]

The argument isn't even about Chris Paul. If you look at the beginning of this thread YOU and other Lebron HOMERS brought up Lebron when I said Chris Paul is the best player. Did I title the post "Chris Paul is the best and Lebron isn't"? No.

Saying that Chris Paul is the best player in the NBA implies that LeBron James is not the best. There can only be one best player in the NBA. Us bringing up LeBron is to be expected in this thread, because he's the best player in the NBA.

Its only when I don't go against the agenda and dogma that Lebron is unquestionably the best player. Sorry theres people with other opinions on whos the best player, as hard is that for you to believe. I know, its hard to swallow

It's "hard to swallow" because the evidence at hand doesn't support your conclusion.

It boggles my mind that we praise "gawdy" stats instead of leadership and clutch performance. In my opinion (omg is that illegal?) I hold that higher than gawdy stats. Alot of people worship stats too much, it doesn't tell the whole story. Yes Lebron can average 35 ppg. But how much of that is in the 4th quarter? If he scores 40 in the first 3 quarters then scores 2 points in the 4th with a total with 42 pts, that wouldn't matter to anyone? Would you just overlook that?

Hyperbole aside in your example, I'd still take the guy who scores 42 points a game even if 40 of the 42 came in the first three quarters. You want to know why? Because those 42 points still count as 42 freaking points. You are underselling the importance of the first 75% of the game. Even if LeBron never went off in the 4th quarter (which is false, by the way) I'd still claim he is the best player in the league.

No one is doubting Lebron's skill and talent. But its his lack of performance in the important moments that makes him not as good as other players

Chris Paul, on the other hand, has won multiple titles to offset LeBron's statistical dominance. You can't use such immeasurable things as clutch and winning without some sort of winning history to fall back on.

See this is where me and people who think Lebron is the best differ. The first 75% is no where near important as the last 25% of a game. Its not irrelevant, but the 75% is for the stat guys to go goo goo gaa gaa over. Everything isn't black and white

Lets put a situation where Lebron scores 40 in the first 3 quarters in a game 7, and his team is tied with the opposing team. Then all of a sudden, he gets nervous, forgets to drive the ball and settles for jumpers (like he always does) and ends up scoring only 2 points. So his lack of scoring in the 4th allows the opposing team to go up 15 points and they end up losing. Now does the 42 points he accumulated really matter when he didn't score when it counts?  

[OsirusCeltics]

Chris Paul, on the other hand, has won multiple titles to offset LeBron's statistical dominance. You can't use such immeasurable things as clutch and winning without some sort of winning history to fall back on.

Just for kicks I looked up LeBron and Paul's respective playoff records.  Want to guess which guy is 59-37 with 11 series wins and which guy is 12-14 with 1?  Both individual stats and team performance at every level majorly favor LeBron.

But I get a strong vibe that this "debate" has little to do with Paul and a lot to do with expressing a really, really powerful dislike of LeBron.  Then again, I did see SportsCenter in the airport a couple months ago - it was on mute but it might've been enough to permanently brainwash me.

Again, I made this post to highlight why think Chris Paul is the best player. But you and alot of other posters brought up Lebron, I didn't. It seems like you have a very very powerful man-crush on Lebron 

[OsirusCeltics]

I do think that Kevin Durant can be the best player in the NBA, but he has to stop thinking Westbrook is his older brother
 
Chris Paul is the alpha dog on that Clipper team and changed that losing culture in LA. I still give the nod to Paul

[Kane3387]

I do think that Kevin Durant can be the best player in the NBA, but he has to stop thinking Westbrook is his older brother
 
Chris Paul is the alpha dog on that Clipper team and changed that losing culture in LA. I still give the nod to Paul

When has he seen him as his older brother? If anything KD is like the older brother even though they're the same age...

[guava_wrench]

Talk to me AFTER he leads some team to a CHAMPIONSHIP.....! Heck, Allen Iverson had a lot of scoring skills...!

Exactly! And how much people want to support Iverson? None. When both had similar careers. Iverson also lead a supposedly "lowly" team to the Finals. I think its the media's perception of Lebron that is influencing fans

And how many people want to support Barkley. Oh wait, a lot in fact.

First, how are Iverson and Lebron similar? Lebron has always been a team player and listens to coaches. Lebron works on all aspects of his game. Lebron ALWAYS has success no matter who his teammates are.

Second, why do you feel the need to say things like "I think its the media's perception of Lebron that is influencing fans" when people disagree with you? We can all make ad hominem arguments like you if we want.

You keep making opinionated generalizations and people keep handing you your hat by provided actual game data to refute your views. You rationalize this away by saying we are being fooled by the media. Uh, buddy, I haven't watched Sportscenter since the early 90s. Sounds to me like YOU are too influenced by your negative personal emotions against Lebron to appreciate the actual game action. Perhaps YOU are too influenced by CP3's flashy plays to evaluate his overall performance. How about we set the motivations aside and look at actual performances.

No I think you're blinded by Sportscenter
The argument isn't even about Chris Paul. If you look at the beginning of this thread YOU and other Lebron HOMERS brought up Lebron when I said Chris Paul is the best player. Did I title the post "Chris Paul is the best and Lebron isn't"? No. Its only when I don't go against the agenda and dogma that Lebron is unquestionably the best player. Sorry theres people with other opinions on whos the best player, as hard is that for you to believe. I know, its hard to swallow

It boggles my mind that we praise "gawdy" stats instead of leadership and clutch performance. In my opinion (omg is that illegal?) I hold that higher than gawdy stats. Alot of people worship stats too much, it doesn't tell the whole story. Yes Lebron can average 35 ppg. But how much of that is in the 4th quarter? If he scores 40 in the first 3 quarters then scores 2 points in the 4th with a total with 42 pts, that wouldn't matter to anyone? Would you just overlook that?

No one is doubting Lebron's skill and talent. But its his lack of performance in the important moments that makes him not as good as other players

Do you even read other people's posts? I already said in the post you "replied to" that I haven't seen Sportscenter since before Lebron entered the league.

It is like you have your scripted replies and don't want to engage what people write here. If you want to come here and preach, it is your prerogative. I sense that discussing this with you is a fool's errand.

[guava_wrench]

Chris Paul, on the other hand, has won multiple titles to offset LeBron's statistical dominance. You can't use such immeasurable things as clutch and winning without some sort of winning history to fall back on.

Just for kicks I looked up LeBron and Paul's respective playoff records.  Want to guess which guy is 59-37 with 11 series wins and which guy is 12-14 with 1?  Both individual stats and team performance at every level majorly favor LeBron.

But I get a strong vibe that this "debate" has little to do with Paul and a lot to do with expressing a really, really powerful dislike of LeBron.  Then again, I did see SportsCenter in the airport a couple months ago - it was on mute but it might've been enough to permanently brainwash me.

Again, I made this post to highlight why think Chris Paul is the best player. But you and alot of other posters brought up Lebron, I didn't. It seems like you have a very very powerful man-crush on Lebron 

How were you unable to understand the point others have made that if you claim a player is the best you are saying he is better than everyone else. Of course people are going to mention guys who are better than him.

What is funny is a lot of Lebron defenders probably can't stand him, but his superior play is hard to deny for people who know the game and can put aside any personal feelings.

[guava_wrench]

I'm ashamed at myself for just adding 2 more replies to this thread when it is a lost cause.

[OsirusCeltics]

I do think that Kevin Durant can be the best player in the NBA, but he has to stop thinking Westbrook is his older brother
 
Chris Paul is the alpha dog on that Clipper team and changed that losing culture in LA. I still give the nod to Paul

When has he seen him as his older brother? If anything KD is like the older brother even though they're the same age...

I mean it as sarcasm, because Westbrook still acts like he's the alpha dog on the team. Durant seems too passive IMO

[OsirusCeltics]

I'm ashamed at myself for just adding 2 more replies to this thread when it is a lost cause.

Why is it a "lost cause"? Its my opinion
Get over your man-crush
People would always have different views on things in life. Thats never going to change

Looks like YOU don't read my posts. I keep telling you that Lebron can score 42 points in the 4th quarter, but if he only scores 2 of them in the 4th, then it wasn't that impressive. But you keep throwing stats in my face like the world is black and white *shrugs*

[Fafnir]

I'm ashamed at myself for just adding 2 more replies to this thread when it is a lost cause.

Why is it a "lost cause"? Its my opinion
Get over your man-crush
People would always have different views on things in life. Thats never going to change

No one has said you can't have your opinion, we've just disagreed with you.

Your arguments have progressed from he failed in these specific series, to he fails in the clutch in general, to we all have man-crushes on him or have been brainwashed by sportscenter.

All while never really addressing most of the collective rebuttals, so yeah I think we're done here.

Edit: We aren't throwing "stats", we're presenting evidence which refutes your view. You have chosen to ignore it all with some mental hand waving.

[syfy9]

I do think that Kevin Durant can be the best player in the NBA, but he has to stop thinking Westbrook is his older brother
 
Chris Paul is the alpha dog on that Clipper team and changed that losing culture in LA. I still give the nod to Paul

When has he seen him as his older brother? If anything KD is like the older brother even though they're the same age...

I mean it as sarcasm, because Westbrook still acts like he's the alpha dog on the team. Durant seems too passive IMO

Yeah, that's why he takes the game winning shots for the Thunder. Durant is too passive, especially in the 4th quarter. He loves to defer to Westbrook.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3B2QzmwFHuo


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QtHq9RFQeqc

[OsirusCeltics]

I'm ashamed at myself for just adding 2 more replies to this thread when it is a lost cause.

Why is it a "lost cause"? Its my opinion
Get over your man-crush
People would always have different views on things in life. Thats never going to change

No one has said you can't have your opinion, we've just disagreed with you.

Your arguments have progressed from he failed in these specific series, to he fails in the clutch in general, to we all have man-crushes on him or have been brainwashed by sportscenter.

All while never really addressing most of the collective rebuttals, so yeah I think we're done here.

Edit: We aren't throwing "stats", we're presenting evidence which refutes your view. You have chosen to ignore it all with some mental hand waving.

You never gave a rebuttal of the series I stated where he fails constantly

[Fafnir]

You never gave a rebuttal of the series I stated where he fails constantly

Which series are you talking about now? I rebutted the 08-09 series in great detail. Others dealt with other years rather well, not to mention how you've ignored CP3's rather mediocre playoff record that fwf cited.