This team CANNOT WIN a championship without Ray Allen

[wdleehi]

For a team that couldn't hit a shot last night, yes, this team needed Ray Allen. 

[Marcus13]

This has been the case since 2008.

Duh.

[RajonRondo9Dime]

I'm tired of the anti Ray talk. I'm tired of the unrealistic expectations of a 21 year old kid.

Ray Allen's impact on this team is huge. Forget the LARGE number of huge shots he has hit over these past 5 years (and it's a very large number) the spacing, playing decoy, ect. ect. ect.

We need him. It literally bothers me to hear the negative talk about him. He has done nothing but help this franchise win. Even playing incredible defense in the playoffs over the years.

If Ray was playing tonight, we win, IMO. We didn't hit a single 3 pointer tonight. Bradley is going to be a fine player, but this stage is just flat out too big for him right now..

Walter Ray Allen, please get well soon.

Ray Allen didnt show up at all in the 2008 series vs the Hawks, and has historically not shown up in the playoffs except for a few games in his Celtic career.

I dont get why you think Ray will all of the sudden be some huge scorer for the entire playoffs, he is a streak shooter, its a coin flip if hes going to have it for a series, and judging by how neither KG or PP had it for the first half, I wouldnt expect Ray after missing all this time to have it either.

In 2008, Ray averaged 16 PPG 40% from three.
In 2009, Ray averaged 18 PPG and 35% from three. Also had that 51 point game, and the game winner over Noah against Chi.
In 2010 Ray averaged 16 PPG and 39% from three. Oh, and a finals record for threes in a game.
In 2011 Ray averaged 19 PPG and 57% from three. Also had a game winner against the Knicks.

This is a very basic outline and I'm missing a lot more important details, like defense, other big games, big shots, ect ect.....

But I think this absolutely destroys your theory that he "historically doesn't show up for playoff games, except for a couple."

Like mentioned in this thread, the room for error for this team is so very small. Without Ray? Might as well forfeit.

[ThaPreacher]

I agree, as well.  Ray is a big piece of this team, and is a important component of any of our potential success.  We certainly could have used him last night.

Ray Allen as a starter or off the bench, changes the game.
Atlanta may be in the Bible belt, but Boston needs Jesus!!!!

[RajonRondo9Dime]

I agree, as well.  Ray is a big piece of this team, and is a important component of any of our potential success.  We certainly could have used him last night.

Ray Allen as a starter or off the bench, changes the game.
Atlanta may be in the Bible belt, but Boston needs Jesus!!!!

aahahah love it!

[LarBrd33]

We don't really know if that's true.  We can assume it's true, though.  All we know is that this team only won a championship once 4 years ago and it took all three of the "Big 3" playing at the top of their games... along with key role playing from guys like Perk, Tony Allen, Eddie House, Rondo, PJ Brown, and especially James Posey.

Rondo's role has changed dramatically since then.  Our depth is lacking... but for the most part I agree... you need the Big 3 playing at the top of their games to win a title.

[Carhole]

I'm tired of the anti Ray talk. I'm tired of the unrealistic expectations of a 21 year old kid.

Ray Allen's impact on this team is huge. Forget the LARGE number of huge shots he has hit over these past 5 years (and it's a very large number) the spacing, playing decoy, ect. ect. ect.

We need him. It literally bothers me to hear the negative talk about him. He has done nothing but help this franchise win. Even playing incredible defense in the playoffs over the years.

If Ray was playing tonight, we win, IMO. We didn't hit a single 3 pointer tonight. Bradley is going to be a fine player, but this stage is just flat out too big for him right now..

Walter Ray Allen, please get well soon.

Ray Allen didnt show up at all in the 2008 series vs the Hawks, and has historically not shown up in the playoffs except for a few games in his Celtic career.

I dont get why you think Ray will all of the sudden be some huge scorer for the entire playoffs, he is a streak shooter, its a coin flip if hes going to have it for a series, and judging by how neither KG or PP had it for the first half, I wouldnt expect Ray after missing all this time to have it either.

In 2008, Ray averaged 16 PPG 40% from three.
In 2009, Ray averaged 18 PPG and 35% from three. Also had that 51 point game, and the game winner over Noah against Chi.
In 2010 Ray averaged 16 PPG and 39% from three. Oh, and a finals record for threes in a game.
In 2011 Ray averaged 19 PPG and 57% from three. Also had a game winner against the Knicks.

This is a very basic outline and I'm missing a lot more important details, like defense, other big games, big shots, ect ect.....

But I think this absolutely destroys your theory that he "historically doesn't show up for playoff games, except for a couple."

Like mentioned in this thread, the room for error for this team is so very small. Without Ray? Might as well forfeit.

We can't win without Ray but you cherry picked your stats.

He was AWFUL against cleveland in 08 and against Detroit.

You mention that he set a finals record for 3's in a game and fail to mention his 0-13 performance the very next game which the celtics lost or the fact he was 0-11 for the first 40 minutes of game 7.

Ray was by far his best in that epic chicago series in 09 and we need him to make any serious noise this playoffs but he has had plenty of no shows too.

[nickagneta]

Don't believe this whatsoever. I have no stats to back my opinion. But Ray has been an afterthought to this team for weeks and weeks and the team has continued to win against the toughest competition.

I think if he returns and can not be the Ray that we have come accustomed to he may actually hurt this team more than help them. If he returns and is not hitting threes and is having opposing players blow by him and giving up big points like he was for most of the last couple of months, I think it hurts this team more than helps.

If he returns and can be the efficient outside shooting presence and won't be a sieve on defense, I think he will help this team considerably.

But I don't think for a second he has to play in order for this team to succeed during this playoff season.

[Celtics4ever]

I think Ray is the most expendable of the big three.   I thought we should have traded him even perhaps.   Bradley and Rondo have been a fine backcourt with their D equaling any firepower Ray added.

[tenn_smoothie]

Don't believe this whatsoever. I have no stats to back my opinion. But Ray has been an afterthought to this team for weeks and weeks and the team has continued to win against the toughest competition.

I think if he returns and can not be the Ray that we have come accustomed to he may actually hurt this team more than help them. If he returns and is not hitting threes and is having opposing players blow by him and giving up big points like he was for most of the last couple of months, I think it hurts this team more than helps.

If he returns and can be the efficient outside shooting presence and won't be a sieve on defense, I think he will help this team considerably.

But I don't think for a second he has to play in order for this team to succeed during this playoff season.

i don't get the comments about Ray all of the sudden being labeled as ineffective for us. have you not noticed that the last impressive win for the C's was at Miami and that was the last game that Ray played in.

isn't this the same Ray Allen who single-handedly won game 2 in LA in 2010 ? if you want to criticize his struggles the rest of that series, remember that one of the dirtiest guys in the league, Ron Artest shoved a knee into Ray's thigh in game 3, hampering his lift the rest of the series.

isn't this the same Ray Allen who rained 3's down on the Lakers in the game 6 clincher in '08 or made the game clinching drive in game 4 of that same year ??

We Need Ray Allen to Win a Title - end of discussion.

[thestackshow]

Don't believe this whatsoever. I have no stats to back my opinion. But Ray has been an afterthought to this team for weeks and weeks and the team has continued to win against the toughest competition.

I think if he returns and can not be the Ray that we have come accustomed to he may actually hurt this team more than help them. If he returns and is not hitting threes and is having opposing players blow by him and giving up big points like he was for most of the last couple of months, I think it hurts this team more than helps.

If he returns and can be the efficient outside shooting presence and won't be a sieve on defense, I think he will help this team considerably.

But I don't think for a second he has to play in order for this team to succeed during this playoff season.

have you not noticed that the last impressive win for the C's was at Miami and that was the last game that Ray played in.

all these comments about Ray being ineffective for playoff stretches evidently have no clue about basketball.

isn't this the same Ray Allen who single-handedly won game 2 in LA in 2010 ? if you want to criticize his struggles the rest of that series, remember that one of the dirtiest guys in the league, Ron Artest shoved a knee into Ray's thigh in game 3 and thus hampered Allen's lift on his jump shot.

isn't this the same Ray Allen who rained 3's down on the Lakers in the game 6 clincher in '08 or made the game clinching drive in game 4 of that same year ??

We Need Ray Allen to Win a Title - end of discussion.

Ray won game 2 but couldnt hit a shot for the rest of the series lol.

[azzenfrost]

Ray Allen? No, not just him.

We need every player in this roster to do their jobs and do it well. Starter to Bench.

[nickagneta]

Don't believe this whatsoever. I have no stats to back my opinion. But Ray has been an afterthought to this team for weeks and weeks and the team has continued to win against the toughest competition.

I think if he returns and can not be the Ray that we have come accustomed to he may actually hurt this team more than help them. If he returns and is not hitting threes and is having opposing players blow by him and giving up big points like he was for most of the last couple of months, I think it hurts this team more than helps.

If he returns and can be the efficient outside shooting presence and won't be a sieve on defense, I think he will help this team considerably.

But I don't think for a second he has to play in order for this team to succeed during this playoff season.

have you not noticed that the last impressive win for the C's was at Miami and that was the last game that Ray played in.

all these comments about Ray being ineffective for playoff stretches evidently have no clue about basketball.

isn't this the same Ray Allen who single-handedly won game 2 in LA in 2010 ? if you want to criticize his struggles the rest of that series, remember that one of the dirtiest guys in the league, Ron Artest shoved a knee into Ray's thigh in game 3 and thus hampered Allen's lift on his jump shot.

isn't this the same Ray Allen who rained 3's down on the Lakers in the game 6 clincher in '08 or made the game clinching drive in game 4 of that same year ??

We Need Ray Allen to Win a Title - end of discussion.

Ray won game 2 but couldnt hit a shot for the rest of the series lol.

And why couldn't he a shot for the rest of the series 2 YEARS AGO??

Because he was hurt and hurt in his leg area. What is he now 2 YEARS LATER? He's hurt in his leg area so bad he hasn't played in weeks.

The last impressive win the C's had was against the hawks, Ray didn't play. The win versus Miami that Ray played in, he was nearly a non factor scoring nine points in 35 minutes.

Sorry tennessee smoothie your arguments didn't dissuade me from my opinion and quite honestly your misinformation only goes to solidify my opinion

The injured Ray Allen that currently exists is not going to make a huge difference to this team if he plays. It is no coincidence that the Celtics played much better when Ray was hurt or played off the bench. His defense this year was awful.

[rayallen1934]

Bradley made 4 layups yesterday 3 of them on cuts


you tell me wether we can win with Bradley making layups on cut attempts


get back to me when you have a brain and know basketball outside of just being happy about a young kid playing better basketball.

Oh and I like Bradley and admit i was wrong about him.

but a healthy Ray Allen makes Rondo better makes pierce better and makes the offense more cohesive.

All of the big make eachother better and Ray is the most expendable but still is a huge key to winning in the playoffs.


Look at what Bradley and Pietrus did yesterday, but no real criticism

Ray will always be the scapegoat. He always has been and always will be.

[azzenfrost]

It's not like Doc doesn't want him to play. Ray Allen simply can't at the moment. It's pointless arguing about it when his ankle is keeping him from lacing up and being effective.