Should we pursue Ibaka or Harden?

[Smutzy#9]

Would LOVE!!!!!!!!!!!!! either of them, As much as I dislike westbrook I love the thunder as an organisation. They have drafted really well (gotten lucky also) and its paying off after those miserable seasons.

Harden is a guarented starter pretty much anywhere in the league bar Miami and Lakers. so id love his offensive bang.

Ibaka on the other hand is the type of strong physical beast in the pain that i want for this team. Adds a scary presence with KG and i also think he can score alot more points than he is now when he has someone like rondo feeding him the ball in the low post and the close range jumper (which he does have!) than westbrook hefting up bricks every third shot.

Its hard, because starting next year with the amount of money that OKC has wound up in Durant, Westbrook and Perkins already it would be interesting to see what they could offer these 2 guys. Harden could demand 7-8 mil a year and Ibaka almost the same (3 year 15-20 mil deal) would seem something right.

Either way. Harden would give us that immediate bang for offence and Ibaka would just create a crazy defensive presence with also the ability to put up 10 points a game imo. A Green Bradley Ibaka bench could be quite scary. Ibaka could also fill in at the 5 if we played small ball which we have done a bit this season.

[RyNye]

I have a hard time believing the Thunder aren't going to make a push to keep Ibaka. Obviously they would love to keep both, but without the Serge Protector their interior presence gets a lot thinner, and they are forced to be even more of a jump shooting team than they already are. They need to keep him and develop his offensive game close to the basket. I think Harden is more realistic, though I am afraid both could get overpaid (especially Ibaka).

[chambers]

I am of the school of thought that guards and SFs are easier to replace that good big men. Just like I am willing to let Ray walk and we sign a cheaper SG who can create own shots.

Ibaka is only 22 years old and already has an OK offense and phenomenal defense.For every james harden out there, there is an Afflalo, J.R smith, Marshon Brooks lol,etc, who can do the same job for half the money.

Iblocka please.

You're seriously putting those bums(Afflalo, J.R Smith) on the same level as James Harden? That's what they are. Bums. Perhaps not Marshon Brooks, but he isn't half the player that James Harden is.
What championship team are those guys playing the starting 2 guard for?

[chambers]

I like Ibaka for this team better, now.  He is the type of physical PF that would go nicely with KG at C. 

I strongly disagree.
It's much harder to develop a player like Harden than it is Ibaka.
Our team needs scoring- our defense is a given, does Ibaka really give us that much more than Bass does now?
I think if we go after a big, they have to have some element of inside offense.
Can you imagine if we had Harden playing instead of Bradley?
Our offense needs someone like Harden who can create his own shot. He's like a 25 year old version of Ray Allen and he's smart as hell on the court.
Put it this way, Harden's scoring and production running the floor with Rondo would give our team much more than sliding Ibaka into the 4 with KG. Ibaka is a solid player-an anthlete in a 6 feet 10 body, but he's a role player at best. Harden is a potential superstar/perennial All Star caliber player that can defend, run and shoot the lights out.
Harden all day for our current team and for the future.

Ibaka is a strong defender, strong rebounder and an elite shot blocker. 

Bass is a good defender, average to weak rebounder and a good outside shooter. 


They provide different things. 

The Celtics need more rebounds and a guy that makes players think twice about attacking the rim. 

The Celtics have the best defense in the NBA.
I'd say we are covered there for now. We are terrible at rebounding but we are also a team that purposely forgoes rebounding offensively to run back and set up that number one defense.
We have one player that can create his own jumpshot. We have an aging two guard who we have had to replace with a defensive specialist. Harden is an excellent defender who could quite easily average 22-25 points a game as a starter. He can defend any starting two guard in the league with no problems.
He is a natural scorer but works his butt off on defense as well.
I can't see any other young player in the NBA that comes near this guy as far as two guards go. As I said before, maybe Eric Gordon, but he still isn't on Harden's level as a complete basketball player at such a young age. (shooting, defense, BBall IQ).
Ibaka is great but he is much more replaceable as an offensively limited big man who gets a lot of blocks, ie; a  poor mans Dwight Howard.

[More Banners]

Harden reminds me of Ben Gordon:  Thriving in his role, but not worth huge, huge money.

OKC matches $10M per, IMO.

[Kane3387]

Yes. Both are very good players and it will be hard for OKC to keep both.

[TripleOT]

Both guys are under contract for next year, and will be restricted FAs the following summer, so nothing is imminent.  If OKC wants to play with the big boys, they'll have to pay with the big boys.  KD, Westy and Perk will make around $44m combined then.

Give both of them back loaded deals starting at $10m per year before they hit the market, and the Thunder will have $64m wrapped up in their five best players - not unusual for contending teams, but a little high for a small market one.  OKC is a small market, but ownership has relatively deep pockets.

If ownership doesn't want to pay, Perk's the logical guy to go in two seasons.  If Harden  and Ibaka both want to get paid more than $10m at the beginning of the new deal, OKC will have to make moves.  

I'll take wither one of them on the Cs in two seasons, and both will probably be worth max money to a team without two superstars in front of them.  If DeAndre Jordan can get $10m+ per, Ibaka is worth at least as much.  Manu is a good comp for Harden and he's an $11m player.  

I think OKC retains them both.  

[bdm860]

Anybody catch the last line of the article lol.

"I'd keep both," wrote an Eastern Conference general manager, "and get rid of Perkins."

The thing about both Ibaka and Harden, is I wonder how good they'd look somewhere else.

Would Harden look as good if he was your teams starter and primary scorer?  What happens when he has to guard and gets guarded by LeBron all game?  What about when he has to guard Durant?  I know the appeal of just about any other city beats OKC, and you only get so many chances to earn max money, but would you rather be James Worthy or Manu Ginobili in OKC, or would you rather be like Shawn Marion (with Phoenix) or Al Harrington (in his first Indiana stint) playing on a contending team but then wanting to go someplace else for a bigger role?

And it's similar with Ibaka.  I don't want to bring up an old argument (and get off topic about what Perk brings), but playing next to a guy like Perk makes Ibaka look better.  Just look at last year, in the first 65 games without Perk, Ibaka was averaging 2.2 bpg, the 17 games with Perk last year his averaged jumped to 3.2.  But maybe Ibaka is like Perk on the C's, where Perk looked great on the C's, but not so great in OKC.  Ibaka would look good next to KG, but maybe not on a lot of other teams.

I love the way OKC is built now and I think both Harden and Ibaka thrive in their current roles.  I would gladly take either on the C's though.

[indeedproceed]

Harden. People keep saying he's a 3. He can play the 2 or the 3, and he'll be an all-star.

Its true that its easier to find a 'kinda good' swingman who does a lot of what Harden does than it is to find a starting caliber 4 who does a lot of what Ibaka does, but I think there are only 2 SG's better than Harden in the league right now. Wade and Bryant. After the way Harden's played (and stayed healthy), he's answered a lot of the questions people have had about him.

Ibaka is a very good player, but he's not as high up on the food chain as Howard at his own position.

[Fafnir]

Harden is more of a finished product, a more sure thing.

Ibaka still has lot of potential in his game that needs to be fulfilled. He needs to develop offensively and defensively beyond blocked shots.

I'm not sure whom I'd rather pursue though,probably Harden.

[colincb]

If I had to take one or the other, I'd take Harden.  I can get defensive PFs easier than guys that can create their own shot.

However, I don't think we'll be going after either of them come the summer of 2013. We've either re-signed KG and RA for 2 or more years and have no cap left OR we're rebuilding and both KG and RA are gone of their own accord or because DA blew it up. I think it's very unlikely that the Celtics retain or can retain KG or RA on a non-contending team given our cap situation. If we're rebuilding, neither OKC player fits the plan of being really bad to accumulate young assets to build upon or trade.  

If we exit the playoffs early, we rebuild. If we're a late exit we don't if KG and RA want to stay and I have no idea what happens in-between.

[alajet]

As the subject asks Ibaka OR Harden, that's a lock, you go after either one if available
Of course, probably I'd have to make a choice and I'd go with James Harden in such a situation. As a bench player getting stuck behind Westbrook and Durant in terms of stardom, I guess he may have an extra gear in his pocket as a true building block playing around 40-minute mark.
Ibaka is an elite shot blocker, but I watched him playing for Spain in Eurobasket and he looked lost. Of course, that was almost a year ago. Even so, he may be more open to getting distracted than Harden is.
This became my reasoning en route to James Harden selection

[KGs Knee]

First, I'm a little confused as to why some people are callinf Harden a SF.  Harden is no SF.  He is a 6'5" SG who plays like a SG.  If anything, he is more PG than SF.

As far as keeping either Ibaka or Harden, Clay Bennet better pony-upand pay the darn tax.  That team is too good to let some stupid luxury tax get in the way.

This is what really ticks me off.  Here you have a team that built itself up through the draft.  They're young players got good together, but eventually might be broken up, because what?  They got too good?  That's horse poo!

It's the same thing that ticks me off about the NFL & NHL, well it's even worse in those sports as they have actual hard salary caps.  Ugh, I hate financial constrictions.

[Eddie20]

Anybody catch the last line of the article lol.

"I'd keep both," wrote an Eastern Conference general manager, "and get rid of Perkins."

Probably Danny

[wiley]

I think Perk has been great for that team, especially with intangibles.  But of course
he'd be the one to go....

for the Celtics I'd take Ibaka over Harden if it were either or.
Sometimes he scores,
and he might score a lot with Rondo and no Durant or Westbrook around....