The "we're old" complaint

[winsomme]

While this complaint isn't inaccurate, it seems largely irrelevant to me. Trying to get younger by unloading Ray and KG is just going to turn this team into a jumbled mess IMO but also not make us bad enough to get a really high draft pick...that is to say, it would give us the worst of both worlds.

also, all this capspace we have is going to be spent on who exactly?

I think this core deserves a real shot this season and I don't think Danny has yet given it to them. Going into the season with no legit starting center (on a team that prides itself on and feeds off of defense) and no backup PG is a recipe for disaster...and that is what we are getting right now.

our defense is not good and it is demoralizing. You can see it on the players' faces. every time they need to get a stop on defense another player seems to break down what the Cs are doing and get a relatively easy bucket.

also the second unit seems discombobulated when Rondo is not in there. who is gonna run the show without Rondo because Dooling is really a SG?

I hate to be the broken record here, but Danny needs a huge thumbs down for trading Perk and then not filling his spot. Legit defensive centers are hard to find and he should have known that.

Let's be clear:
HE HAS TO GET A STARTING CENTER.

reasons like not wanting to tie up cap space are faulty IMO because again who are we going to spend the money on? really?

The fact that there isn't universal acceptance of the team's need for a center (mostly with Danny) is very perplexing to me. Why can't he see how much better this team would be with a legit center? Why isn't finding one his main focus? It just doesn't seem that he is that concerned with the hole we have in the middle. I really feel like he thinks JO is adequate.

JO is a fine back up center, but he plays with little intensity and that spreads like a virus. He seems so lackadaisical out there and with our starting unit it is lethal. Our first quarters are abysmal.

I think we need to disabuse ourselves of this notion that we need to focus on getting younger. The pathway to a young contending team just isn't there right now. We need to focus on giving this current team what it needs to compete. Not doing so is backwards thinking.

Danny has said if things don't improve he may make major changes. This is a setup IMO because we don't have the ingredients right now to do what he is asking. This current Cs incarnation has always been dependent on teamwork and more specifically team defense. and with no defensive presence in the middle it's like pouring water into a bag with a hole in it.

Patch the hole, Danny. Please give this team a real chance to compete this year.

[MBunge]

Let's be clear:
HE HAS TO GET A STARTING CENTER.

Danny got a starting center in the Perk trade.  Krstic was the starter for OKC and basically split time with Ibaka.  I don't think you can blame Ainge for the lockout chasing Krstic away.  If anyone on the Celtics deserves blame for losing Krstic it's Doc, who decided he'd rather watch Big Baby stink the joint out during the playoffs rather than play Krstic.

Mike

[Celtics18]

Let's be clear:
HE HAS TO GET A STARTING CENTER.

Danny got a starting center in the Perk trade.  Krstic was the starter for OKC and basically split time with Ibaka.  I don't think you can blame Ainge for the lockout chasing Krstic away.  If anyone on the Celtics deserves blame for losing Krstic it's Doc, who decided he'd rather watch Big Baby stink the joint out during the playoffs rather than play Krstic.

Mike

That's not a fair or even accurate assessment.  Krstic would have been a crucial piece to our playoff roster last year if it weren't for the fact that he got injured late in the season and wasn't even available for most of the playoffs.  By the time he was ready to go, it was too late.  It wasn't Doc's fault.  It was the fault of that unfortunate NBA demon known as injury troubles.

[MBunge]

Let's be clear:
HE HAS TO GET A STARTING CENTER.

Danny got a starting center in the Perk trade.  Krstic was the starter for OKC and basically split time with Ibaka.  I don't think you can blame Ainge for the lockout chasing Krstic away.  If anyone on the Celtics deserves blame for losing Krstic it's Doc, who decided he'd rather watch Big Baby stink the joint out during the playoffs rather than play Krstic.

Mike

That's not a fair or even accurate assessment. 

I'm not exactly sure where this "Krstic was hurt" excuse started, but it's bogus.

Krstic got hurt in the March 31st game against the Spurs and was listed as day-to-day with a bone bruise.  Following that, Krstic played...

18 minutes on April 5th
18 minutes on April 7th
27 minutes on April 8th
12 minutes on April 10th
16 minutes on April 11th
25 minutes on April 13th.

The playoffs started on April 17th and Krstic played 5, 3, 8 and 8 minutes in the sweep of the Knicks.  He then played 6 minutes in the first game against Miami, 11 minutes in the second, didn't play at all in games 3 and 4 and played 16 minutes in game 5.

He wasn't hurt.  He wasn't playing bad.  Somebody else wasn't taking his minutes because they were playing great.  Doc just flat out decided to drastically cut Krstic' minutes in the playoffs.  Shaq was out.  Jermaine wasn't playing that well.  Baby was just awful.  But Doc was simply NOT going to play Krstic.  Could we please stop pretending otherwise?

Mike

[Who]

It's not like Danny has a lot of options at the minute (to acquire a legit C).

The trade coffers are pretty bare.

[Celtics18]

Let's be clear:
HE HAS TO GET A STARTING CENTER.

Danny got a starting center in the Perk trade.  Krstic was the starter for OKC and basically split time with Ibaka.  I don't think you can blame Ainge for the lockout chasing Krstic away.  If anyone on the Celtics deserves blame for losing Krstic it's Doc, who decided he'd rather watch Big Baby stink the joint out during the playoffs rather than play Krstic.

Mike

That's not a fair or even accurate assessment. 

I'm not exactly sure where this "Krstic was hurt" excuse started, but it's bogus.

Krstic got hurt in the March 31st game against the Spurs and was listed as day-to-day with a bone bruise.  Following that, Krstic played...

18 minutes on April 5th
18 minutes on April 7th
27 minutes on April 8th
12 minutes on April 10th
16 minutes on April 11th
25 minutes on April 13th.

The playoffs started on April 17th and Krstic played 5, 3, 8 and 8 minutes in the sweep of the Knicks.  He then played 6 minutes in the first game against Miami, 11 minutes in the second, didn't play at all in games 3 and 4 and played 16 minutes in game 5.

He wasn't hurt.  He wasn't playing bad.  Somebody else wasn't taking his minutes because they were playing great.  Doc just flat out decided to drastically cut Krstic' minutes in the playoffs.  Shaq was out.  Jermaine wasn't playing that well.  Baby was just awful.  But Doc was simply NOT going to play Krstic.  Could we please stop pretending otherwise?

Mike

Fair enough.  I remembered it wrong, but Nenad did miss a couple of games after injuring his knee against the Spurs on April 1st.  This coincided with Jermaine O'Neal's return to the roster.

I haven't looked up JO's numbers in those games, but many felt (I guess Doc included) that JO's defensive presence made him worth playing over Curly once the big Serb returned. 

It wasn't Baby getting minutes as opposed to Krstic, it was Jermaine O'Neal getting those minutes.  Like it or not, Davis was getting his minutes regardless of who was starting at center. 

[indeedproceed]

While this complaint isn't inaccurate, it seems largely irrelevant to me.

You think the fact that your three highest paid (and logically best) players are 34, 35, and 36 years old, while your starting center is 33 years old and so fragile that he contemplated retirement is inaccurate and irrelevant?

We are old. That's both accurate and relevant.

(I read the post, I just think the starting point was off)

[cman88]

Kendrick perkins would not help us this year, or in the future.

tying up 8million$ in a defensive center who is an offensive liability for a team who is going to be rebuilding relatively soon wouldve been a BAD idea.

jeff green at least gives danny some need for what he may need once the big 3 retire..scoring

[Marcus13]

ugh we knew we were gonna be old coming into the season.

Truth is, we sacrificed this season in order to have one more shot at it last year

[Meadowlark_Scal]

Let's be clear:
HE HAS TO GET A STARTING CENTER.

Danny got a starting center in the Perk trade.  Krstic was the starter for OKC and basically split time with Ibaka.  I don't think you can blame Ainge for the lockout chasing Krstic away.  If anyone on the Celtics deserves blame for losing Krstic it's Doc, who decided he'd rather watch Big Baby stink the joint out during the playoffs rather than play Krstic.

Mike

That's not a fair or even accurate assessment. 

I'm not exactly sure where this "Krstic was hurt" excuse started, but it's bogus.

Krstic got hurt in the March 31st game against the Spurs and was listed as day-to-day with a bone bruise.  Following that, Krstic played...

18 minutes on April 5th
18 minutes on April 7th
27 minutes on April 8th
12 minutes on April 10th
16 minutes on April 11th
25 minutes on April 13th.

The playoffs started on April 17th and Krstic played 5, 3, 8 and 8 minutes in the sweep of the Knicks.  He then played 6 minutes in the first game against Miami, 11 minutes in the second, didn't play at all in games 3 and 4 and played 16 minutes in game 5.

He wasn't hurt.  He wasn't playing bad.  Somebody else wasn't taking his minutes because they were playing great.  Doc just flat out decided to drastically cut Krstic' minutes in the playoffs.  Shaq was out.  Jermaine wasn't playing that well.  Baby was just awful.  But Doc was simply NOT going to play Krstic.  Could we please stop pretending otherwise?

Mike

Doc has always done things like that, that no one can explain..except maybe an insider...it is why i don't care for doc as a coach...same as why he plays marquis danials...no reason to play that guy, ever...The Celts aren't that old. they are that out of shape.

[winsomme]

While this complaint isn't inaccurate, it seems largely irrelevant to me.

You think the fact that your three highest paid (and logically best) players are 34, 35, and 36 years old, while your starting center is 33 years old and so fragile that he contemplated retirement is inaccurate and irrelevant?

We are old. That's both accurate and relevant.

(I read the post, I just think the starting point was off)

No I think it is accurate observation but irrelevant in terms of figuring out how to move forward. I think we have a high talent level with glaring holes. Even in our Title season our core was old. Heck the pieces we added to put us over the top were Posey and PJ Brown.

I think KG, Ray, and Paul are capable of playing at a high enough level to start and win, but JO is not. We need a center to make the system that Doc runs work and I am beyond dismayed that Danny either doesn't realized this or can't remedy it.

[Neurotic Guy]

It's not like Danny has a lot of options at the minute (to acquire a legit C).

The trade coffers are pretty bare.

Not sure why we couldn't get Gortat or Varejao.  JOs expiring adds to either team's considerable cap space. We have 2 #1's and a high #2 (NJ) to dangle.  Also, Bradley or JJJ may have a little add-in value.  I don't think I'd want DA to do this (hurts the rebuild too much), but if he thought a defensive/rebounding center would be a difference-maker for this team, either Gortat or AV are legit.

[Who]

It's not like Danny has a lot of options at the minute (to acquire a legit C).

The trade coffers are pretty bare.

Not sure why we couldn't get Gortat or Varejao.  JOs expiring adds to either team's considerable cap space. We have 2 #1's and a high #2 (NJ) to dangle.  Also, Bradley or JJJ may have a little add-in value.  I don't think I'd want DA to do this (hurts the rebuild too much), but if he thought a defensive/rebounding center would be a difference-maker for this team, either Gortat or AV are legit.

Yeah, I think Varejao may be a possibility. The Cavs are in a full blown rebuilding mode and those two first rounders may have more value to them than Varejao. Maybe.

Doubtful that Phoenix would move Gortat though. They are still in a win-now mode with Steve Nash there. If they moved Nash, then they may be willing to consider something like this but I doubt they do so before then.

And if Cleveland refuse to move Varejao, what other options are available for that trade package? To add a legitimate starting center with that trade package? It looks to me that there are very little options elsewhere for Danny to turn to.

[winsomme]

It's not like Danny has a lot of options at the minute (to acquire a legit C).

The trade coffers are pretty bare.

Not sure why we couldn't get Gortat or Varejao.  JOs expiring adds to either team's considerable cap space. We have 2 #1's and a high #2 (NJ) to dangle.  Also, Bradley or JJJ may have a little add-in value.  I don't think I'd want DA to do this (hurts the rebuild too much), but if he thought a defensive/rebounding center would be a difference-maker for this team, either Gortat or AV are legit.

I would take either would certainly give up a #1 pick to get them. The rebuild options out there are way more suspect that actually giving our current core another shot at a Title...

[nicknorman]

It's not like Danny has a lot of options at the minute (to acquire a legit C).

The trade coffers are pretty bare.

Not sure why we couldn't get Gortat or Varejao.  JOs expiring adds to either team's considerable cap space. We have 2 #1's and a high #2 (NJ) to dangle.  Also, Bradley or JJJ may have a little add-in value.  I don't think I'd want DA to do this (hurts the rebuild too much), but if he thought a defensive/rebounding center would be a difference-maker for this team, either Gortat or AV are legit.

I would take either would certainly give up a #1 pick to get them. The rebuild options out there are way more suspect that actually giving our current core another shot at a Title...

I would just give this season a little more time.  If we are actually as bad as we have been playing Gortat or Varajeo are not going to turn it around. 

I think we have a good team, its just that Paul and KG are out of shape from spending the summer negotiating, they should get it back.  Maybe sign Pryz when he comes out of retirement.  But keep those picks unless something great comes along at the deadline.