Author Topic: Johnson & Moore evaulations  (Read 5975 times)

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Johnson & Moore evaulations
« on: January 05, 2012, 01:00:40 PM »

Offline ScoobyDoo

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What do you guys think of these two rookies, based on the limited sampling we've had. Here's my quick evaluations, would be interested in your impressions:

E'Tuan Moore:
I think he will stick as a bench player. I think he has a well rounded, overall and he's intelligent enough to make up for his lack of top tier athleticism
* I think if you leave him open, he will hurt you quickly because you can tell he can stroke it pretty good. I think he's an excellent shooter.
* I like his versatility being able to handle the ball.
* Think he has potential to be a good, long term role player for us.
* As he hits the weight room and gets stronger, he has the potential to be suprisingly good.

JuJuan Johnson:
I'm not as bullish on this kid yet. I was really excited when we drafted him but I have some concerns after seeing him on the court.
* Number one, he's paper thin. "Paper thin". I knew he was skinny but not "that" skinny. This is fine if he has a frame that can easily add muscle, but I'm not sure he can and if he can't he's going to continue to get tossed all over the place out there.
* He also seems completely out of place on D.

I know he's young, but unless he can add 20-30 lbs of body strength, probably equally split top and bottom...I don't know if he can hang with the big guys in the league.

Positives:
* I can see the athleticism, which is pretty solid for a big guy.
* I know he can shoot
* Good motor and long arms
* Have heard he is a great kid, great attitude - this is a  plus

But the strength / weight thing is going to be a major issue to me. He's built like an off guard. If he can add 20-30 pounds I think he has a shot as a role player. But if can't I think it's going to be tough sledding for him.

Thoughts? 

 
 
     

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2012, 01:08:11 PM »

Offline RajonRondOWNED

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I think both JJJ and Moore will be incredibly overlooked by the Celtics coaching staff, and get little to no playing time.

Then over time they will either be traded, or eventually sign elsewhere, and become stars. And then on his deathbed Doc Rivers will apologize to Celtics fans across the globe for hating rookies so much.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2012, 01:12:28 PM »

Offline ScoobyDoo

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:)

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2012, 01:32:10 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I don't think either are good enough yet to crack this team's rotation and will be playing in the D-league soon enough. I think a lack of Summer League, being around the coaching and training staff all summer, and almost no training camp and pre-season to speak of have really hurt both players.

Danny and Doc will send them to Portland where they will get some run and then next year they will come to camp knowledgeable in the Celtics way of doing things and maybe show something. I just don't see them doing anything to help this team on the court this year.

Too bad because I think they both have potential though I don't think either has potential to be anything but bench players on a contending team. They might top out as fringe starters on a bad team.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2012, 01:35:45 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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Both Johnson and Moore bring next nothing at this point. Here's to hoping they may be more ready to contribute at this time next season.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2012, 01:39:59 PM »

Offline Fafnir

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Both Johnson and Moore bring next nothing at this point. Here's to hoping they may be more ready to contribute at this time next season.
Yeah given the constraints of training camp and practice due to the lockout both really should be sent to the d-league to get some playing time.

When you're the 6th wing and 6th big man on any team you're just not getting any playing time.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2012, 01:45:29 PM »

Online Who

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No interest in E.Moore. Not an NBA level athlete. Too small, dodgy athleticism. Cannot defend or rebound his position (SG). His only chance at hanging around in the NBA is to convert to the PG position but he can't defend that position either.

I would rather waive E.Moore and create an open roster spot. Bring in someone like Keith Bogans (fifth wing, extra defender/shooter) or Eric Dampier (third string C, physical toughness, post defense) who can provide something useful for the team this season.

I think Moore is best off returning to Europe where he could be a JC Navarro type player/star.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #7 on: January 05, 2012, 01:54:24 PM »

Offline Texstyles

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I think they are 2 players who have not really gotten a chance.  Moore has done better of the 2 because he seems to find his shot here and there.  As for JJJ I think his oportunities have not come yet, and when they do he tries to do something that he can't ( game is to fast for him )  Everytime i see him on the court I feal bad because the players with the ball are more about impressing the coaching staff then playing as a team.  There are countless times where he will set a pick and then role but the ball does not come his way. As for the size thing I agree 1000% I think he is built and his style of play is more suited as a SF ( K.Durant, Reshard Lewis type) for the NBA. I dont think he is capable of putting to 20 to 30 pounds that he needs to play PF in this league.  I would love for them to convert him to a SF because thats where I think he  can be more successful in this league.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #8 on: January 05, 2012, 01:56:29 PM »

Offline YouGotRondo d

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Haven't really noticed JJohnson out there.. he really doesn't stand out. I did notice that he doesn't post up. Probably due to the aforementioned skinniness.


Moore is definitely not ready to step in defensively, (as I think Who pointed out before) but he is definitely ready to compete offensively.

He shows a strong jump shot, but more importantly, he knows how to set up his man to get open for those shots. He also shows the patience to be able to let plays develop without trying to do too much.

This kind of intelligence, (which will develop further playing behind Allen, Pierce and Daniels), leads me to believe this kid is a future rotation player in this league.

I only wish he had a bit more athleticism. As someone mentioned before, I wish we could take Bradley and Moore and combine all their best attributes. This deficiency means that he will likely never be a starter drawing the assignment of a guy like DWade.

Still, he's a great talent for a late 2nd round pick.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #9 on: January 05, 2012, 01:56:43 PM »

Online Who

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JaJuan Johnson looks interesting.

Long term, worried about his physique and whether he has enough physical toughness about him to become a quality defender at the PF position. I think an Amir Johnson type defender may be the best case scenario. However, a Brandan Wright level defender may be the most likely one.

Short term, defensive fundamentals both in man-to-man and team defense look very poor. They'll need a lot of work before he is ready to give the C's quality minutes. Can only give the C's spot minutes against specific matchups (low quality opposition) due to his weak D.

Impressed by quickness and offensive range. Transition play, spot up shooting (midrange and long two pointers), both pick and roll and pick and pop type action, cutter, finisher around the basket. Has the capacity to become a high level (role player) offensive threat.

Hard to say much about his rebounding. Need to see more of him. Appears to be a serviceable but unexceptional rebounder (doesn't seem to have much of a nose/hunger for the ball) but a guy with his combination of quickness and length will always have tremendous potential on the boards. Coaching + mentoring will matter a great deal here.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2012, 02:35:53 PM »

Offline edwardjkasche

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Because the Celts have their system firmly in place, and they have players available at the positions played by ETM and JJJ, there is no reason to play either of them much this season.  Garbage minutes is all they deserve at this point.  Neither has had a full training camp or a dozen practices, and neither has the experience and know-how of Daniels, Dooling or Bass, or even Wilcox and Stiemsma (who is 26 yo).  Bradley cut his teeth in practice and the D-League last year, and these two will have to do the same. 

Now, if JJJ was 6'11" and weighed 260lbs, I'd push for him to play, but he isn't, and Stiemsma is, which is a big reason why he's getting playing time.

The best future for these two is cutting their teeth this year, listening to the vets, packing on some muscle, and coming back next year for a full training camp.  There will inevitably be big turnover on next year's squad, and each of these guys will probably have a better shot at playing time. 

Comparing them to other rookies on crappy teams is ill-conceived.  Marshon Brooks is taking the second-most shots on a team with the second-worst offense in the league.  With Deron Williams out, he's the Nets only capable offensive player who can create his own shot; the Nets' offensive system is terrible and they don't have the right players to put together a functional system.  On the Celtics, he'd be in exactly the same bench spot as ETM. 

As long as ETM and JJJ keep their spirits up and continue working hard, there is no reason to doubt either of them.  At best, they'll both become key contributors down the line.  At worst, they'll up their trade value.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #11 on: January 05, 2012, 02:55:29 PM »

Offline ianboyextreme

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No interest in E.Moore. Not an NBA level athlete. Too small, dodgy athleticism. Cannot defend or rebound his position (SG). His only chance at hanging around in the NBA is to convert to the PG position but he can't defend that position either.

I would rather waive E.Moore and create an open roster spot. Bring in someone like Keith Bogans (fifth wing, extra defender/shooter) or Eric Dampier (third string C, physical toughness, post defense) who can provide something useful for the team this season.

I think Moore is best off returning to Europe where he could be a JC Navarro type player/star.
Oh wow, thanks for the nba scouting report.
I go on Doc and Danny's opinion of players since they are acutally in the nba, and the both of them have spoken very highly of E'twaun Moore, as was everybody on this forum.
What changed yall's mind? That hes not playing? More flip flopping on this forum than a beach.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #12 on: January 05, 2012, 03:10:12 PM »

Offline mqtcelticsfan

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No interest in E.Moore. Not an NBA level athlete. Too small, dodgy athleticism. Cannot defend or rebound his position (SG). His only chance at hanging around in the NBA is to convert to the PG position but he can't defend that position either.

I would rather waive E.Moore and create an open roster spot. Bring in someone like Keith Bogans (fifth wing, extra defender/shooter) or Eric Dampier (third string C, physical toughness, post defense) who can provide something useful for the team this season.

I think Moore is best off returning to Europe where he could be a JC Navarro type player/star.
Oh wow, thanks for the nba scouting report.
I go on Doc and Danny's opinion of players since they are acutally in the nba, and the both of them have spoken very highly of E'twaun Moore, as was everybody on this forum.
What changed yall's mind? That hes not playing? More flip flopping on this forum than a beach.

I don't think there's much flip flopping going on. It's probably a different set of people commenting on him. I've never once thought that Moore was worthy of a rotation spot. NBA evaluators clearly agreed, considering he lasted until one of the last few picks in the draft due to his lack of NBA level athleticism. That lack of athletic ability has been on display so far this season. I think he might stick on as a 12th man due to his ability to shoot the ball when open, but that's it. He's not quick enough to make up for his lack of size at the wing, and he's certainly not quick enough to play PG. You just need to have more athleticism to play guard in the NBA.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2012, 07:05:19 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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No interest in E.Moore. Not an NBA level athlete. Too small, dodgy athleticism. Cannot defend or rebound his position (SG). His only chance at hanging around in the NBA is to convert to the PG position but he can't defend that position either.

I would rather waive E.Moore and create an open roster spot. Bring in someone like Keith Bogans (fifth wing, extra defender/shooter) or Eric Dampier (third string C, physical toughness, post defense) who can provide something useful for the team this season.

I think Moore is best off returning to Europe where he could be a JC Navarro type player/star.
Oh wow, thanks for the nba scouting report.
I go on Doc and Danny's opinion of players since they are acutally in the nba, and the both of them have spoken very highly of E'twaun Moore, as was everybody on this forum.
What changed yall's mind? That hes not playing? More flip flopping on this forum than a beach.
Danny Ainge once called Gabe Pruitt the best perimeter defender we have on this team. He raved about Leon Powe all season long in 2007-08. He had nothing bad to say about Semih Erden.

We are they now?

I say trust your eyes and don't listen to much to what Danny says about players as he is just trying to keep their value high.

Re: Johnson & Moore evaulations
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2012, 07:09:19 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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I don't recall Ainge calling Pruitt the best perimeter defender on the team. Given that we've had Rondo, Posey and Tony Allen on Ainge-managed teams, such a statement is highly unlikely.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."