Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting Whiter lately?

[Celtics4ever]

I don't care who folks hang out with off the court.   As long as it doesn't affect the C's.   Most of these guys are not thugs.

The Celtics broke many racial barriers in professional sports.

[GreenFaith1819]

I don't care who folks hang out with off the court.   As long as it doesn't affect the C's.   Most of these guys are not thugs.

The Celtics broke many racial barriers in professional sports.

All of this - especially the last sentence.

The relationship that Red and Russell had was special. I've read up on it quite a bit the last year or so.

Even after that - Larry and Magic? I'll never forget what those two did the game back in the 80's - and who was one of the first to call Magic after his HIV disclosure?

None other than Larry, I believe.

[GreenFaith1819]

lol...if anything, I hope that the NBA is GREENER - all the way through June of this year.

TP whether you mean the Celtics or being environmentally conscious, you get a TP.

Celtics, of course.

I do my recycling bit, too - but for this reference I meant Celtics Green. .

I want (and expect) to see 15 Green Jerseys on my TV screen in June - preferably dealing out pain and misery to 15 Purple and Gold Jerseys.

[dark_lord]

this is stupid.  who cares

[indeedproceed]

this is stupid.  who cares

Comment is completely counter-productive, and unnecessary.

I'm not knocking the whole 'we're all just people, it shouldn't matter' line of thinking, but as a white American born man, I think it would be cool if there were white American born superstars. People like to root for people they share commonalities with, and race is a point that people can rally around. So is method of upbringing, so is location of birth or 'home town', college attended, etc..

I'm a white American man from a rural area, who never had much growing up. If another white American man from a rural area who never had much growing up ended up taking the league by storm, am I supposed to feel bad if I think that's freakin awesome?

Racism in all its forms is awful. Its ubiquitous and insidious within our culture, and we should actively reflect upon our own preconceptions and subsequent actions on a daily basis to weed our the negative racist ideals, whether conscious or subconscious.

But the notion that the discussion about whether or not the NBA has more AMerican white players than in years past is 'stupid' and inconsequential strikes me as naive in the very least. People care.

If there was a Hispanic version of Michael Phelps, you think much more men and women who share a racial identity with him wouldn't be drawn to swimming? Of course they would. If there was a black Jimmy Johnson you think other black men and women wouldn't watch NASCAR? Of course they would.

And that's why it matters. If we had another white American star on par with Larry Bird, you think ratings wouldn't increase even further? Sure they would. People like to root for people they can see themselves in.

And, as long as we're not disparaging anyone because of their race, nationality, or religious belief, I see no problem in taking note of these things.

[MBz]

this is stupid.  who cares

Comment is completely counter-productive, and unnecessary.

I'm not knocking the whole 'we're all just people, it shouldn't matter' line of thinking, but as a white American born man, I think it would be cool if there were white American born superstars. People like to root for people they share commonalities with, and race is a point that people can rally around. So is method of upbringing, so is location of birth or 'home town', college attended, etc..

I'm a white American man from a rural area, who never had much growing up. If another white American man from a rural area who never had much growing up ended up taking the league by storm, am I supposed to feel bad if I think that's freakin awesome?

Racism in all its forms is awful. Its ubiquitous and insidious within our culture, and we should actively reflect upon our own preconceptions and subsequent actions on a daily basis to weed our the negative racist ideals, whether conscious or subconscious.

But the notion that the discussion about whether or not the NBA has more AMerican white players than in years past is 'stupid' and inconsequential strikes me as naive in the very least. People care.

If there was a Hispanic version of Michael Phelps, you think much more men and women who share a racial identity with him wouldn't be drawn to swimming? Of course they would. If there was a black Jimmy Johnson you think other black men and women wouldn't watch NASCAR? Of course they would.

And that's why it matters. If we had another white American star on par with Larry Bird, you think ratings wouldn't increase even further? Sure they would. People like to root for people they can see themselves in.

And, as long as we're not disparaging anyone because of their race, nationality, or religious belief, I see no problem in taking note of these things.

Exactly, people have an easier time relating to someone who has similar traits to themselves.  None of us can relate to an NBA players basketball skills, but race is something we can relate to.

[Snakehead]

this is stupid.  who cares

Comment is completely counter-productive, and unnecessary.

I'm not knocking the whole 'we're all just people, it shouldn't matter' line of thinking, but as a white American born man, I think it would be cool if there were white American born superstars. People like to root for people they share commonalities with, and race is a point that people can rally around. So is method of upbringing, so is location of birth or 'home town', college attended, etc..

I'm a white American man from a rural area, who never had much growing up. If another white American man from a rural area who never had much growing up ended up taking the league by storm, am I supposed to feel bad if I think that's freakin awesome?

Racism in all its forms is awful. Its ubiquitous and insidious within our culture, and we should actively reflect upon our own preconceptions and subsequent actions on a daily basis to weed our the negative racist ideals, whether conscious or subconscious.

But the notion that the discussion about whether or not the NBA has more AMerican white players than in years past is 'stupid' and inconsequential strikes me as naive in the very least. People care.

If there was a Hispanic version of Michael Phelps, you think much more men and women who share a racial identity with him wouldn't be drawn to swimming? Of course they would. If there was a black Jimmy Johnson you think other black men and women wouldn't watch NASCAR? Of course they would.

And that's why it matters. If we had another white American star on par with Larry Bird, you think ratings wouldn't increase even further? Sure they would. People like to root for people they can see themselves in.

And, as long as we're not disparaging anyone because of their race, nationality, or religious belief, I see no problem in taking note of these things.

This is what I was trying to say about the "who cares" responses, and I think you articulated very well why it's an okay thing to consider and care about as a white person.  Great post, TP.

[indeedproceed]

Exactly, people have an easier time relating to someone who has similar traits to themselves.  None of us can relate to an NBA players basketball skills, but race is something we can relate to.

And, while I think that's a truth in our society (and everyone's society), I think its also important to again stress that its not like people can't root for, support, and be a hardcore fan for people with different racial makeup. THat's obviously not the case.

[GreenFaith1819]

Is there any way we can clone THIS guy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDyBSTQDwH8

I'm a Black man, but I loved Tom Chambers' game.

And of course, there's Larry:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y300SqnSxtw

[OsirusCeltics]

this is stupid.  who cares

Comment is completely counter-productive, and unnecessary.

I'm not knocking the whole 'we're all just people, it shouldn't matter' line of thinking, but as a white American born man, I think it would be cool if there were white American born superstars. People like to root for people they share commonalities with, and race is a point that people can rally around. So is method of upbringing, so is location of birth or 'home town', college attended, etc..

I'm a white American man from a rural area, who never had much growing up. If another white American man from a rural area who never had much growing up ended up taking the league by storm, am I supposed to feel bad if I think that's freakin awesome?

Racism in all its forms is awful. Its ubiquitous and insidious within our culture, and we should actively reflect upon our own preconceptions and subsequent actions on a daily basis to weed our the negative racist ideals, whether conscious or subconscious.

But the notion that the discussion about whether or not the NBA has more AMerican white players than in years past is 'stupid' and inconsequential strikes me as naive in the very least. People care.

If there was a Hispanic version of Michael Phelps, you think much more men and women who share a racial identity with him wouldn't be drawn to swimming? Of course they would. If there was a black Jimmy Johnson you think other black men and women wouldn't watch NASCAR? Of course they would.

And that's why it matters. If we had another white American star on par with Larry Bird, you think ratings wouldn't increase even further? Sure they would. People like to root for people they can see themselves in.

And, as long as we're not disparaging anyone because of their race, nationality, or religious belief, I see no problem in taking note of these things.

Exactly my thinking TP

[Celts Fan 92]

I hope more white players join. Maybe the NBA can lose its "thug" image.

you had to be the one huh? smh wat mysterious "thug image" are you talkin about? the league hasn't been hardcore since 2000-2004 they watered it down a lot fortunately for u this is Celtics blog nd i cant say wat I really want to but ur wrong for this

[nickagneta]

this is stupid.  who cares

Comment is completely counter-productive, and unnecessary.

I'm not knocking the whole 'we're all just people, it shouldn't matter' line of thinking, but as a white American born man, I think it would be cool if there were white American born superstars. People like to root for people they share commonalities with, and race is a point that people can rally around. So is method of upbringing, so is location of birth or 'home town', college attended, etc..

I'm a white American man from a rural area, who never had much growing up. If another white American man from a rural area who never had much growing up ended up taking the league by storm, am I supposed to feel bad if I think that's freakin awesome?

Racism in all its forms is awful. Its ubiquitous and insidious within our culture, and we should actively reflect upon our own preconceptions and subsequent actions on a daily basis to weed our the negative racist ideals, whether conscious or subconscious.

But the notion that the discussion about whether or not the NBA has more AMerican white players than in years past is 'stupid' and inconsequential strikes me as naive in the very least. People care.

If there was a Hispanic version of Michael Phelps, you think much more men and women who share a racial identity with him wouldn't be drawn to swimming? Of course they would. If there was a black Jimmy Johnson you think other black men and women wouldn't watch NASCAR? Of course they would.

And that's why it matters. If we had another white American star on par with Larry Bird, you think ratings wouldn't increase even further? Sure they would. People like to root for people they can see themselves in.

And, as long as we're not disparaging anyone because of their race, nationality, or religious belief, I see no problem in taking note of these things.

By the same token once people start breaking down players according to race, it just continues the perpetual segregation of people based on skin color, ethnicity, sexual preference, etc. It just assists in keeping the differences of people in the limelight no matter how much this country attempts to make sure that such things are taken out of society so that society can kill racial, sexual, and other horrible bias that has existed in this country, to its detriment, for centuries.

People are people. It shouldn't matter what color they are, what religion they are, what ethnicity they are, what sex they are, or what sexual preference they are. Why is this thread allowed to be open and talked about? Because the majority of the participants at this blog are white and so its okay to talk about the amount of white guys in the NBA?

I'm guessing if any of the following subjects were brought up at Celticblog they would get locked and deleted right away:

Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting gayer lately?

Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting Jewisher lately?

Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting African lately?

So why is this any different? Just because I large portion of Celticsblog members are white and identify with white players doesn't make it okay to continue to discuss the segregation of the NBA into parts via racial and color lines.

People are people. Players are players. Can't we just leave it at that?

[indeedproceed]

By the same token once people start breaking down players according to race and it just continues the perpetual segregation of people based on skin color, ethnicity, sexual preference, etc. It just assist in keeping the differences of people in the limelight no matter how much this country attempts to make sure that such things are taken out of society so that society can kill racial, sexual, and other horrible bias that has existed in this country for centuries, to its detriment.

That's a heck of a snowball theory you've got there. The difference, Nick, is that everything I'm talking about is positive. If I see a player I particularly identify with and his race is a part of that I don't think its a negative thing, anymore than I would think it negative if a french person rooted harder for Tony Parker than he did for Dirk Nowitzki, based mostly on nationality.

The line as I said before, and as you alluded to, is when you are negatively rating other players based on race.

Examples:

1) I like Larry Bird. There aren't that many white guys out there who can ball like he can, and he grew up kinda like I did. I feel a common bond with him.

2) I hate watching the NBA because its just a bunch of thug trash.

One example is hate speech. That example is clearly not okay. To me however, there is a very discernible difference between example number 1 and example number 2, and it lies within its positivity.

It doesn't mean white fans can't like black players, and it doesn't mean black fans can't like white players. You draw your commonalities in this world where you can, and as long as its about love not hate, I don't think there is anything wrong with it.

People are people. It shouldn't matter what color they are, what religion they are, what ethnicity they are, what sex they are, or what sexual preference they are.

People should never be discriminated against because of those things, and since you've been around here a while, I'm going to egotistically assume that you have read some of my posts and understand I'm unilaterally passionate and consistent on this issue. But, we're not talking about discrimination here. Therein lies the difference.

Why is this thread allowed to be open and talked about? because the majority of the participants at this blog are white and so its okay to talk about the amount of white guys in the NBA?

I'm guessing if any of the following subjects were brought up at Celticblog they would get locked and deleted right away:

Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting gayer lately?

Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting Jewisher lately?

Is it just me or does the NBA seem to be getting African lately?

That's an interesting question. If a rash of NBA players came out of the closet, do you really think we wouldn't discuss it? We have already discussed Omri Casspi's religion and nationality in great detail. We've talked a lot about foreign players as well.

So why is this any different? Just because I large portion of Celticsblog members are white and identify with white players doesn't make it okay to continue to discuss the segregation of the NBA into parts via racial and color lines.

Nick, if you're going to answer your own questions why do you ask them? (kidding)

I don't think this thread (although to be fair I have not read all 6 pages, I've done most of my commenting from my phone so I don't know if I missed a blowup or something) has done anything wrong along the lines that you're talking about. It was asked if there are more white american players. It was answered, and discussed, without malice or discrimination.

People are people. Players are players. Can't we just leave it at that?

This is going to sound a bit grandstandish, but since you got a little passionate about it, allow me some latitude if you will.

I respect your position on this, but in my opinion, I think what you're doing here is detrimental (not as damaging as discrimination or anything, it just limits the conversation) to the concept of racial equity.

I think that answering any discussion about race, or ethnicity, or any other line you want to use as an example with 'people are people' is just non-productive. We have eyes, he have minds, and we know when there are differences between folks. Our salvation, in my mind, lies not in disregarding race, or sexual orientation, or whatever thing it is that stands as a barrier. Humanity has never, ever done this. It lies in understanding the differences, because hate is begotten by fear, and fear is begotten by a lack of understanding.

I feel like, as long as you ensure a lack of discrimination, and talk candidly, it will increase understanding, and it will decrease the hate.

Parallel goals, but different roads I guess.

[nickagneta]

I will agree to disagree with you IP. I happen to think that the more we segregate people into groups, whether through good intentions or bad, the worse we become as a group. The more opportunity you give to the group to segregate into smaller groups the higher the chance that bad things will come of it.

I like NBA players because of their game, because of who they play for, because of how they comport themselves on and off the court. Their color or race makes no difference to me. I guess if I grew up in an all white area of the country I might feel different. But I'm really glad I don't.

[OttawaCeltic]

Pre-Warning (meaning no one has done this yet):  Please do not go on a racial tangent make bad racial jokes that will force the thread to be locked.  

I was just going to make a joke, noooooooooo