Poll

ABradley made the rotation - Good news or Bad news?

Doc sticks to pecking order...and it's Bradley's turn
18 (32.7%)
Just showcasing the kid
23 (41.8%)
The kid is that good - he deserves it
14 (25.5%)

Total Members Voted: 55

Author Topic: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?  (Read 16159 times)

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Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2012, 10:49:00 AM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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just to add blogging fuel to the avery fire....

bradley does play very good defense, both individual and team. against the wizards he disrupted wall's play in consecutive possessions. i can see why doc plays him for 10-12 minutes a game. let others score and let bradley give problems to the other teams' offense.

it also means the starters and guards off the bench get more rest as well as not having to pick up the other teams offensive guard.

this helps the celtics overall game.

bradley is very athlete and plays very good defense. even his doubters should recognize at least that regardless of his other shortcomings.

the real debate should not be whether he is an nba quality player, but whether he can bring offense to match his defense.

history says he has a chance to be a good scorer. the guy is sitting as the 4th to 5th man off the bench and not taking minutes from anyone who is a proven, good player.

he is very young, sits at the end of the bench, but has the potential to be a good guard. i, for one, thing the celtics should invest in the guy and wait for another 1-2 years before making any final decisions on his future with the team.

sometimes players start slowly then grow their game.
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Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #16 on: January 02, 2012, 10:53:13 AM »

Offline Surferdad

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Sorry but the poll has flaws, mainly that it could be combination of 2 or 3 of these factors as well as other things already discussed like what he is showing in practice.  I voted for "pecking order" even I'm not so naiive to think that's the only reason.

Bradley has a nice jumpshot stroke but the shots just haven't been falling for him.  If they had, we would be praising him as a great pick with a bright future.

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #17 on: January 02, 2012, 11:06:12 AM »

Offline Chief

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I'd think as soon as Pietrus is healthy, we won't see
Bradley much. Also, maybe DA and Doc are showcasing him a little. If I were a NBA GM, I'd like to see some NBA game tape on a player before I traded for him.
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Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #18 on: January 02, 2012, 11:39:55 AM »

Offline MBunge

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Actually Doc did have a choice. For the amount of minutes that Steimsma is playing(about 15 per game) he could have simply split those minutes among Bass, KG, and O'Neal. Its not like any of them are playing huge minutes. But he didn't. He gave the minutes to Steimsma.

Oh, for pete's sake.  The fact that he was giving those minutes to Wilcox in the first place indicates he wasn't comfortable playing Bass at center or increasing KG and JO's minutes. 

Mike

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #19 on: January 02, 2012, 11:59:06 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Actually Doc did have a choice. For the amount of minutes that Steimsma is playing(about 15 per game) he could have simply split those minutes among Bass, KG, and O'Neal. Its not like any of them are playing huge minutes. But he didn't. He gave the minutes to Steimsma.

Oh, for pete's sake.  The fact that he was giving those minutes to Wilcox in the first place indicates he wasn't comfortable playing Bass at center or increasing KG and JO's minutes.  

Mike
You know, I have gone about disproving this theory so many times on this blog, I'm not going to do it again. Doc's detractors are just always going to come up with something

"The Celtics only play defense because of Tom Thibodeau" - Yet Thibs leaves and the Celtics remain one of the best defensive teams around while playing the same defense since before Thibs got here.

"Doc doesn't develop young talent." - Tell that to Mike Miller, Pat Garrity, Rajon Rondo, Glen Davis, Leon Powe, Al Jefferson, Kendrick Perkins, Delonte West, Ryan Gomes, etc.....

"Doc only plays rookies because veteran players get hurt and he has no other choice" - Yet Perkins, Rondo, Miller, Davis, Jefferson, and now Bradley belie that statement.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2012, 12:33:08 PM by nickagneta »

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #20 on: January 02, 2012, 12:10:31 PM »

Offline TripleOT

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I have to question any basketball fan who has watched Bradley  play this season and hasn't realized that the guy totally sucks.   The only acceptable NBA skill shown by Bradley so far is the ability to move his feet and stay in front of his man defensively.  That's it. 

In 32 minutes of basketball, AB has 2 points (16% shooting), 3 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 TO.  That's it. If that's what you want out of your backup SG, good luck to you.  Even if you claim that he's been a shut down defender, it's still not enough to have him on the court with that kind of productivity. 

SGs have to be able to score in the NBA.  Bradley has shown that he can't be a PG.  So far, he has shown that he can't handle the SG position offensively.

Avery Bradley - the Dominic McGuire of shooting guards.  No, Thanks.  According to a poster in the Brooks/JJJ thread, SGs are a dime a dozen.  Danny Ainge should spend a dime and get a real one in here.


Excuse makers - start your postings.

 


 

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #21 on: January 02, 2012, 12:45:18 PM »

Offline ScoobyDoo

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Good post Nick, TP. I'm one who doesn't think Bradley sucks and who thinks we should give him a bit more time.

Here are my excuses:

1. The kid is only 20 or 21. Didn't he play only 1 or 2 years of college ball?

2. He's also a classic tweener - so he is going to have to figure out how to fit and that will take more than 1.1 seasons.

Here is why I wouldn't give up on him, yet:

He was one of the best on ball defenders in his conference as a freshman. There is no question he has NBA athleticism - elite athleticism in fact. I am NOT saying he is Chauncey Billups, but I also remember Chauncey Billups stinking it up in Boston while he was here and we shipped him out before he could figure out who he was as a player.

He's a great defender who puts a lot of pressure on the ball up top. I'd continue to let him develop his defensive ability and I'd also run a few plays for him when he's in.

I'd run him off some screens for mid range jump shots, which he excels at.

I'd also give him an ISO on the wing - see what he can do with it. If he can get by his man and pull up for a mid range baseline jumper or get some lift off attacking the rim - I'd like to see that.

I'm not sure who he'll end up being as a player- he could completely tank. But he's still very young and possesses one of the rarest of NBA skills - defense - and he works hard.

His ball handling is better than last year and I really don't think he's an off guard. I have him work his ball handling night and day. If he can get that down, he can get anywhere on the court and the game will open up for him.

Regarding Stiemsma, I think his minutes shouldn't be cut when Wilcox comes back. He needs some work with one on one post D, but overall all he has a chance to be a very solid back up defensive big.

I think both Stiemsma and Bradley have a chance at being decent rotation players.   

   

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #22 on: January 02, 2012, 12:45:54 PM »

Offline mqtcelticsfan

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I have to question any basketball fan who has watched Bradley  play this season and hasn't realized that the guy totally sucks.   The only acceptable NBA skill shown by Bradley so far is the ability to move his feet and stay in front of his man defensively.  That's it. 
 

That's half of the game of basketball.


Anyway, where is the option for "he's our only option right now because Pietrus is out and Moore, albeit in very short doses, has looked defensively inept?"

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #23 on: January 02, 2012, 12:58:47 PM »

Offline Lord of Mikawa

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He should have stayed in college. That one year did him no good.
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Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #24 on: January 02, 2012, 01:09:42 PM »

Offline Surferdad

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I have to question any basketball fan who has watched Bradley  play this season and hasn't realized that the guy totally sucks.   The only acceptable NBA skill shown by Bradley so far is the ability to move his feet and stay in front of his man defensively.  That's it. 

In 32 minutes of basketball, AB has 2 points (16% shooting), 3 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 TO.  That's it. If that's what you want out of your backup SG, good luck to you.  Even if you claim that he's been a shut down defender, it's still not enough to have him on the court with that kind of productivity. 

SGs have to be able to score in the NBA.  Bradley has shown that he can't be a PG.  So far, he has shown that he can't handle the SG position offensively.

Avery Bradley - the Dominic McGuire of shooting guards.  No, Thanks.  According to a poster in the Brooks/JJJ thread, SGs are a dime a dozen.  Danny Ainge should spend a dime and get a real one in here.


Excuse makers - start your postings.

I hope that wasn't directed at me when I said, "Bradley has a nice jumpshot stroke but the shots just haven't been falling for him.  If they had, we would be praising him as a great pick with a bright future." because I was not making an excuse for Bradley but rather demonstrating how so many fans only think of the last thing they saw from a player.  In fact, I do think Bradley stinks, at least right now. The league has many young players who come in and make an impact right away.  I acknowledge these are typically the better players of the league, but isn't that the point?  How long do we wait to see if Bradley is going to be an impact player or even a decent NBA-level talent?  Why is 20 or 21 considered "still young" when many other guys come straight out of high school and can play?  Bradley's shots are not falling for a reason, namely that he's just not a super-talent.  This is why I think the choices of "pecking order" and "showcasing" are just as legit, and in reality, it's probably a combination of these factors and well as what he's showing in practice, how well he is picking up the team concepts, etc.  He has had a full year under him and is being given a legitimate shot to make the club.  However, if he doesn't show somethning soon, a time will come when Celtics brass are going to cut their losses.



Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #25 on: January 02, 2012, 01:21:29 PM »

Offline MBunge

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You know, I have gone about disproving this theory so many times on this blog, I'm not going to do it again. Doc's detractors are just always going to come up with something

"The Celtics only play defense because of Tom Thibodeau" - Yet Thibs leaves and the Celtics remain one of the best defensive teams around while playing the same defense since before Thibs got here.

"Doc doesn't develop young talent." - Tell that to Mike Miller, Pat Garrity, Rajon Rondo, Glen Davis, Leon Powe, Al Jefferson, Kendrick Perkins, Delonte West, Ryan Gomes, etc.....

"Doc only plays rookies because veteran players get hurt and he has no other choice" - Yet Perkins, Rondo, Miller, Davis, Jefferson, and now Bradley belie that statement.

1.  I can't think of anyone who said Boston only plays defense because of Thibs and it's hardly surprising they've remained a very good defensive team since he left.  However, did ANYONE hail Doc as some sort of defensive guru when he coached in Orlando?

2.  Out of that list of players, how many of them struggled to get any playing time from Doc?  In Rondo's rookie year, the only other guards on the roster were Tony Allen, Delonte West, Sebastian Telfair and Alan Ray AND the team went 24-58, yet Rondo averaged less than 24 minutes a game.

3.  No, they don't.  In almost all of those cases, Doc played them as rookies or young players because he lacked a veteran alternative.  Who was the established veteran Doc sat down in order to play any of those guys?

Mike

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #26 on: January 02, 2012, 01:23:05 PM »

Offline Chris

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it tells me Moore is having trouble learning the plays with the short training camp and no offseason.

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #27 on: January 02, 2012, 01:41:58 PM »

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I have to question any basketball fan who has watched Bradley  play this season and hasn't realized that the guy totally sucks.   The only acceptable NBA skill shown by Bradley so far is the ability to move his feet and stay in front of his man defensively.  That's it. 

In 32 minutes of basketball, AB has 2 points (16% shooting), 3 rebounds, 1 assist, 1 TO.  That's it. If that's what you want out of your backup SG, good luck to you.  Even if you claim that he's been a shut down defender, it's still not enough to have him on the court with that kind of productivity. 

SGs have to be able to score in the NBA.  Bradley has shown that he can't be a PG.  So far, he has shown that he can't handle the SG position offensively.

Avery Bradley - the Dominic McGuire of shooting guards.  No, Thanks.  According to a poster in the Brooks/JJJ thread, SGs are a dime a dozen.  Danny Ainge should spend a dime and get a real one in here.


Excuse makers - start your postings.

 


 

I still think it's too early to write off the kid based on what we've seen in NBA games, which is still fairly limited.

That said, I essentially agree with everything you said, and am not banking on the upcoming Avery Bradley era.

I hope we're wrong

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #28 on: January 02, 2012, 01:47:01 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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need 4th option: There's no other shooting guard Doc can use so Bradley's it for now

Re: Poll: ABradley made the rotation - what does that tells you?
« Reply #29 on: January 02, 2012, 01:48:18 PM »

Offline Marcus13

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That we're not a deep team....at all