Author Topic: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.  (Read 11257 times)

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This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« on: December 03, 2011, 03:09:55 AM »

Offline Greenbean

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Back in 07, would you, as a Celtics fan, want to trade Al Jefferson for Kevin Garnett?

I know for a fact that many didnt. I was certainly on the fence.

Well guess what...KG came here and changed the fortunes of this franchise.

Trust Danny. This guy wants a contender for the next 10 years.

I think he can deliver.

We all love Rondo but he has flaws..like Jefferson.

Its time to trade him while his value is this high.


Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2011, 05:23:18 AM »

Offline LarBrd33

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right... and KG was 32 years old with 12 years in the league already...

Big Al was 22...  It was scary.

Rondo is 25.  CP3 is 26.  We kinda know what these players are at this point.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2011, 06:26:03 AM »

Offline TaxiDriver2500

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Kevin Garnett was a ten time all-star and a former League MVP, and the deal wasnt just for Big Al, he was certainly the centerpiece, but we're there that many people saying "watch, now jefferson is going to blow up in Minnesota and bring his game to KG's level."?  if Minnesota thought of Jefferson as something more than just the next "big name" on their team after KG, why did it take Gerald Green, Ryan Gomes, Sebastian Telfair, and 2 first rounders? (casting aside Theo Ratliff as purely financial balance).

Anyways, dont think that teams are going to willingly give us better players for our crap a la the way McHale hooked us up.
Trades are usually a route of diversifying talent from one position to another, where both teams usually try to equalize and balance their roster (you remember how it was sold to us: "lets trade  Perkins before he walks for a back-up swingman. Weve got Shaq!")

Danny is susceptible to a bad move every once and a while too...
Too much coffee and Gatorade. It's a hell of a mix. If you're ever tired in the morning, just try that mix, and tell me what you think. -Kevin Garnett

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Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2011, 07:23:23 AM »

Offline BballTim

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We all love Rondo but he has flaws..like Jefferson.

Its time to trade him while his value is this high.


  In what way is his value overly high? He just came off a season where his play was well below what it should have been because he struggled with injuries.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2011, 08:46:43 AM »

Offline clover

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Back in 07, would you, as a Celtics fan, want to trade Al Jefferson for Kevin Garnett?

I know for a fact that many didnt. I was certainly on the fence.

Well guess what...KG came here and changed the fortunes of this franchise.

Trust Danny. This guy wants a contender for the next 10 years.

I think he can deliver.

We all love Rondo but he has flaws..like Jefferson.

Its time to trade him while his value is this high.



I'm for the CP trade if DH can come along with it and I bit indifferent otherwise.

But the gap between CP and RR is much smaller than that between KG and AJ.  Rondo is already a two-time All-Star and three-time All-NBA defensive player.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2011, 09:34:25 AM »

Offline Prof. Clutch

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I was holding out hope that they would trade Big Al for Jermaine O'Neal at the time.  Boy am I glad in retrospect that they didn't.  :)  When they pulled the trigger on the KG trade I was hesitant at very first but then I quickly realized the magnitude of what they had just done.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2011, 09:50:34 AM »

Offline BballTim

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I was holding out hope that they would trade Big Al for Jermaine O'Neal at the time.  Boy am I glad in retrospect that they didn't.  :)  When they pulled the trigger on the KG trade I was hesitant at very first but then I quickly realized the magnitude of what they had just done.

  I was opposed to the first rumored KG trade (basically the players that we sent plus the #5 pick) because I didn't think the team was strong enough to win the title and we wouldn't have any assets to add players. I was more in favor of the trade after we got Ray, although I felt that a Perk/Al/PP/RA/RR lineup would be contenders to win the East.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2011, 09:57:25 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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I didn't want to do the first deal that was reported, which included both Big Al and the #5.  I didn't think we'd be able to build a contender around KG and Pierce.

Once we traded for Ray, though, I was excited about bringing KG on board.

EDIT:  Wow.  I just read BBT's post, and I wrote almost the exact same thing.

EDIT 2:  Also, as many of you all probably remember, I was a big advocate of bringing Pau Gasol on board, so long as we could have done it without giving up Big Al.


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Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2011, 10:03:02 AM »

Offline KCattheStripe

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Difference is that Rondo is a top 5 PG and you be trading him for a top 3, but paying the top 3 player 20 Mil a year. Big Al was not a top 5 PF when we traded him, nor is he one now. Additionally, PG is the least important positions to have an elite player ( And certainly to paying a max salary) where as PF is one of the two most important positions to have aan elite player at.  You don't want to have to pay a max contract to a PG and Rondo to Paul is not a 10 Million dollar a year upgrade.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2011, 10:12:34 AM »

Offline Inside-Out

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I didn't want to do the first deal that was reported, which included both Big Al and the #5.  I didn't think we'd be able to build a contender around KG and Pierce.

Once we traded for Ray, though, I was excited about bringing KG on board.

EDIT:  Wow.  I just read BBT's post, and I wrote almost the exact same thing.

EDIT 2:  Also, as many of you all probably remember, I was a big advocate of bringing Pau Gasol on board, so long as we could have done it without giving up Big Al.

I was pretty nervous that Danny would capitulate and give up Al plus the #5, too.  The idea of getting KG just seemed too good...but with just Pierce/KG, it seemed like a 2nd round team.  Of course, at the time it was reported KG wouldn't sign an extension (around draft time when we got Ray), so that might have more to do with it.

Major, major props to Danny for sticking to his guns and getting the most for his assets.

As far as Rondo goes, like most star players, it's hard to get good value in return.  I'm not sold on him as the PG to build around, though.  I think the talent of Ray, PP, and KG made it work, but with (presumed) less talent/experience, it will be difficult for other players to get open playing 4 on 5 while Rondo holds the ball.

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2011, 10:36:13 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I too trust Danny but a lot don't after the KP trade.  Truth is we were never going to be able to sign Perk for what he wanted to be paid.   So Danny got something for nothing although it definitely hurt us in the playoffs.

I was upset when we traded Al.   I was emotionally attached to him but at the same time I was excited we got KG.   Once I saw the Big Three on the floor my disappointment vanished and I knew we were back for real.

I think Danny thinks in moves ahead of time.  We don't always see the endgame because he is making moves that lead to other moves.  I think the Perk trade is one of these.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2011, 10:49:52 AM by Celtics4ever »

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2011, 10:49:57 AM »

Offline clover

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I too trust Danny but a lot don't after the KP.  Truth is we were never going to be able to sign Perk for what he wanted to be paid.   So Danny got something for nothing although it definitely hurt us in the playoffs.

I was upset when we traded Al.   I was emotionally attached to him but at the same time I was excited we got KG.   Once I saw the Big Three on the floor my disappointment vanished and I knew we were back for real.

I think Danny thinks in moves ahead of time.  We don't always see the endgame because he is making moves that lead to other moves.  I think the Perk trade is one of these.

Too be fair, Perk was still recovering and he wasn't providing too much through the playoffs.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2011, 12:08:37 PM by clover »

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2011, 11:15:05 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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Roy very accurately summarized Rondo's game in the "Rondo is angry ..." thread. He's not the best PG in the league - by far - and his game is entirely stagnant. Ergo, I applaud Danny for exploring options to improve this ballclub, for this year and certainly for the future. Danny's job isn't to be a fan and develop allegiances to individual players; it's to put the best ballclub possible on the floor, and if he has a shot at upgrades at any position, I expect him to pursue them. I'm unconcerned about the player reaction to Ainge doing his job.

As for Perkins, I've been consistent throughout: His skillset isn't worth $9 million a year, and unfortunately for OKC, they got a crash course in that with his diminishing returns in the playoffs. I wouldn't blame them if they amnestied that deal. Danny got an asset for which the jury is still out - personally, I'm in the wait and see on the QO mode on that contract.

As for the two trades, Danny was astute enough to cash in on two liquidation sales, acquiring two superstars and first ballot HOFers for virtually nothing. The book is closed on those two trades, and they were heists.
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Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2011, 11:50:08 AM »

Offline manl_lui

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I may not like it, but I trust Danny's decision

yes I was p---ed off when they traded Perkins, but I believe in Danny's judgement. He did get us a championship and we went to the finals TWICE...still got a 62 win record with Garnett out for the season...

He knows what hes doing

Re: This is a question for honest Celtics fans.
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2011, 12:00:37 PM »

Offline xmuscularghandix

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Yes i wanted it.

While i realized Al Jefferson was something special (and young), in my mind i viewed KG as a Kareem Abdul-Jabbar type talent... a player that comes along once every 20-25 years.