Author Topic: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations  (Read 21801 times)

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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #30 on: October 27, 2011, 05:04:39 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

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Worst trade in terms of heartbreak and negative impact on the Celts:
Gerald Henderson + cash for the draft pick which became Lenny Bias.

Ironically, it could have been the BEST trade.

Very smart Auerbachian move which turned into tragedy for a young man and his family and our beloved Cs and hurt us for 2 decades, so technically a GREAT trade with a horrendous,devastating result.

Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #31 on: October 27, 2011, 05:18:09 PM »

Offline Gomesfan

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Joe Johnson for Rodney Rogers and Tony Delk.

While those players worked out well for us in the short term, we could have traded Kedrick Brown instead of Joe Johnson.

Just think if Pierce could have had Joe Johnson for all that time as a side kick... We might have been able to form a big three with Pierce a lot earlier.
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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #32 on: October 27, 2011, 05:22:39 PM »

Offline Gomesfan

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the perk trade i now some may & will agree but i cant remember how 1 trade changed the whole season alone
I liked the Perk trade when it happened and I like it now!!!
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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #33 on: October 27, 2011, 05:45:37 PM »

Offline throwedoff

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In my lifetime either the Joe Johnson deal or the Antione deal the guys from the Johnson deal at least contributed, it was hard to watch Jiri Welcsh nd Raef get a considerable amount of playing time

Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #34 on: October 27, 2011, 06:16:15 PM »

Offline 2short

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It was a bad trade, but I did actually enjoy watching Kenny Anderson play. I'm nearly 28, and he was the first pure point guard I got to see play for the green. He had some terrible habits, but I'd never seen someone with that kind of handle and flash.

Another worst move: Didn't Pitino cut/waive David Wesley?
I think it was Fox, wesley I seem to remember left for FA (too smart to hang around)

West walked in free agency.  Fox did as well, although his Bird Rights were first renounced, so Pitino could sign Travis Knight I believe.

As for the Anderson trade, I am semi-ok with that.  He really did give the C's some good years, and Billups did take a while to develop, even after the trade.  It wasn't a good deal, but it was semi-defensible. 
ahh travis knight and didn't pitino sign him to some crazy contract?

Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #35 on: October 27, 2011, 06:40:52 PM »

Offline Inside-Out

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I still wonder whether Joe Johnson, Pierce, and Antoine could have developed into something together (along with the two 7' centers, Blount and Battie, who looked like a decent defensive rotation at one time...).

Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #36 on: October 27, 2011, 07:44:00 PM »

Offline Kane3387

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It would have been sick because Toine as a third option would have been a lot better then Toine as a 2nd Option.

Joe's last season in Phoenix and first four-five seasons in Atlanta were great. Pierce and Johnson would have been nasty in that weak eastern conference where the Pistons were the only constant.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2011, 07:58:32 PM by Kane3387 »


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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #37 on: October 28, 2011, 09:49:47 AM »

Online slamtheking

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It would have been sick because Toine as a third option would have been a lot better then Toine as a 2nd Option.

Joe's last season in Phoenix and first four-five seasons in Atlanta were great. Pierce and Johnson would have been nasty in that weak eastern conference where the Pistons were the only constant.
um, at what time would Antoine ever consider himself as anything less than the #2 option on offense?  JJ would have been really helpful as that third reliable scorer those teams needed (would have been better than Mercer turned out to be) but I don't think he'd be enough to get them a title.  Maybe enough to get to the finals for a year (if they kept Rogers for another year and Blount played like he cared during his contract) but I don't think it's enough to get the title.

Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #38 on: October 28, 2011, 09:59:18 AM »

Offline Kane3387

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It would have been sick because Toine as a third option would have been a lot better then Toine as a 2nd Option.

Joe's last season in Phoenix and first four-five seasons in Atlanta were great. Pierce and Johnson would have been nasty in that weak eastern conference where the Pistons were the only constant.
um, at what time would Antoine ever consider himself as anything less than the #2 option on offense?  JJ would have been really helpful as that third reliable scorer those teams needed (would have been better than Mercer turned out to be) but I don't think he'd be enough to get them a title.  Maybe enough to get to the finals for a year (if they kept Rogers for another year and Blount played like he cared during his contract) but I don't think it's enough to get the title.

No but at that point we are only one move away. Walker is likely traded because DA didn't like him, but who knows if having another elite player would have somehow increased his efficiency and thus his trade value. Maybe we get a better player then Raef. It's all speculation, but with JJ and Pierce we are one big guy away from being contenders. Or a developed JJ brings more in a trade then Rogers and Delk. Whatever the case, it was a poor trade when we could have moved Kedrick Brown instead.


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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #39 on: October 28, 2011, 10:01:42 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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It would have been sick because Toine as a third option would have been a lot better then Toine as a 2nd Option.

Joe's last season in Phoenix and first four-five seasons in Atlanta were great. Pierce and Johnson would have been nasty in that weak eastern conference where the Pistons were the only constant.
um, at what time would Antoine ever consider himself as anything less than the #2 option on offense?  JJ would have been really helpful as that third reliable scorer those teams needed (would have been better than Mercer turned out to be) but I don't think he'd be enough to get them a title.  Maybe enough to get to the finals for a year (if they kept Rogers for another year and Blount played like he cared during his contract) but I don't think it's enough to get the title.

No but at that point we are only one move away. Walker is likely traded because DA didn't like him, but who knows if having another elite player would have somehow increased his efficiency and thus his trade value.
Playing next to Dirk/Nash and Shaq/Wade didn't increase his efficiency. Walker was what he was at the point he was traded. A poor rebounding chucker of a PF who had become a poor defender. His incredible varied game for his size never made up for those core defficiences.

We watched Antione as a third/fourth option, he wasn't any better at it than being a #2. Though the team could have gone a lot farther clearly as you can afford an inefficient 3rd/4th option a lot more easily than one of your leaders.

Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #40 on: October 28, 2011, 11:57:15 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Not a trade per se, but the move that has annoyed me the most of any move in my lifetime, was Chris Wallace exercising the right to Denver's 1st in 2001 and then taking Kedrick Brown.  They could have waited until 2002 or 2003 and gotten a much better player (like say potentially Melo, Bosh, or Wade in 2003).

I know Pitino gets a lot of crap, but a lot of what he did actually worked out.  Drafting Pierce, making that trade to get Denver's 1st, trading Travis Knight (who he never should have signed) for Tony Battie, signing Bruce Bowen, trading Fortson and Barros for a future 1st (another wasted Wallace pick i.e. Forte), and generally setting the team up for the playoff runs under O'Brien (who he hired as an assistant).  
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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #41 on: October 28, 2011, 01:33:44 PM »

Offline Kane3387

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It would have been sick because Toine as a third option would have been a lot better then Toine as a 2nd Option.

Joe's last season in Phoenix and first four-five seasons in Atlanta were great. Pierce and Johnson would have been nasty in that weak eastern conference where the Pistons were the only constant.
um, at what time would Antoine ever consider himself as anything less than the #2 option on offense?  JJ would have been really helpful as that third reliable scorer those teams needed (would have been better than Mercer turned out to be) but I don't think he'd be enough to get them a title.  Maybe enough to get to the finals for a year (if they kept Rogers for another year and Blount played like he cared during his contract) but I don't think it's enough to get the title.

No but at that point we are only one move away. Walker is likely traded because DA didn't like him, but who knows if having another elite player would have somehow increased his efficiency and thus his trade value.
Playing next to Dirk/Nash and Shaq/Wade didn't increase his efficiency. Walker was what he was at the point he was traded. A poor rebounding chucker of a PF who had become a poor defender. His incredible varied game for his size never made up for those core defficiences.

We watched Antione as a third/fourth option, he wasn't any better at it than being a #2. Though the team could have gone a lot farther clearly as you can afford an inefficient 3rd/4th option a lot more easily than one of your leaders.

Fair point but in Dallas there was too many scorers. Besides Dirk and Nash he also had to share the ball with Finley and Jamison. He was more of a fifth option on that team. That's too low for a guy like Toine. He didn't get touches and as a result lost focus and gave little effort in Dallas. In Boston he would have seen more touches and likely been more involved.

In Miami it was a few years later and he was really on the decline. Although he did play solid for us the 1/2 season before in his second stint in Boston. Perhaps that can be contributed to a contract year, but he might have just played better because he was back in Boston. Also in Miami he got less touches then he would have likely gotten in Boston not just playing with Wade and Shaq who dominated the ball but also Jason Williams and Gary Payton who were score first pgs. He was also used in more of a rotational role with Posey, Haslem, Shaq, and Zo.

Again lack of touches led to lack of effort. I think out of the three settings he gets the most opportunity to dominate the ball in Boston where he only had to compete with JJ and Paul.

You make a very good point though.


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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #42 on: October 31, 2011, 01:37:08 PM »

Offline Jeff

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here's my list so far, am I missing any critical ones?

Chauncey Billups for Kenny Anderson

Kenny Anderson, Vitaly Potapenko and Joseph Forte for Vin Baker and Shammond Williams

Joe Johnson, Randy Brown, Milt Palacio and a 1st-round pick for Rodney Rogers and Tony Delk

Andrew DeClerq and 1st-round pick for Vitaly Potapenko

Antoine Walker, Tony Delk for Raef LaFrentz, Jiri Welsch, Chris Mills, and 1st-round pick

Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson for Jeff Green, Nenad Krstic, and conditional 1st-round pick
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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #43 on: October 31, 2011, 01:42:23 PM »

Online Roy H.

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here's my list so far, am I missing any critical ones?

Chauncey Billups for Kenny Anderson

Kenny Anderson, Vitaly Potapenko and Joseph Forte for Vin Baker and Shammond Williams

Joe Johnson, Randy Brown, Milt Palacio and a 1st-round pick for Rodney Rogers and Tony Delk

Andrew DeClerq and 1st-round pick for Vitaly Potapenko

Antoine Walker, Tony Delk for Raef LaFrentz, Jiri Welsch, Chris Mills, and 1st-round pick

Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson for Jeff Green, Nenad Krstic, and conditional 1st-round pick

Other ones I'd add to the list, if we're voting:

Danny Ainge and Brad Lohaus for Joe Kleine and Ed Pinckney

Paul Westphal and two 2nd rounders for Charlie Scott

Definitely not the worst trades in Celts history, but definitely missteps in my opinion.


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Re: Worst Celtics Trade - nominations
« Reply #44 on: October 31, 2011, 01:54:05 PM »

Offline Moranis

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here's my list so far, am I missing any critical ones?

Chauncey Billups for Kenny Anderson

Kenny Anderson, Vitaly Potapenko and Joseph Forte for Vin Baker and Shammond Williams

Joe Johnson, Randy Brown, Milt Palacio and a 1st-round pick for Rodney Rogers and Tony Delk

Andrew DeClerq and 1st-round pick for Vitaly Potapenko

Antoine Walker, Tony Delk for Raef LaFrentz, Jiri Welsch, Chris Mills, and 1st-round pick

Kendrick Perkins and Nate Robinson for Jeff Green, Nenad Krstic, and conditional 1st-round pick

Other ones I'd add to the list, if we're voting:

Danny Ainge and Brad Lohaus for Joe Kleine and Ed Pinckney

Paul Westphal and two 2nd rounders for Charlie Scott

Definitely not the worst trades in Celts history, but definitely missteps in my opinion.
I don't mind the Danny Ainge trade that much.  It didn't quite work out like the Celtics thought, but given when the trade was made and the state of the team it wasn't a terrible trade and Kleine and Pickney were Celtics for quite a few years thereafter.  Ainge was about done (only 1 real good year after leaving) and Lohaus never amounted to much.

The only caveat is I would have liked to have seen a draft pick come back for him (he was traded a few months later for a late 1st and a 1ate 2nd as well as Byron Irvin)  
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