SI TOP 100 ACTIVE NBA Players Today by Zach Lowe

[KCattheStripe]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

[action781]

Problems I have with the list so far:

Louis Williams being anywhere near the top 100.

DeAndre Jordan (see Louis Williams).

Nicolas Batum at 81 is based on the recurring thought that he is going to have a breakout year. Yet we keep waiting and waiting.

Andrea Bargnani at 65. Offense must count for a lot, huh?

I think you have to consider them as "players" not simply how they fill their roles on their current teams.  For instance, while Shane Battier would be a better 6th/7th man on a contending team than Lou Williams.... Lou Williams would be a far better player to have as a starter on a team deprived of players who can create offense.  I'd still agree with Battier being a better overall player, but

Regarding Bargnani, well, offense is half the game and the part that players have more control over normally.  And he showed to be a fairly efficient scorer at a decently high volume as a #2 option in 2009-10 (TS% .552)

Regarding Bargnani, if he was a guard...fine. But he isn't. He's huge and doesn't rebound, play defense very well, pass very well, or have any post game.

He's a center with the skills of an okay SG and without the skills of being a center, who gets his shot off because teams are reluctant to send their big men that far out of the paint to cover him. If he was 5 inches shorter he would be playing his career in Europe as a mediocre SG/SF.
65 is way way too high.

I agree that he has the skills of a SG and that teams are reluctant to send their big men that far out of the paint to cover him.  But I don't see how that's a fault of his... I think that's what makes him special and a tough cover.  The "if he was 5 inches shorter he wouldn't be in the nba" argument could be made about virtually every C and PF in the league, so I think that's a crap argument.  He's not 5 inches shorter and his height is part of what makes him a special player.

Also, your calling Bargnagni a center because he's 7 feet tall and plays center for the Raptors.  But if played Dirk at center, he would be just as bad at those things you are calling Bargs out for.  Dirk has just had the fortune of not being played at center and furthermore playing alongside good defensive and rebounding centers, while Bargs has not.  So, I think it's important to consider the players as players and not how they produce in their current system.

I do agree with your skill assessments, but 2 years ago, many could have criticized Dirk heavily for those things (he has improved since, especially in passing IMO) yet still would have considered him a top 15 player.  The reason: offense is a very important part of the game.  So, while Bargs is not on Dirk's level, he is a similar player and I personally don't think 65 is too crazy.

[indeedproceed]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

Surprised Monroe didn't make the list.

[StartOrien]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

Surprised Monroe didn't make the list.

Good point. Wonder if that's an oversight.

[Edgar]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

Surprised Monroe didn't make the list.

I am not, another mark for overrateness stat stack blount style
}

the only good player in all cleveland roster is jamison, old or not and at least he was mentioned

One of this days youre going to understand the game like ME 

[StartOrien]

I don't think thats a fair assessment of Monroe.

He's a big body, and seems to have a really strong basketball IQ. If he can stay motivated I think he's going to be great.

New coach certainly will help.

[nickagneta]

Problems I have with the list so far:

Louis Williams being anywhere near the top 100.

DeAndre Jordan (see Louis Williams).

Nicolas Batum at 81 is based on the recurring thought that he is going to have a breakout year. Yet we keep waiting and waiting.

Andrea Bargnani at 65. Offense must count for a lot, huh?

I think you have to consider them as "players" not simply how they fill their roles on their current teams.  For instance, while Shane Battier would be a better 6th/7th man on a contending team than Lou Williams.... Lou Williams would be a far better player to have as a starter on a team deprived of players who can create offense.  I'd still agree with Battier being a better overall player, but

Regarding Bargnani, well, offense is half the game and the part that players have more control over normally.  And he showed to be a fairly efficient scorer at a decently high volume as a #2 option in 2009-10 (TS% .552)

Regarding Bargnani, if he was a guard...fine. But he isn't. He's huge and doesn't rebound, play defense very well, pass very well, or have any post game.

He's a center with the skills of an okay SG and without the skills of being a center, who gets his shot off because teams are reluctant to send their big men that far out of the paint to cover him. If he was 5 inches shorter he would be playing his career in Europe as a mediocre SG/SF.
65 is way way too high.

I agree that he has the skills of a SG and that teams are reluctant to send their big men that far out of the paint to cover him.  But I don't see how that's a fault of his... I think that's what makes him special and a tough cover.  The "if he was 5 inches shorter he wouldn't be in the nba" argument could be made about virtually every C and PF in the league, so I think that's a crap argument.  He's not 5 inches shorter and his height is part of what makes him a special player.

Also, your calling Bargnagni a center because he's 7 feet tall and plays center for the Raptors.  But if played Dirk at center, he would be just as bad at those things you are calling Bargs out for.  Dirk has just had the fortune of not being played at center and furthermore playing alongside good defensive and rebounding centers, while Bargs has not.  So, I think it's important to consider the players as players and not how they produce in their current system.

I do agree with your skill assessments, but 2 years ago, many could have criticized Dirk heavily for those things (he has improved since, especially in passing IMO) yet still would have considered him a top 15 player.  The reason: offense is a very important part of the game.  So, while Bargs is not on Dirk's level, he is a similar player and I personally don't think 65 is too crazy.

Wait, my argument is a crap argument but you are trying to compare Andrea Bargnani to Dirk Nowitzki?

Bargnani is 7 feet tall and has been the absolute worst rebounding 7 footer in the league since he was drafted. His per36 rebounding numbers are routinely in the 5-5.5 range and he has trouble getting his rebounding percentage above 9%, which is so bad it ranks only slightly higher than most PGs.

Dirk had through most of his career per36 rebounding numbers in the 7-8 range, rebounded over 9 RPG for 5 straight years and has consistently had rebounding %'s in the 13-15% range.

Bargnani has never broken the 1.8 number in assists per36. Dirk is usually in the 2.5-3.0 range for that stat. Also, in using the litmus test of watching the two, Dirk is a much more willful and talented passer.

I am not even going to get into the details of the defense both play, the under the basket game or back to the basket game they play, the ability to shoot at high efficiency or the ability to handle the ball and create one's own shot which all are clearly in favor of Dirk by a wide margin.

Sorry, action, 7 footers have a higher responsibility to their team than to hang around 20-23 feet from the basket waiting for the ball to be thrown to them so they can shoot and do nothing else. And that is pretty much Bargs' game. 65 is too high.

[indeedproceed]

I don't think thats a fair assessment of Monroe.

He's a big body, and seems to have a really strong basketball IQ. If he can stay motivated I think he's going to be great.

New coach certainly will help.

Did you just try to honestly answer Edgar's basketball analysis?

Do you try to debate with the TV when commercials are on as well?

[Edgar]

I don't think thats a fair assessment of Monroe.

He's a big body, and seems to have a really strong basketball IQ. If he can stay motivated I think he's going to be great.

New coach certainly will help.

Did you just try to honestly answer Edgar's basketball analysis?

Do you try to debate with the TV when commercials are on as well?

Zach Lowe Lowes Pandas

[action781]

Problems I have with the list so far:

Louis Williams being anywhere near the top 100.

DeAndre Jordan (see Louis Williams).

Nicolas Batum at 81 is based on the recurring thought that he is going to have a breakout year. Yet we keep waiting and waiting.

Andrea Bargnani at 65. Offense must count for a lot, huh?

I think you have to consider them as "players" not simply how they fill their roles on their current teams.  For instance, while Shane Battier would be a better 6th/7th man on a contending team than Lou Williams.... Lou Williams would be a far better player to have as a starter on a team deprived of players who can create offense.  I'd still agree with Battier being a better overall player, but

Regarding Bargnani, well, offense is half the game and the part that players have more control over normally.  And he showed to be a fairly efficient scorer at a decently high volume as a #2 option in 2009-10 (TS% .552)

Regarding Bargnani, if he was a guard...fine. But he isn't. He's huge and doesn't rebound, play defense very well, pass very well, or have any post game.

He's a center with the skills of an okay SG and without the skills of being a center, who gets his shot off because teams are reluctant to send their big men that far out of the paint to cover him. If he was 5 inches shorter he would be playing his career in Europe as a mediocre SG/SF.
65 is way way too high.

I agree that he has the skills of a SG and that teams are reluctant to send their big men that far out of the paint to cover him.  But I don't see how that's a fault of his... I think that's what makes him special and a tough cover.  The "if he was 5 inches shorter he wouldn't be in the nba" argument could be made about virtually every C and PF in the league, so I think that's a crap argument.  He's not 5 inches shorter and his height is part of what makes him a special player.

Also, your calling Bargnagni a center because he's 7 feet tall and plays center for the Raptors.  But if played Dirk at center, he would be just as bad at those things you are calling Bargs out for.  Dirk has just had the fortune of not being played at center and furthermore playing alongside good defensive and rebounding centers, while Bargs has not.  So, I think it's important to consider the players as players and not how they produce in their current system.

I do agree with your skill assessments, but 2 years ago, many could have criticized Dirk heavily for those things (he has improved since, especially in passing IMO) yet still would have considered him a top 15 player.  The reason: offense is a very important part of the game.  So, while Bargs is not on Dirk's level, he is a similar player and I personally don't think 65 is too crazy.

Wait, my argument is a crap argument but you are trying to compare Andrea Bargnani to Dirk Nowitzki?

Bargnani is 7 feet tall and has been the absolute worst rebounding 7 footer in the league since he was drafted. His per36 rebounding numbers are routinely in the 5-5.5 range and he has trouble getting his rebounding percentage above 9%, which is so bad it ranks only slightly higher than most PGs.

Dirk had through most of his career per36 rebounding numbers in the 7-8 range, rebounded over 9 RPG for 5 straight years and has consistently had rebounding %'s in the 13-15% range.

Bargnani has never broken the 1.8 number in assists per36. Dirk is usually in the 2.5-3.0 range for that stat. Also, in using the litmus test of watching the two, Dirk is a much more willful and talented passer.

I am not even going to get into the details of the defense both play, the under the basket game or back to the basket game they play, the ability to shoot at high efficiency or the ability to handle the ball and create one's own shot which all are clearly in favor of Dirk by a wide margin.

Sorry, action, 7 footers have a higher responsibility to their team than to hang around 20-23 feet from the basket waiting for the ball to be thrown to them so they can shoot and do nothing else. And that is pretty much Bargs' game. 65 is too high.

Nick, nowhere did I say that Bargs is as good as Dirk...

I said that the same criticisms of Bargs game could be said of Dirk's game to an extent.  Obviously Dirk is way better, that's why he's a top 10 player and Bargs is #65.  But you can't deny that if Dirk was a center, he would be a terrible defender, a terrible rebounder, and a few years ago, not that great of a back to the basket player.  If despite those flaws, he can still get into the top 10, then I think Bargs can crack the top 70 with the same flaws, in light of them being worse.

I realize that defense is important, but you can't have a team full of Marcus Camby, Shane Battier, and Tony Allens.  That kind of team will lose every game 80-60.  And you can't have a team full of Bargs either, because you'll lose every game 140-120.  Both types of players are very valuable though and you need the right mix or a lot of 2-way players, which are pretty hard to acquire.

[The Walker Wiggle]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

You mean the New Orleans Buccaneers have to wait another year?

[StartOrien]

I don't think thats a fair assessment of Monroe.

He's a big body, and seems to have a really strong basketball IQ. If he can stay motivated I think he's going to be great.

New coach certainly will help.

Did you just try to honestly answer Edgar's basketball analysis?

Do you try to debate with the TV when commercials are on as well?

Not joking, at some point I developed a habit where I'll answer all the infomercials questions when I'm by myself. It's pretty comical / a sign that I'm a few months away from being checked into an insane asylum.

[KCattheStripe]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

You mean the New Orleans Buccaneers have to wait another year?

I'm sorry, did I miss DeMarcus Cousins on that list?

[Edgar]

Man, it's too bad Eric Gordon and Al Horford weren't ready to be the man.

You mean the New Orleans Buccaneers have to wait another year?

I'm sorry, did I miss DeMarcus Cousins on that list?

Overrraaaated

[stylo617617]

david west ahead of joe johnson. smh the list is dumb & stupid not even worth my time to look at the rest of the list (not just cuz of the joe johnson thing ,thats 1 of the many screw ups)