Author Topic: We've been down this road before: JO foregos wrist surgery for rest and rehab  (Read 5682 times)

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Offline Marcus13

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This guy is straight scared to go under the knife...

But I don't blame him.  It's tough getting me into a dentist's office

Online GreenEnvy

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I don't know why everyone on here can just tell another person what to do with their body, especially a professional athlete's.

The only people who it is up to are JO himself and the Celtics front office.


Maybe he feels it won't hamper him too much. He fractured it the very first game of the playoffs and most didn't even know he was playing hurt. Give him a full summer to nurse it and get it stronger, and it should be better.

Also, anyone think he wants to use the offseason to work on his game and conditioning? Vets do that too. Having surgery on his shooting wrist may bring him into the season worse off than just rehab with practice.


When it mattered most, he was out there. Had no excuses, played through it. Nobody knows this injury or the knee injury. If the Celtics are OK with it, we as fans have to trust them, despite their track record with injuries.
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Offline RyNye

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If it needs surgery get it done. If it doesn't then why would there be a need to put it off a year?

O'Neal's putting off surgery is just another move on his part to play another half season and get paid for a whole season. He's been doing this for 8 years.

2004-05 - 44 games
2005-06 - 51 games
2006-07 - 69 games
2007-08 - 42 games
2008-09 - 68 games
2009-10 - 70 games
2010-11 - 24 games

Dude has played in 64% of the available games over the last 7 years. I fully expect him to have a problem with the wrist in training camp, be in trouble with it to start the season. Play 10-15 games. Go out with the wrist injury. Decide to have the surgery before the All-Star break and come back late in the season and be ineffective. Total games played, less than 35.

Yeah, 69, 68, and 70 sure are half-seasons. Unthinkable that he play so few games.

Seriously, the only one of those that is really bad is 24 this past season. 42, 44, and 51 aren't great, no, but I think it is pretty ridiculous that you are pulling some conspiracy out of your ass over this. Injury prone =/= serially dishonest.

Offline saltlover

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If it needs surgery get it done. If it doesn't then why would there be a need to put it off a year?

O'Neal's putting off surgery is just another move on his part to play another half season and get paid for a whole season. He's been doing this for 8 years.

2004-05 - 44 games
2005-06 - 51 games
2006-07 - 69 games
2007-08 - 42 games
2008-09 - 68 games
2009-10 - 70 games
2010-11 - 24 games

Dude has played in 64% of the available games over the last 7 years. I fully expect him to have a problem with the wrist in training camp, be in trouble with it to start the season. Play 10-15 games. Go out with the wrist injury. Decide to have the surgery before the All-Star break and come back late in the season and be ineffective. Total games played, less than 35.

Yeah, 69, 68, and 70 sure are half-seasons. Unthinkable that he play so few games.

Seriously, the only one of those that is really bad is 24 this past season. 42, 44, and 51 aren't great, no, but I think it is pretty ridiculous that you are pulling some conspiracy out of your ass over this. Injury prone =/= serially dishonest.

Not to mention that the 2004 season was the one he was suspended for 25 games for the Detroit brawl (reduced to 15 after a judge told Stern he overstepped his bounds and ended the suspension early.)  He probably could have played 60 games that year but for that really bad night in Detroit.

Offline Drucci

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I never understand why NBA players refuse to have surgery during the offseason since it's basically the best (or "only") time to do it... Kobe refused it for his broken his fingers multiple times too.

So I can't say that I agree with JO's decision or even understand it, I just hope it won't come back to bite him and by extension the C's but it looks like it will anyway...

Offline mgent

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I don't know why everyone on here can just tell another person what to do with their body, especially a professional athlete's.

The only people who it is up to are JO himself and the Celtics front office.
But last year they were telling him to get the surgery.  Supposedly he could barely walk without the knee swelling up since he was with Miami.  After the surgery we didn't see one report of swelling.

I can't believe anyone would argue that JO's judgement is better than a doctor's.
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Offline saltlover

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I don't know why everyone on here can just tell another person what to do with their body, especially a professional athlete's.

The only people who it is up to are JO himself and the Celtics front office.
But last year they were telling him to get the surgery.  Supposedly he could barely walk without the knee swelling up since he was with Miami.  After the surgery we didn't see one report of swelling.

I can't believe anyone would argue that JO's judgement is better than a doctor's.

Really?  It's not about "judgment."  It's about having the right to have your body treated how you want it treated.  End of story.

If you're such a medical expert that you think JO is wrong to not have this surgery, then you should complain that the doctor didn't do his job in explaining the benefits of this surgery.  If you're not a medical expert, then you should let people treat their bodies as they choose.

Offline SalmonAndMashedPotatoes

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Quote
O’Neal, who went through the playoffs with the wrist injury, has decided to forgo surgery in favor of rehabilitation, according to Danny Ainge. The Celtics president said yesterday that O’Neal, attempting to take advantage of the team’s resources before players are locked out on July 1, has been a regular at the workout facility in Waltham.

“He has every intention of coming back,” Ainge said of the only true center on his team’s roster. “He has every desire to play, and didn’t like the way it finished this year, and doesn’t want to end his career on that type of note. He wants to be a much greater contributor.

“He chose not to have surgery.”

Link

I'm calling it now:  JO will continue to have issues with the wrist, and will get surgery on it either right before the season starts, or mid-season. 

Why so pessimistic?  Because the exact same thing happened with his knee.  He repeatedly resisted surgery (despite team doctors recommending it), and when he finally did relent, the surgery did him a world of good.

Come on, JO.  Just get the dang surgery.

Sadly, Roy, you're right on the money.  

JO has a pretty long history of foregoing surgery and subsequently dragging out the recovering process to absurd lengths, all the while collecting a paycheck and feeding the media a sob story.  In Indiana, his fear of surgery made him decide to play two years on a torn meniscus, and after hobbling around for two years (all on a max salary), racking up over-compensation injuries, and watching his athleticism fade, he finally relented and had surgery, only to find out that by forgoing a relatively minor surgery for two years he had caused his knee to deteriorate into the dreaded 'bone-on-bone' condition.  Of course, he didn't blame himself for causing a minor injury to balloon into a life-long handicap--nope, all he talked about afterward was how 'tough' he was to play 2 years on a torn meniscus.  

Last season, JO originally injured his wrist in his first preseason game (an injury the team characterized as a torn cartilage in his left wrist), and subsequently wore a wrap on that wrist the rest of the season, only to re-injure it in the first game of the playoffs.  Since JO missed about 4 months of the regular season (in two separate two-month absences), it's safe to say that even with rest the wrist did not heal completely, and so this latest news is most depressing--because given JO's notoriously bad healing abilities that wrist will most likely still be a problem next season.

Normally, I think the athlete should decide how and when to care for their body.  However, in JO's case, I think he's proven that he's fairly inept when it comes to maintaining his health.  There are two kinds of people who avoid surgery--the ones who can play through pain (like Kobe Bryant who decided against finger surgery) and the ones that who can't.  JO is decidedly in that second camp, he's unable to play effectively through pain (as he showed in both the regular season and the playoffs), yet he's afraid to get the corrective surgery he needs to be pain-free.  

And people wonder why JO has worn out his welcome in 4 cities over the last 8 years--well, it's pretty clear to me why: this guy can't be trusted to put his team first.  He's not tough enough to play well when hurt, and he's not smart enough to have surgery when he's too hurt to play well.  As such, he's selfish loser, both in spirit and in body, and exactly the kind of player who doesn't deserve to wear a Celtic uniform.
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Offline GreenFaith1819

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Interesting points, from both sides.

I have every reason to believe that JO will give it his all next season, surgery or not, but if I were Danny I'd stock up on centers big time.

Unfortunately, that is probably easier said than done.

Last season featured Shaq, Perk and JO, with Nenad in there for a spell with Semih getting a few starts also.

And I can't recall if any of them were healthy last season :o.

Offline nickagneta

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If it needs surgery get it done. If it doesn't then why would there be a need to put it off a year?

O'Neal's putting off surgery is just another move on his part to play another half season and get paid for a whole season. He's been doing this for 8 years.

2004-05 - 44 games
2005-06 - 51 games
2006-07 - 69 games
2007-08 - 42 games
2008-09 - 68 games
2009-10 - 70 games
2010-11 - 24 games

Dude has played in 64% of the available games over the last 7 years. I fully expect him to have a problem with the wrist in training camp, be in trouble with it to start the season. Play 10-15 games. Go out with the wrist injury. Decide to have the surgery before the All-Star break and come back late in the season and be ineffective. Total games played, less than 35.

Yeah, 69, 68, and 70 sure are half-seasons. Unthinkable that he play so few games.

Seriously, the only one of those that is really bad is 24 this past season. 42, 44, and 51 aren't great, no, but I think it is pretty ridiculous that you are pulling some conspiracy out of your ass over this. Injury prone =/= serially dishonest.
Sorry next time I will say 60% instead of half and that way it will be a bit more accurate.

Seriously, you are defending a guy that misses 36% of his teams games over a 7 year period? He's averages missing 30 games a year over a 7 year period and you think that's because he's some tough guy who shakes off injuries easily and plays through pain?

This is not the first time he put off surgery and he is notorious for getting injured during the year then not being able to play as well in the playoffs(Miami 2010, Boston 2011, Indiana 2002, 2005, 2006)

Offline Fafnir

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If it needs surgery get it done. If it doesn't then why would there be a need to put it off a year?

O'Neal's putting off surgery is just another move on his part to play another half season and get paid for a whole season. He's been doing this for 8 years.

2004-05 - 44 games
2005-06 - 51 games
2006-07 - 69 games
2007-08 - 42 games
2008-09 - 68 games
2009-10 - 70 games
2010-11 - 24 games

Dude has played in 64% of the available games over the last 7 years. I fully expect him to have a problem with the wrist in training camp, be in trouble with it to start the season. Play 10-15 games. Go out with the wrist injury. Decide to have the surgery before the All-Star break and come back late in the season and be ineffective. Total games played, less than 35.

Yeah, 69, 68, and 70 sure are half-seasons. Unthinkable that he play so few games.

Seriously, the only one of those that is really bad is 24 this past season. 42, 44, and 51 aren't great, no, but I think it is pretty ridiculous that you are pulling some conspiracy out of your ass over this. Injury prone =/= serially dishonest.
Sorry next time I will say 60% instead of half and that way it will be a bit more accurate.

Seriously, you are defending a guy that misses 36% of his teams games over a 7 year period? He's averages missing 30 games a year over a 7 year period and you think that's because he's some tough guy who shakes off injuries easily and plays through pain?

This is not the first time he put off surgery and he is notorious for getting injured during the year then not being able to play as well in the playoffs(Miami 2010, Boston 2011, Indiana 2002, 2005, 2006)
I don't get why you think this is a personal failure of his. Players get hurt, it happens.

Why no hate and snide remarks about getting paid for half a year about Yao Ming, Greg Oden, Andrew Bynum, etc....

The delaying surgery worries me, but then again just having surgery as an option worries me too.

Offline nickagneta

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If it needs surgery get it done. If it doesn't then why would there be a need to put it off a year?

O'Neal's putting off surgery is just another move on his part to play another half season and get paid for a whole season. He's been doing this for 8 years.

2004-05 - 44 games
2005-06 - 51 games
2006-07 - 69 games
2007-08 - 42 games
2008-09 - 68 games
2009-10 - 70 games
2010-11 - 24 games

Dude has played in 64% of the available games over the last 7 years. I fully expect him to have a problem with the wrist in training camp, be in trouble with it to start the season. Play 10-15 games. Go out with the wrist injury. Decide to have the surgery before the All-Star break and come back late in the season and be ineffective. Total games played, less than 35.

Yeah, 69, 68, and 70 sure are half-seasons. Unthinkable that he play so few games.

Seriously, the only one of those that is really bad is 24 this past season. 42, 44, and 51 aren't great, no, but I think it is pretty ridiculous that you are pulling some conspiracy out of your ass over this. Injury prone =/= serially dishonest.
Sorry next time I will say 60% instead of half and that way it will be a bit more accurate.

Seriously, you are defending a guy that misses 36% of his teams games over a 7 year period? He's averages missing 30 games a year over a 7 year period and you think that's because he's some tough guy who shakes off injuries easily and plays through pain?

This is not the first time he put off surgery and he is notorious for getting injured during the year then not being able to play as well in the playoffs(Miami 2010, Boston 2011, Indiana 2002, 2005, 2006)
I don't get why you think this is a personal failure of his. Players get hurt, it happens.

Why no hate and snide remarks about getting paid for half a year about Yao Ming, Greg Oden, Andrew Bynum, etc....
Because I think O'Neal soft and I don't think that it's been a coincidence that he has missed so many games after signing his huge $126 million contract. I think he became satisfied with being paid and isn't committed, which I want players to be.

Besides, if Yao, Oden or bynum was on the Celtics missing game, then I would be emotionally invested in them. They aren't so I'm not.

Offline Fafnir

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Because I think O'Neal soft and I don't think that it's been a coincidence that he has missed so many games after signing his huge $126 million contract. I think he became satisfied with being paid and isn't committed, which I want players to be.

Besides, if Yao, Oden or bynum was on the Celtics missing game, then I would be emotionally invested in them. They aren't so I'm not.
Well Jermaine hasn't been soft in a Celtics uniform, so I have no complaints about his time here other than I'd like to see him on the court more.

I don't think we should assign a moral value to injuries. Rondo is also pretty injury prone, I don't think you'd like it if people called him soft and "satisified" with his big contract.

Offline Roy H.

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Because I think O'Neal soft and I don't think that it's been a coincidence that he has missed so many games after signing his huge $126 million contract. I think he became satisfied with being paid and isn't committed, which I want players to be.

Besides, if Yao, Oden or bynum was on the Celtics missing game, then I would be emotionally invested in them. They aren't so I'm not.
Well Jermaine hasn't been soft in a Celtics uniform, so I have no complaints about his time here other than I'd like to see him on the court more.

I don't think we should assign a moral value to injuries. Rondo is also pretty injury prone, I don't think you'd like it if people called him soft and "satisified" with his big contract.

"Soft" may not be the right word in my mind, but he hurt the team last year by deciding to "rest and rehab" rather than get surgery.  There's some suggestion that he's done the same thing in other places, although I don't know enough about the specifics.  Now, it seems like he may be doing that here.

The last part is based on speculation and on Danny's quote that "HE didn't want to get surgery", rather than a more diplomatic "He and the team doctors didn't think it would be helpful".  I get the sense that Danny was very, very frustrated by JO's choices last year -- it visibly showed -- and I think this might be more of the same.


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Offline Fafnir

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Because I think O'Neal soft and I don't think that it's been a coincidence that he has missed so many games after signing his huge $126 million contract. I think he became satisfied with being paid and isn't committed, which I want players to be.

Besides, if Yao, Oden or bynum was on the Celtics missing game, then I would be emotionally invested in them. They aren't so I'm not.
Well Jermaine hasn't been soft in a Celtics uniform, so I have no complaints about his time here other than I'd like to see him on the court more.

I don't think we should assign a moral value to injuries. Rondo is also pretty injury prone, I don't think you'd like it if people called him soft and "satisified" with his big contract.

"Soft" may not be the right word in my mind, but he hurt the team last year by deciding to "rest and rehab" rather than get surgery.  There's some suggestion that he's done the same thing in other places, although I don't know enough about the specifics.  Now, it seems like he may be doing that here.

The last part is based on speculation and on Danny's quote that "HE didn't want to get surgery", rather than a more diplomatic "He and the team doctors didn't think it would be helpful".  I get the sense that Danny was very, very frustrated by JO's choices last year -- it visibly showed -- and I think this might be more of the same.
Perhaps, but surgery isn't a magic bullet. I don't find myself reflexively siding with team doctor's over the player's on these sort of issues.

I mean supposedly they were begging KG to get his surgery earlier, but instead he wanted to rehab and try to play sooner (that year's playoffs) Jermaine's decision this past year was simiar if a bit different as the surgery on his knee would have still had him back for the end of the year.