Boxscore: Rose vs Iverson

[chambers]

Good topic.
I've thought about these two often and I come to the same conclusion every time.

Allen Iverson > Derrek Rose.
I really don't think there will ever be a scoring point guard like Iverson again.
Rose is the closest thing, and whilst he's young and still improving, I can't place him on the same level as Iverson just yet.
These guys are so similar that a lot of it comes down to personal opinion. Some people will break it down to stats, whilst some will talk about who has carried their team more.
Rose carried the Bulls this season during the regular season, but he still can't really get them through to the Finals on his own like Iverson was capable of doing (one could argue the Heat are much tougher competition than Iverson faced too).

Rose is in his 3rd year though, so it's not fair to compare their greatness yet, if Rose continues his development he could very well get past Iverson. Talk to me in 3 years from now.

Right now though, Rose can't get to the Finals without a decent shooting guard or scoring power forward.

Iverson put Philly on his back by himself against one of the toughest finals opponents ever.

[wdleehi]

Good topic.
I've thought about these two often and I come to the same conclusion every time.

Allen Iverson > Derrek Rose.
I really don't think there will ever be a scoring point guard like Iverson again.
Rose is the closest thing, and whilst he's young and still improving, I can't place him on the same level as Iverson just yet.
These guys are so similar that a lot of it comes down to personal opinion. Some people will break it down to stats, whilst some will talk about who has carried their team more.
Rose carried the Bulls this season during the regular season, but he still can't really get them through to the Finals on his own like Iverson was capable of doing (one could argue the Heat are much tougher competition than Iverson faced too).

Rose is in his 3rd year though, so it's not fair to compare their greatness yet, if Rose continues his development he could very well get past Iverson. Talk to me in 3 years from now.

Right now though, Rose can't get to the Finals without a decent shooting guard or scoring power forward.

Iverson put Philly on his back by himself against one of the toughest finals opponents ever.

But got through one of the easiest paths ever. 

[chambers]

Good topic.
I've thought about these two often and I come to the same conclusion every time.

Allen Iverson > Derrek Rose.
I really don't think there will ever be a scoring point guard like Iverson again.
Rose is the closest thing, and whilst he's young and still improving, I can't place him on the same level as Iverson just yet.
These guys are so similar that a lot of it comes down to personal opinion. Some people will break it down to stats, whilst some will talk about who has carried their team more.
Rose carried the Bulls this season during the regular season, but he still can't really get them through to the Finals on his own like Iverson was capable of doing (one could argue the Heat are much tougher competition than Iverson faced too).

Rose is in his 3rd year though, so it's not fair to compare their greatness yet, if Rose continues his development he could very well get past Iverson. Talk to me in 3 years from now.

Right now though, Rose can't get to the Finals without a decent shooting guard or scoring power forward.

Iverson put Philly on his back by himself against one of the toughest finals opponents ever.

But got through one of the easiest paths ever. 

He also had Keith Van Horn and Eric Snow on his crew :S
Current Rose team mates> AI's team mates.

But, current competition in the East>AI's competition, and I know what you mean.

[OsirusCeltics]

I don't worship stats
They are too unpredictable and vary on the circumstance
Its like fans don't want to watch/study the actual game anymore

I think people's hate for Iverson is getting in the way of his greatness as a player. I'm sorry Rose is nowhere near the class of Iverson

-Iverson had better court vision, more point guard instincts
-Rose plays like a small forward (not even a shooting guard). If you watch his style of play, its almost identical to Lebron. Lack of a consistent shooting touch, uses athleticism and strength score points, etc. Only thing is that Lebron can play the 1 position, and is 6'9" 280 lbs, so he can get away with it

-Iverson has more natural offensive skills. Had an array of moves, very clutch, and light it up on any defender
-Rose on the other hand uses his strength and athleticism too much to get his points. And those two things do not equal skill, they are not constant and will erode when he gets older and can't use that to his advantage

Theres other reasons, but those two are the ones I wanted to really show the difference between the two players

You may not worship stats, but when comparing players, it needs to be brought into discussion.  Let me ask you something, how did Allen Iverson beat his defender so many times? Was his quickness not a part of that?  Isn't that athleticism being used to get points?  I'd say the athleticism of Rose and Iverson is very similar.  Rose is just much bigger than AI.  Also, did Iverson have better point guard skills?  I always thought Philly was much more effective when Snow was playing the point and AI was at the 2. 

Yeah, you can't play this game without some type of athleticism. But if that's the only thing you hang you're hat on, you're not that good of a player. Iverson has more of a combination of skill and athleticism. When you get older, skill increases as other things erode. Like when he got older in Detroit. Even though they played him on the bench for some reason, he still averaged 17 points and was still getting by people with his footwork

I think Iverson is one of those rare breeds that can be very effective playing the 1 and 2. Avg 7 assists in his rookie season playing the point. Then when we moved to the 2 spot, he up his scoring average to about 28-31 points a game receiving 4 scoring titles

[Cman]

Very interesting discussion.

It will be interesting and fun to watch Rose develop over the course of his career.  At this point, of course, AI's career way outshines Rose's.  I'd be shocked if AI didn't make it to the HOF, whereas it is just too early to say that Rose will be a HOF player (certainly has the trajectory, though).

[LB3533]

A couple things Rose has an advantage over AI are Rose's humbleness and his maturity at a young age.

Iverson wasn't mature or humble until later on in his career.

[MBz]

Iverson wasn't mature or humble until later on in his career.

And even that's debatable.  I don't think he ever got humble, he refused to come off the bench in Detroit no?

[wdleehi]

Iverson wasn't mature or humble until later on in his career.

And even that's debatable.  I don't think he ever got humble, he refused to come off the bench in Detroit no?

He quit in Memphis.

[Redz]

Iverson wasn't mature or humble until later on in his career.

And even that's debatable.  I don't think he ever got humble, he refused to come off the bench in Detroit no?

He quit in Memphis.

practice, practice, practice

[JoT]

Iverson wasn't mature or humble until later on in his career.

Allen Iverson STILL isn't humble or mature. Go read some information about Iverson and you will se he hasn't changed not one bit and is still every bit of a you know what. I can some way understand why people feel Stern kicked him out of the NBA, but he did it to himself.
I can say a lot of stuff about Iverson and his attitude and actions right now that shows he hasn't changed. I even tried to support him and quietly I still do.

[soap07]

-Iverson had better court vision, more point guard instincts
-Rose plays like a small forward (not even a shooting guard). If you watch his style of play, its almost identical to Lebron. Lack of a consistent shooting touch, uses athleticism and strength score points, etc. Only thing is that Lebron can play the 1 position, and is 6'9" 280 lbs, so he can get away with it

-Iverson has more natural offensive skills. Had an array of moves, very clutch, and light it up on any defender
-Rose on the other hand uses his strength and athleticism too much to get his points. And those two things do not equal skill, they are not constant and will erode when he gets older and can't use that to his advantage

Rose certainly has more point guard "instincts", whatever that means, than AI. And on the athleticism issue, I mean, two can play at this game - AI only had his quickness then. You can't just be fast and score 25 ppg.

Did you watch Rose at all this year? He took over many 4th quarters - especially in the Pacers series. His crossover is the best in the league, other than many Chris Paul.


Now, there are many players in the league I'd take over Rose (LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Howard, Paul, Deron, Paul to start)...but at 22 years old is already better than Iverson. He has improved mightily, especially in his shooting since he entered the league.

[Finkelskyhook]

A couple things Rose has an advantage over AI are Rose's humbleness and his maturity at a young age.

Iverson wasn't mature or humble until later on in his career.

I must've missed his career in Turkey.  Iverson must've grown up a lot there....Unless the new definition of mature and humble is alienating franchises, coaches, and tanking.

Iverson had one true winning season.  When an absolutely perfect roster and a perfect coach was built for him.  Iverson has used "I" and "me" more times in any one interview than Rose has in his combined career interviews.  Soap07 has it exactly right.

I'm sure every team in the NBA would love to have Rose.  Nobody disputes Iverson's talent even now.  There's a reason he's in Turkey.  And it ain't, LB3533, because he got a better offer there...

Otherwise, to compare anything about Iverson, meaningless stats aside, is ludicrous.  One was a one man wrecking crew and coach killer.  The other is an extension of his coach.

[snively]

Both are widely overrated by virtue of their scoring averages, flashiness and one-on-one prowess.  Rose is better because he's more efficient as a scorer and a better floor general. Iverson does deserve some slack for playing in a different era (scoring efficiency was practically non-existent in the East in those days: remember Jerry Stackhouse, Jason Kidd and Antoine Walker were brick-laying at prodigious rates).