Did KG live up to Russell's appraisal?

[TitleMaster]

IMHO, KG did not live up to Bill Russell's appreciation and motivational speech.

For the average person, it's seldom that one of the best in your field will try to prop you up and your b-ball journey in life. In KG's situation, he was quite literally told by Russell that if he played like he should and take others with him, then championship(s) will come.

Instead, KG was more an emotional wreck, barking & screaming, and seldom depicted that steadfast behavior which repeat champions have.

I have a thread in which I believe that the 2008 title was more due to our team being stacked ...

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=47836.0

Sure, I acknowledge KG being a great help defender and a fine rebounder, however, he is not the franchise player that everyone wants him to be. Many have said that Russell never scored and he just blocked shots and rebounded. Actually, this isn't quite the case. Russell played the game for 48 minutes. In other words, when he had scorers around him, his job was to deflect blocked shots towards them. But then, as many senior citizen Celts fans can attest to, when the clock ran down, Russell, would not only block shots & pull down boards, he'd take it to the opponent and score on them. He did this against the twin towers of Chamberlain & Thurmond but instead of expanding his energy on this type of play all game long, & thus, reduce the effectiveness of his teammates, he waited till the time ran out, and delivered the knock out blow when it mattered. On the whole, for a so-called non-scorer, 15-16 ppg is not so bad.

Now, as for KG, for the most part, as a power forward, he's more a point forward, tossing the rock, before the defenses even attempt to run doubles on him. And his go-to move is mainly an Alley Opp from Rondo when his isn't using that overrated hot & cold turnaround 20 pt jumper. What's the result of the above? Opponents seldom run doubles on KG and basically, they expect the Celtics to run a type of donut hole offense where if there isn't a catch and dunk guy under the basket that no post moves will be initiated. Sorry, but that makes a team rather predictable. Keep Pierce and Ray occupied and for the most part, the Celtics suddenly don't look so invincible.

[Roy H.]

How soon we forget what the 2007 season was like...  Yes, KG was everything we (or Russell) asked for, in my opinion.  He has performed on the court, and he has been a leader.  He unfortunately had a serious injury that sapped a lot of his athleticism, but it's hard to ask more than a title and another Finals run.

[BballTim]

IMHO, KG did not live up to Bill Russell's appreciation and motivational speech.

For the average person, it's seldom that one of the best in your field will try to prop you up and your b-ball journey in life. In KG's situation, he was quite literally told by Russell that if he played like he should and take others with him, then championship(s) will come.

Instead, KG was more an emotional wreck, barking & screaming, and seldom depicted that steadfast behavior which repeat champions have.

I have a thread in which I believe that the 2008 title was more due to our team being stacked ...

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=47836.0

Sure, I acknowledge KG being a great help defender and a fine rebounder, however, he is not the franchise player that everyone wants him to be. Many have said that Russell never scored and he just blocked shots and rebounded. Actually, this isn't quite the case. Russell played the game for 48 minutes. In other words, when he had scorers around him, his job was to deflect blocked shots towards them. But then, as many senior citizen Celts fans can attest to, when the clock ran down, Russell, would not only block shots & pull down boards, he'd take it to the opponent and score on them. He did this against the twin towers of Chamberlain & Thurmond but instead of expanding his energy on this type of play all game long, & thus, reduce the effectiveness of his teammates, he waited till the time ran out, and delivered the knock out blow when it mattered. On the whole, for a so-called non-scorer, 15-16 ppg is not so bad.

Now, as for KG, for the most part, as a power forward, he's more a point forward, tossing the rock, before the defenses even attempt to run doubles on him. And his go-to move is mainly an Alley Opp from Rondo when his isn't using that overrated hot & cold turnaround 20 pt jumper. What's the result of the above? Opponents seldom run doubles on KG and basically, they expect the Celtics to run a type of donut hole offense where if there isn't a catch and dunk guy under the basket that no post moves will be initiated. Sorry, but that makes a team rather predictable. Keep Pierce and Ray occupied and for the most part, the Celtics suddenly don't look so invincible.

  I disagree with most if not all of this. For starters you're criticizing KG for not scoring but satisfied with Russell's scoring, even though he scored less than KG when he was on a team that scored much more than the Celts do. If you consider the percentage of points Russell scored he was slightly above what Rondo scores for the Celts.

[JoT]

I think he did considering the issues that he faced while being in Boston. They would have more than one or even two to me if he wasn't injured in 09. KG did as much as he could while healing and getting halfway back to where he was before. Also KG feels the same way and he said in his blog that he was dissappointed in the outcome and will work even harder to perfect the problem that he had this year. He maybe just talking or not, but to me a player that accepts and takes responsibility in what they did wrong is someone that i respect  to the fullest. I wish he would get another because besides his yelling and cursing at times, he to me is what I would love as a player on my team and to be a fan of. I love his intensity, drive and hunger that he brought towards this team and the NBA. Heck people say he robbed of MVP in 08 because of how he helped turn things around in Boston.

[paulcowens]

Good lord, considering the age KG was when he got to Boston, he's been ABSOLUTELY a  franchise player!!! I would have thought that this might be one of the most uncontroversial things about the past 4 years.

[diehard celtic]

Wow, I don't think that you understand that basketball is a team game and you KG can't win titles by himself and that the barking and the talking KG does is the same thing Russell does to get himself pumped but in a different style.

[manl_lui]

of course he did, if he haven't been injured, we would've gotten 2 championships, no doubt.

Even when he came back from injury, he was playing hard, hustling, to be honest, without KG, i dont know how we will do against NY, not to mention, his 27 17 performance in game 3, without those, we would've been swept by the Heat. Yeah Rondo did well and etc, but KG's presence helped a lot

[ScoobyDoo]

All I can say is that KG should have have found his way to Boston a long, long time ago. I know he had little control over it.

My point is that KG is as much the definition of a consummate "Celtic" as I have ever seen. He is like Bill Russell and Dave Cowens rolled up into one player - the defensive talent of Russell from the PF position with the outward intensity of Cowens.   

I can only imagine that if it had been KG with Pierce instead of Walker from the start, we'd have drawn much talent to Boston and that DUO might well have hung 6-7 titles, with KG carrying the flag.

 I love KG - name me 1 other player who's logged 16 seasons of hard, hard minutes - who's come off major injuries to compete and perform like he has.

I'd say with a healthy Shaq and Rondo, KG would most likely be the driving emotional force of a championship team this year.

If KG was 28, we'd also have swept the Heat even as banged up as we are - he is that good, he just can't do it for 38 minutes a night anymore. He needs more help and good luck with injuries.
 

[ScoobyDoo]

JoT, what was KG's problem this year? You mention he would try to fix it, what did he say in his blog? What is his blog address?

Pls advise if you could, thanks.

[Neurotic Guy]

I can't bring myself to say anything negative about KG (nor could I about Russell).  KG has lived up to everything I'd hoped he'd be. 

Comparative to the rest of the league at the time, the C's of the late 50's and 60's was far more stacked than the C's of the late 2000's.  They had future HOFers coming out their ears, and in their primes.

[ejk3489]

JoT, what was KG's problem this year? You mention he would try to fix it, what did he say in his blog? What is his blog address?

Pls advise if you could, thanks.

Not sure if this is what he meant, but this was in his last blog post:

As you know, we were knocked out of the playoffs by Miami.  It's unfortunate that we are out and in my mind didn't reach our potential.  Taking the last couple of days to think about things and the season was long.  Their were ups and downs all season and dealing with teammates, leaving teammates, gaining teammates.  Long hours, flights, practices, workouts, etc...  Another season under my belt, but not satisfying.  I'll be getting back to the "lab" (workouts and court work) to work on my craft, so I can keep improving.  I will be working on my skills and constantly trying to get better.

 
He has a ton of other posts here: http://kgnba.qzone.qq.com/

[DKClassic]

Injuries happen.

[JoT]

JoT, what was KG's problem this year? You mention he would try to fix it, what did he say in his blog? What is his blog address?

Pls advise if you could, thanks.

Not sure if this is what he meant, but this was in his last blog post:

As you know, we were knocked out of the playoffs by Miami.  It's unfortunate that we are out and in my mind didn't reach our potential.  Taking the last couple of days to think about things and the season was long.  Their were ups and downs all season and dealing with teammates, leaving teammates, gaining teammates.  Long hours, flights, practices, workouts, etc...  Another season under my belt, but not satisfying.  I'll be getting back to the "lab" (workouts and court work) to work on my craft, so I can keep improving.  I will be working on my skills and constantly trying to get better.

 
He has a ton of other posts here: http://kgnba.qzone.qq.com/

Thank You for bringing up the link.
He said in his blog that the team didn't fulfill their goal and that he was gonna try over the summer to get better. I guess it's the taking to many jump shots and not going in enough. Personally besides that I don't know what the other problem might be.
He seems like Kobe a bit to me who said that over the summer he gonna try to get better at what he did wrong in the playoffs. I'm not comparing them at all, but their responses from the loss seems like they're gonna try to come back and want to win next year.

[BASS_THUMPER]

How soon we forget what the 2007 season was like...  Yes, KG was everything we (or Russell) asked for, in my opinion.  He has performed on the court, and he has been a leader.  He unfortunately had a serious injury that sapped a lot of his athleticism, but it's hard to ask more than a title and another Finals run.

right on!!

kg did big thangs here

please dont forget~

[greenpride32]

In response to OP; KG was well beyond his prime when he arrived in Boston as it was, but there has also been a notable decline since his injury in 2009.  You might be able to make a case if KG played in BOS his entire career with Pierce and they only came up with one title.

Also, if anything Russell's teams were more "stacked" than KG's.