Enough with the Rondo trade talks

[ballin]

To win big in this league, you need to build around an all-time great like a Pierce or KG. Rondo is not that guy. CP3 might not be either if his knees don't hold up, but if they do, then CP3 IS what we need to get banner 18.

Guys will go to play with Chris Paul if we have cap space, just like Lebron and Bosh went to play with Wade and Carmelo went to play with Amare. Rondo? No freaking way.

I love how 99.9% of people on this board admit that CP3 is better than Rondo and then come up with some ridiculous reason as to why they wouldn't trade Rondo for him. Anybody want to tell me how that makes any sense?

[Celtics18]

To win big in this league, you need to build around an all-time great like a Pierce or KG. Rondo is not that guy. CP3 might not be either if his knees don't hold up, but if they do, then CP3 IS what we need to get banner 18.

Guys will go to play with Chris Paul if we have cap space, just like Lebron and Bosh went to play with Wade and Carmelo went to play with Amare. Rondo? No freaking way.

I love how 99.9% of people on this board admit that CP3 is better than Rondo and then come up with some ridiculous reason as to why they wouldn't trade Rondo for him. Anybody want to tell me how that makes any sense?

Chris Paul is marginally better than Rondo right now, but there's no guarantee that he'll be significantly better in the long run.  He's also way more expensive and is going to be a free agent after this season.  If you want to build around a great, young point guard, there are way more options to do so with Rajon Rondo than with Chris Paul. 

There's a snippet of my "ridiculous reason" for keeping Rondo, and not subscribing to all of this Chris Paul or bust fervor that's going on around here. 

[wiley]

To win big in this league, you need to build around an all-time great like a Pierce or KG. Rondo is not that guy. CP3 might not be either if his knees don't hold up, but if they do, then CP3 IS what we need to get banner 18.

Guys will go to play with Chris Paul if we have cap space, just like Lebron and Bosh went to play with Wade and Carmelo went to play with Amare. Rondo? No freaking way.

I love how 99.9% of people on this board admit that CP3 is better than Rondo and then come up with some ridiculous reason as to why they wouldn't trade Rondo for him. Anybody want to tell me how that makes any sense?

Chris Paul is marginally better than Rondo right now, but there's no guarantee that he'll be significantly better in the long run.  He's also way more expensive and is going to be a free agent after this season.  If you want to build around a great, young point guard, there are way more options to do so with Rajon Rondo than with Chris Paul. 

There's a snippet of my "ridiculous reason" for keeping Rondo, and not subscribing to all of this Chris Paul or bust fervor that's going on around here. 

well said.  the plug-in Chris Paul and "voila" theory of basketball isn't working for me either.  The Celtics need not one but two big athletic bigs, and giving up Rondo plus assets decreases the likelihood of getting them.  Better a bridge year than a bridge to nowhere.

[Spilling Green Dye]

I love Rondo but if we can get CP3 I'd be all for it.

Derek Fisher is poor defensively, which Chris Paul thoroughly exploited.  CP even destroyed Kobe when Kobe was guarding him.  But Rondo?  All they had to do was keep Kobe 8 feet from the hoop to guard Rondo which enabled Kobe to get 10million rebounds in game 7.  Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny.  I love his rebounding, defense, and timing (especially on fast breaks), but Rondo needs a bunch of scorers and vets around him to succeed.  

Also ask yourself this:  Who would other players rather play with, Chris Paul or Rondo?

Rondo is a great trade asset b/c he's a very good PG with a friendly contract.  There's nothing wrong with thinking of ways he could be traded.

[paulcowens]

I think it depends on what other players you want.   I don't ever recall the Celtics being the type of team that Marquee players wanted to be on.  We always attracted the oddballs, the guys who didn't quite fit the mold.  Marquee players come to us late in their careers, in search of  championships.  Maybe the closest we ever came to a normal marquee player was Antoine, and we all know how that worked out.

I'm not saying that we haven't had some of the greatest players in the history of the game, but always oddballs, guys who see the game a little bit differently.   Rondo is perfect for us, and like the best of our oddballs, he has upside out the roof, precisely because he, like they, sees the game a little bit differently.

Chris Paul is a great player.  He's not what we need as a cornerstone.  We have what we need. We have to have some faith in Rondo.  He has improved year by year and he'll continue to do so.  If not, then we'll have to talk about making a change. 

[wiley]

I love Rondo but if we can get CP3 I'd be all for it.

Derek Fisher is poor defensively, which Chris Paul thoroughly exploited.  CP even destroyed Kobe when Kobe was guarding him.  But Rondo?  All they had to do was keep Kobe 8 feet from the hoop to guard Rondo which enabled Kobe to get 10million rebounds in game 7.  Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny.  I love his rebounding, defense, and timing (especially on fast breaks), but Rondo needs a bunch of scorers and vets around him to succeed.  

Also ask yourself this:  Who would other players rather play with, Chris Paul or Rondo?

Rondo is a great trade asset b/c he's a very good PG with a friendly contract.  There's nothing wrong with thinking of ways he could be traded.

rondo doesn't need scoring vets around him to succeed (by the way that defines the current Celtics), just scorers and shooters of any age.  Boston's lineup helps and fits Rondo's game in some ways but the lack of athleticism on the roster and style of play probably hurts his game some too.  The Celtics are about everyone subjecting their game in some way to help the cause of team basketball, and Rondo subjucates just like the big 3 do it.  If you let Rondo loose in a D'antoni system with athletes like Carmelo and Amare, do people understand what he'd be capable of numbers-wise?  I think he'd quickly attain superstar status with a triple double per week were he on the Knicks instead of the Celtics.  The only way I'd trade Rondo is if  he became unhappy subjugating his speed game for the sake of playing next to wily old farts in half court sets.  If going forward the Celtics are  going to be adding speed and athleticism to their team concept, then trading Rondo and a bunch of assets for Paul would be unbelievably foolish.

Yes, Paul destroyed the Lakers in a game or two.  But the Lakers were wiped out by the Mavs.  Is Paul's outside shot good enough to destroy the Heat, especially when his outside shot is replacing a certain percentage of outside shots taken by KG, RAy and Paul, all great, in fact better than Paul statistically from outside.  The Celtics are in desperate need of rebounding, athleticism and a high quality big/bigs.

Edit:  of course I'd trade Rondo if someone bowled me over with an offer.  The Hornets offering to take our Clippers pick and Jeff Green along with Rondo is not that offer.

[BballTim]

I love Rondo but if we can get CP3 I'd be all for it.

Derek Fisher is poor defensively, which Chris Paul thoroughly exploited.  CP even destroyed Kobe when Kobe was guarding him.  But Rondo?  All they had to do was keep Kobe 8 feet from the hoop to guard Rondo which enabled Kobe to get 10million rebounds in game 7.  Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny.  I love his rebounding, defense, and timing (especially on fast breaks), but Rondo needs a bunch of scorers and vets around him to succeed.  

Also ask yourself this:  Who would other players rather play with, Chris Paul or Rondo?

Rondo is a great trade asset b/c he's a very good PG with a friendly contract.  There's nothing wrong with thinking of ways he could be traded.

  If Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny then we wouldn't have advanced past the first round in any of the last three playoffs. Certainly we'd have never made it to the 2010 finals.

[Roy H.]

Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny.  I love his rebounding, defense, and timing (especially on fast breaks), but Rondo needs a bunch of scorers and vets around him to succeed.

I'd move Rondo for CP3.  At the same time, I'm not sure he's "easily mitigated".  I think a lot of us (myself included) have short memories, but remember his performances in the Knicks series:

Game 2:  30 points, 7 assists
Game 3:  15 points, 11 rebounds, 20 assists
Game 4:  21 points, 12 assists

Rondo has some very real flaws, but he's also fully capable of taking over a game.

[MBz]

I love Rondo but if we can get CP3 I'd be all for it.

Derek Fisher is poor defensively, which Chris Paul thoroughly exploited.  CP even destroyed Kobe when Kobe was guarding him.  But Rondo?  All they had to do was keep Kobe 8 feet from the hoop to guard Rondo which enabled Kobe to get 10million rebounds in game 7.  Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny.  I love his rebounding, defense, and timing (especially on fast breaks), but Rondo needs a bunch of scorers and vets around him to succeed.  

Also ask yourself this:  Who would other players rather play with, Chris Paul or Rondo?

Rondo is a great trade asset b/c he's a very good PG with a friendly contract.  There's nothing wrong with thinking of ways he could be traded.

  If Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny then we wouldn't have advanced past the first round in any of the last three playoffs. Certainly we'd have never made it to the 2010 finals.

Yes, but you need to take the big 3's decline into consideration.  Offensively KG has declined a lot, I think that was shown against Miami quite a bit.  He just couldn't handle playing inside anymore.  Pierce still is a very efficient player, but now against your elite defenders he has problems.   Against your elite defenders, he ends up staying out around the perimeter shooting too many outside shots.  Ray Allen is what he is, he's a good 3rd or 4th option on a winning team.  Ask him to be anymore than that and you start to have problems.  I love Rondo, his defense, passing ability and rebounding are great out of the PG position, but when Rondo becomes the best or second best player on your team, you start to have issues.  Teams just do not respect his scoring enough and it makes things more difficult for the other guys on the floor.  Now if Rondo can improve his 15-18 foot shot over the summer and start taking and making it on a consistent basis then I'd be all for keeping him, but if not, it may be time to look for someone else.  We need someone to keep the defense honest, if his man is going to sag off and just help elsewhere we're in major trouble.  Pierce, Allen and KG just aren't quick enough anymore to deal with double teams successfully.

[LooseCannon]

I'd move Rondo for CP3.

How many future first round draft picks would you be willing to include?

[Chris]

Rondo is so easily mitigated by other teams its not funny.  I love his rebounding, defense, and timing (especially on fast breaks), but Rondo needs a bunch of scorers and vets around him to succeed.

I'd move Rondo for CP3.  At the same time, I'm not sure he's "easily mitigated".  I think a lot of us (myself included) have short memories, but remember his performances in the Knicks series:

Game 2:  30 points, 7 assists
Game 3:  15 points, 11 rebounds, 20 assists
Game 4:  21 points, 12 assists

Rondo has some very real flaws, but he's also fully capable of taking over a game.

Agreed.  I think more accurately, I think Rondo can be taken out of his normal game relatively easily (compared to other top tier PGs).  Where he is truly unique is that even when he is taken out of what he would ideally like to be doing, he is able to still be very effective by using his energy and athleticism while playing off the ball.  However, when that energy and/or athleticism is hindered due to injuries or lack of confidence/motivation, he does in fact become relatively easy to be taken out of the game completely.

[Roy H.]

I'd move Rondo for CP3.

How many future first round draft picks would you be willing to include?

I'd be pretty comfortable with Rondo + Bradley + this year's draftee + Clippers pick.

[zimbo]

I'd move Rondo for CP3.

How many future first round draft picks would you be willing to include?

I'd be pretty comfortable with Rondo + Bradley + this year's draftee + Clippers pick.

I'm thinking NO would get better offers from other teams.

[StartOrien]

I'd move Rondo for CP3.

How many future first round draft picks would you be willing to include?

I'd be pretty comfortable with Rondo + Bradley + this year's draftee + Clippers pick.

I'm thinking NO would get better offers from other teams.

Outside of the Lakers, I don't know who is going to be able to realistically sign him while giving up more/equal value.

EDIT: They're too patient to do this, but if I'm the Thunder I'd offer Westbrook.

[MBz]

I'd move Rondo for CP3.

How many future first round draft picks would you be willing to include?

I'd be pretty comfortable with Rondo + Bradley + this year's draftee + Clippers pick.

I'm thinking NO would get better offers from other teams.

The thing is, I don't think they're going to want to trade him unless they get a superstar like LeBron or a comparable point guard.  There's not going to be many teams who are going to be able to give one of those things up.