Shaq Out for Game 5

[StartOrien]

Nazr Mohammed has been far more productive for the Thunder, as has Nick Collison.

Nazr Mohammed is averaging 1.7 points, 2.2 rebounds, 0.0 assists, 35.0% FG%, and 16.7% FT% in 10.7 minutes per game in the playoffs.  I think you might be getting him confused with somebody else.

Collison has been a more effective scorer and an inferior rebounder to Perk.

Collison has also done one heckuva job defensively on Z-Bo

[PosImpos]

Nazr Mohammed has been far more productive for the Thunder, as has Nick Collison.

Nazr Mohammed is averaging 1.7 points, 2.2 rebounds, 0.0 assists, 35.0% FG%, and 16.7% FT% in 10.7 minutes per game in the playoffs.  I think you might be getting him confused with somebody else.

Collison has been a more effective scorer and an inferior rebounder to Perk.

Hm.  Well, every time I've looked closely at the box score for OKC I've noticed that Nazr tends to have more points and rebounds than Perk in significantly fewer minutes.

In any case, I think it's fair to say that Perk really hasn't produced much at all for the Thunder.  You can say that the leadership and toughness he brought to the Thunder were very important for them, but I'm skeptical that the Celtics are really hurting because they lack those qualities without Perk.

[vinnie]

You are welcome. Pretty funny that he also mentioned Krstic and Troy Murphy as making the team stronger. Looking back at Danny's quotes is a laugh riot. I will search for a few more:

"You ARE right, these ARE funny. I'm happy you posted these!" said StartOrien very sarcastically.

Yes, we should keep these quotes secret, he wrote with a demonic laugh.

I think there's a difference between presenting the information, and celebrating it.

Laughing and celebrating are far different words. I am laughing at the lies that Danny told us back in February and March. Celebrating, hardly.

[vinnie]

A little more on what Danny had to say about Shaq in his interview in March with Dan Shaughnessy:

Me: You're banking on Shaq being Shaq in the springtime (O'Neal has not played in a game since Feb. 1).
 
Ainge: "He's better than he was in the fall."

Here is the only place in the DS interview that he mentioned JO:

"Now if Shaq and Jermaine [O'Neal] can't play we could be in trouble. But Perk's out for three weeks right now. He's coming off an ACL tear and he's got a sprained MCL on the other knee, so the health of all of those players is in question. I'm a Perk fan. Love him as a player. But I think he's a player that is not irreplaceable. Time will tell."

So the answer is no, you can't find the quote where he specifically said that he made the trade because Shaq would be healthy?

Saying that the reason we were 1 was because of Shaq is actually true. We were 1st place because of Shaq, not Perkins. So that is correct.

He was also correct when he said "We thought it was going to take some time for Perk. He wasn’t the shot-blocker or the rebounder that he’s been in the past." Perkins has 4 blocks in 9 games these playoffs. Meanwhile, Marc Gasol, who averaged 11 points, 7 rebounds, 1.7 blocks during the regular season, is averaging 19 points, 13 rebounds and 3 blocks against Perkins.

Other than that, he never said anything about doing the trade specifically counting on Shaq. He said that we would be in trouble if both Shaq and JO were down, but they aren't.

Tremendous job of splitting hairs and obfuscation. When Danny was asked about the trade, all he could talk about was how great the team was with Shaq. Seems to me that his faith in Shaq was one of the main reasons the trade was made. Obviously, nothing is going to convince you of that.

[PosImpos]

You are welcome. Pretty funny that he also mentioned Krstic and Troy Murphy as making the team stronger. Looking back at Danny's quotes is a laugh riot. I will search for a few more:

"You ARE right, these ARE funny. I'm happy you posted these!" said StartOrien very sarcastically.

Yes, we should keep these quotes secret, he wrote with a demonic laugh.

I think there's a difference between presenting the information, and celebrating it.

Laughing and celebrating are far different words. I am laughing at the lies that Danny told us back in February and March. Celebrating, hardly.

They weren't lies back in February and March, and I think it's disingenuous to characterize them as such.

From everything we know, Danny was in a position to make those statements in good faith.  Things didn't work out the way he hoped, but that doesn't mean he was lying.

The weather man isn't lying when he says it's gonna rain tomorrow and it doesn't.  You can say he's dumb or irresponsible if he's making that prediction based on really faulty or incomplete data, but if you don't even have access to that data I think you have to defer to him and assume that as an expert (or a guy advised by experts) he was in a position to make that prediction.

Kind of a belabored analogy, but I think you get my point.

[vinnie]

You are welcome. Pretty funny that he also mentioned Krstic and Troy Murphy as making the team stronger. Looking back at Danny's quotes is a laugh riot. I will search for a few more:

"You ARE right, these ARE funny. I'm happy you posted these!" said StartOrien very sarcastically.

Yes, we should keep these quotes secret, he wrote with a demonic laugh.

I think there's a difference between presenting the information, and celebrating it.

Laughing and celebrating are far different words. I am laughing at the lies that Danny told us back in February and March. Celebrating, hardly.

They weren't lies back in February and March, and I think it's disingenuous to characterize them as such.

From everything we know, Danny was in a position to make those statements in good faith.  Things didn't work out the way he hoped, but that doesn't mean he was lying.

The weather man isn't lying when he says it's gonna rain tomorrow and it doesn't.  You can say he's dumb or irresponsible if he's making that prediction based on really faulty or incomplete data, but if you don't even have access to that data I think you have to defer to him and assume that as an expert (or a guy advised by experts) he was in a position to make that prediction.

Kind of a belabored analogy, but I think you get my point.

Okay, not lies. Danny was just clearly wrong. My guess is he won't be big enough to admit it.

Although I do think saying that the team is strongers with Murphy and Krstic is stretching the truth pretty close to a lie.

[StartOrien]

Honest question, Vinnie,

Have you watched the Thunder play this round?

[vinnie]

Honest question, Vinnie,

Have you watched the Thunder play this round?

Yes. Every game. They are tied with Memphis 2-2 and will probably win the series and head to Dallas for the western conference finals.

[PosImpos]

You are welcome. Pretty funny that he also mentioned Krstic and Troy Murphy as making the team stronger. Looking back at Danny's quotes is a laugh riot. I will search for a few more:

"You ARE right, these ARE funny. I'm happy you posted these!" said StartOrien very sarcastically.

Yes, we should keep these quotes secret, he wrote with a demonic laugh.

I think there's a difference between presenting the information, and celebrating it.

Laughing and celebrating are far different words. I am laughing at the lies that Danny told us back in February and March. Celebrating, hardly.

They weren't lies back in February and March, and I think it's disingenuous to characterize them as such.

From everything we know, Danny was in a position to make those statements in good faith.  Things didn't work out the way he hoped, but that doesn't mean he was lying.

The weather man isn't lying when he says it's gonna rain tomorrow and it doesn't.  You can say he's dumb or irresponsible if he's making that prediction based on really faulty or incomplete data, but if you don't even have access to that data I think you have to defer to him and assume that as an expert (or a guy advised by experts) he was in a position to make that prediction.

Kind of a belabored analogy, but I think you get my point.

Okay, not lies. Danny was just clearly wrong. My guess is he won't be big enough to admit it.

He was wrong in thinking that Shaq would be available; I don't think he was wrong that the team would have been better than fine if he were healthy enough to play and produce.  There's no way to prove now whether he was right or wrong on that account.

There's certainly room for debate on whether Danny was right or wrong in assuming that Shaq would be healthy enough to play and produce, but as I've said a few times, I defer to him on this one.

[StartOrien]

Personally, even with Shaq down at this point in time I'd still prefer Jeff Green over Kendrick Perkins.

[dlpin]

Tremendous job of splitting hairs and obfuscation. When Danny was asked about the trade, all he could talk about was how great the team was with Shaq. Seems to me that his faith in Shaq was one of the main reasons the trade was made. Obviously, nothing is going to convince you of that.

No. All he could talk was how great the team was with Shaq when people questioned overhauling the roster of a 1st seed. And he was right, we were first because of Shaq, not because of Perk's 4-3 record as a starter. He was also absolutely, 100% right that Perk is nowhere near the player he was in the past.
Marc Gasol is looking like an all NBA center against him.

The bottom line is he NEVER said he made the trade because Shaq would be healhty.
He said that Perk wasn't the reason we were doing well, Shaq was, which is true. And he said that if we were without Shaq AND JO we would be in trouble, but both are healthy.

[vinnie]

Tremendous job of splitting hairs and obfuscation. When Danny was asked about the trade, all he could talk about was how great the team was with Shaq. Seems to me that his faith in Shaq was one of the main reasons the trade was made. Obviously, nothing is going to convince you of that.

No. All he could talk was how great the team was with Shaq when people questioned overhauling the roster of a 1st seed. And he was right, we were first because of Shaq, not because of Perk's 4-3 record as a starter. He was also absolutely, 100% right that Perk is nowhere near the player he was in the past.
Marc Gasol is looking like an all NBA center against him.

The bottom line is he NEVER said he made the trade because Shaq would be healhty.
He said that Perk wasn't the reason we were doing well, Shaq was, which is true. And he said that if we were without Shaq AND JO we would be in trouble, but both are healthy.

I guess logic dictates to me that if Danny said that Shaq was the reason the team had been doing well and if he also said in March that Shaq was better/healthier now than he was in the fall, he was depending on Shaq being a key cog in this team's chance to win a championship.

[Chris]

Personally, even with Shaq down at this point in time I'd still prefer Jeff Green over Kendrick Perkins.

I would too (at least against this team).  I understand I am in the minority about that though.

[action781]

Oh well, it's a loss but not a massive one.

Shaq was a useful asset in this series. I would have liked to have seen Garnett play alongside him more often and for to play against non-small lineups to give him protection defensively ... alas, it's all a non-issue now with Shaq out.

Actually, it is a very massive loss.   

[StartOrien]

Personally, even with Shaq down at this point in time I'd still prefer Jeff Green over Kendrick Perkins.

I would too (at least against this team).  I understand I am in the minority about that though.

I don't know how we could be in the minority, unless people just aren't watching the Thunder games. By his own admission, Perkins is operating at 65% and looks a  hint quicker than Shaq right now.