Author Topic: Jeff Green a great and crucial team player. Why don't more people see this?  (Read 25015 times)

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Offline LB3533

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If it's just Green and Rondo as our future pieces, Green will average 23 and 7 and if we are a .500 team, Green has a shot to be an AS in the East.

Offline GreenEnvy

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I remember watching one game where Green looked amazing. He was abusing his defender with turnaround jumpers in the post and other nice little moves. It is easy to only remember moments like this.

Yet I also remember games where he tried essentially the same move and missed horribly or, as he did tonight, lost the ball in a double team.

It is like people who remember Melo's lucky game 2 while forgetting that the chucks he hit in game 2 where many of the same inefficient shots that he missed in the other games.

I am not going to pretend that I can forecast Green's game. But I am aware of how easy it is to remember only a player's good moments or only their bad moments, depending upon what we expect to see from them. This is why stats are a valuable check. Yet this is not enough to forecast since players can vary greatly in efficacy depending upon the system they are playing in. Because of this there is great value in understanding the toolset a player brings to the table. Green seems to be interesting in this respect.

Green is the epitome of a player that needs to be stat-checked because he's so versatile and he plays so smooth.

When he does something right, he looks amazing doing it and it looks like he could repeat the feat 10 out of 10 times. And because he's so versatile, fans will remember him hitting a three, or going up for a huge rebound, or sporadically playing some great defense. So he gives off the impression he's an amazing player if you only remember the things he does right, and that leads to a lot of people around here calling him a potential superstar.

The stats cut through this bias and reveal that he's nothing more than a decent bench player on a contender.


Also, people seem to think that he will continue to improve in all aspects of his game, and that in two or three years from now he will be exactly the same player skill-wise but just better in every aspect, like a Jeff Green +plus+.

That's completely unrealistic for a player that's in his fourth year and who came into the league when he was already 21 years old. There's a saying, and it has a lot of truth to it, that you are what you are by your third year in the league. While that's not always true if you come into the league without getting many minutes, Jeff Green came into this league as a starter and has played tons of minutes. Further, he hasn't really shown much improvement at all during this time, so there's not even a positive trend in support of such a theory.

Jeff Green WILL get marginally better, but not by much. He'll never be an all-star, and that's for sure. He's just a good bench player, and it's refreshing to see what a real bench player is like after having to deal with the likes of Glen Davis, etc.

I disagree.

He was a stud in Georgetown that came to a seemingly great situation that in all actuality stalled his development. They played him out of position basically the entire time.

He is a player that has all the tools. You can say he isn't efficient because "the stats don't lie," that's fine. But he doesn't need to learn anything new, just hone the skills he already has. That comes with practice and confidence.

I honestly have no idea how things were done in OKC, but it seems like he was basically the leader in the locker room, while all plays were run for Durant/Westbrook. Then, they get other talents like Harden and Ibaka who fill positions of need, and he falls further down the depth chart. Here, he will be the student for the next few years.

This kid (he's only 24-years-old!) will be a very good player in this League, ESPECIALLY if Doc is his coach for the next few years.


PS - I fail to see how his numbers were so poor. In just 23 MPG, he averaged 10 PPG on 48.5% FG, which is pretty good to me when getting familiar with a new team, new role, and not getting plays run for you regularly.

Where they dominating numbers? No. But they weren't all that bad.
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Offline Kuberski1

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24 points on 27 shots for the series.  Not great, but not a disaster, and better the last 2 games, after clearly having the jitters the first 2 games.  Games 3 and 4 he looked better too, more aggressive, playing tighter D, more rebounds.  If he plays like he did in those 2 games the rest of the playoffs, I am OK with that....he will help and contribute.

Offline willis33

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People get on Jeff Green so much because they blame him for not having Perkins.  It's ridiculous, people need to realize that if Perk signed a contract extension he'd still be on the team.  Bottom line is he knew he was worth more on the FA market then the C's could offer him and felt it was time to cash in.  There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. 

Fans are panicky knowing the big 3 won't be able to play much longer and want another championship now.  Problem is, management has to think long term because they understand with or without Perk there's no guaranteeing a championship.  It was an amazing deal the C's made, but it won't show this year.   

Offline Rondo9dunx

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I like what i've seen from him so far. I had no idea who he was before the trade. I went and watched some highlights of him and what-not and as far as athletic ability and talent go he has it. He is still really young (is that a bad thing?) he is on a new team, where he went from being the 3rd go to guy to being the 8-9th guy. There has got to be a lot of pressure on him to hold his own on defense and i'm sure that has something to do with him being tenative on offense. He's been playing better as of a late and I think much like Nate did last year Jeff Green will win a game for us.

Hopefully he contributes more than nate did though :P Love Nate, he was great at times. But he was terrible at times too.

I seriously hope we find a way to keep Green and get him a lot more minutes next year.
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Offline wdleehi

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I expect Green to play up to what he is capable of. 


What he has shown playing for Boston is no that. 





He was brought here to help the chances of Boston to win this season.  (or so we are told)   



He needs to play at a level that actually helps Boston win this season, because he has shown he can play at that level in the NBA.

Offline 2short

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People get on Jeff Green so much because they blame him for not having Perkins.  It's ridiculous, people need to realize that if Perk signed a contract extension he'd still be on the team.  Bottom line is he knew he was worth more on the FA market then the C's could offer him and felt it was time to cash in.  There's absolutely nothing wrong with that. 

Fans are panicky knowing the big 3 won't be able to play much longer and want another championship now.  Problem is, management has to think long term because they understand with or without Perk there's no guaranteeing a championship.  It was an amazing deal the C's made, but it won't show this year.   
in a nut shell! tp
funny thing is you'd think cousy was traded in his prime the way some people are holding on to the perk thing

Offline moiso

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Quote
If we are on a momentum swing, or need a shot that gives us a bigger lead, he'll usually come through and help pad the momentum, or hit down that shot to help chip away at a lead, or to give us the lead back.

He may not do this as much as we'd all like, but, sure enough, if you look at key moments throughout all four games in this sweep, you'll see Green hitting a big basket for us in some form. Why don't we appreciate these things? Because they aren't accompanied by a lights out stat sheet?

Simply put, I don't accept arguments like "Yeah, he puts up mediocre numbers, but he always comes through when we need him to".  I think that such arguments are usually based on a pretty high selection / memory bias.  If Green came through as consistently as you suggest, this *would* show up in the stat sheet, in place of his 33% FG%.

I've seen nothing to make me believe that Jeff Green is any sort of a clutch player. 
This.  People have been putting positive spin on Jeff Green, but I think he was brought here to be an impact player off the bench.  He has been far from that- more like a guy to eat some minutes off the bench.  I'm not sure how any Celtics fan can be so happy with the guy.

And just because he is a tweener doesn't make him versatile.  He is a versatile scorer and that's it.  When I think of versatile I think of someone who can do a few of these things- score, rebound, defend, create, pass, shoot.  I don't see that from Green at all.  I would describe him as more one dimensional than versatile.

Offline kn 99

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 He is a young player in good shape. For now i would like to see 12 and 4 from him off the bench. after the big 3 era he will be a crucial player to the team. If we can keep him and bbd as well as rondo we will probobly still be a plus .500 team. He proved he can score the ball the last two games of the regular season when we rested the starters

Offline Chief

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The kid looks like a rookie out there. I hope for the Celtics, that he figures it out quickly. At times yesterday, I was saying, "this is no better than Scalabrine!" I know, a little harsh, but it's really how I was feeling.
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Offline SHAQATTACK

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Jeff has done Ok given its a new team, new role, new plays,  he  didn't want to be traded , and was TAUGHT to dislike KG and Celtics hard nose ball. He thought he was a long term OKC player I'm sure . Alot of mental adjustment . Mello was chomping at the bit to leave the Nuggets , think it was diff. for Perk and Green.

The more comfortable Jeff becomes with his new teamamtes , his minutes will go up. There is no reason in the playoffs, when PP is playing unhurt and well to force the issue.

 this week off may finally provide the practice time, for the Bench to finally jell . Doc can take time to work out the issues.

The next series is where I'm thinking DA ( thoughts) were for making the trade. PP is going to need help with the HEAT. He wanted a young set of fresh legs to chase LBJ , even if he doesn't score, this rests PP so he can have energy to provide offense.

His defense and rebounds will be critical off the bench to hold the fort , while PP rests.

We'll see alot of Green in the Heat series


Offline Cman

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I don't know about "great", but he's been solid.

I was hoping he'd come in and provide something simlar to what Posey provided in '07-'08, but he hasn't done that yet.  

Still, very solid.  We'll see if what we have seen so far is all we're going to get, or if he'll continue to grow more into his role off the bench.
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Offline KungPoweChicken

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Jeff green has played well so far, but he has the capacity for great improvement in the rest of the playoffs.

Offline jsingh1699

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i love seeing him in the low post. he has that nice soft hook and can always shoot over his defender (when hes playing the 3). i hope we put him down on the box some more next series.

also, somebody mentioned in another thread that if we swept the knicks, we'd have this week off. can someone confirm this? if thats the case, the celts would have a whole week to essentially run a mini camp to keep practicing different, getting people more familiar with each other and strategy, and finding a more defined role for green. this week could do wonders for us heading into miami.

Offline LB3533

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I don't know about "great", but he's been solid.

I was hoping he'd come in and provide something simlar to what Posey provided in '07-'08, but he hasn't done that yet. 

Still, very solid.  We'll see if what we have seen so far is all we're going to get, or if he'll continue to grow more into his role off the bench.

Posey gave us pretty good defense and 7 points per game along with effective 3 point shooting.

Green gives us a different dimension on the break and in the post with his hook shots and floaters.

Jeff can hit the occasional outside shot too, with some 3 point range.

Green and the rest of the bench will play much better in the playoffs going forward.

Baby has already started.