Doc on WEEI: "No one said no" to Perk trade

[the_Bird]

 Perk is one of the toughest guy in the NBA.  He is one of the low-post defenders in the league.  He's a great teammate and he fit in beautifully with the Big 4.  He's not nearly as injury prone as some people make him out to be.  That being said, people are delusional if they think he's better than JO.  Even after his surgery, JO if not as intense is just as tough as Perk.  JO while not as good a low post defender, is a better shot blocker and better help defender who takes more charges while drawing less fouls.  JO is a serious offensive threat that cannot be left alone even for a moment.  This fact alone makes KG better because people can't help off him to guard KG.  Although we don't go to him, JO CAN and WILL score on iso situations against smaller or slower guys which was impossible for Perk.  JO is a 6 time all-star who can rebound, pass, shoot free-throws, and finish at the basket better than Perk.  He's 32 and has plenty of gas left in his tank compared to Shaq and KG.  The guy was hand-picked to be our starting center for this season by Danny and Doc.  He's been unlucky this season with the timing of his surgery but that was not his fault but the doctors'.  Giving JO 6 mil a year is a steal.  Giving Perk 8 mil a year is not unreasonable, but we can fill that need for less money for the near future.  Lakers have 3 skilled bigs who will see time in the playoffs.  If healthy, we have Kg, JO, Baby, Shaq and Kristic.  I don't think Troy Murphy will see minutes in the Playoffs.  Even Green might fill in at the 4 for some minutes.  Even without Perk, we have easliy the Biggest Baddest frontline in the NBA.  There is absolutely no need for another Big guy.

In his prime, JO >>> Perk.

JO's an OLD 32.  He's got more left in the tank that Shaq, but there's a reason KG's been mostly healthy this season and JO hasn't been. 

He's also got a LOT less left in the tank than Perk.

[Lucky17]

I've seen a couple lineups with Pierce at the SG alongside Green at SF.

I think that could be the immediate future of this team, once Ray is gone.

[Rondo2287]

I've seen a couple lineups with Pierce at the SG alongside Green at SF.

I think that could be the immediate future of this team, once Ray is gone.

Agreed, I think the last two years where Pierce has put more emphasis on 3 point shooting he has started playing a great deal more like a SG anyways.  Which is part of our problem.  Rondo won't drive, Pierce and Ray like to shoot 3's.  We don't have a center, and KG does his thing.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Krstic is here, and other than his recent injury, he's healthy. So while JO and Shaq are hurt, we actually got healthier by trading Perk.

Perk is healthy right now as well.  Except his team uses him as a starter. 

Which is fine. We got Green also. The point was that this isn't solely a Perk being healthy vs. JO/Shaq being healthy argument.

[wdleehi]

Krstic is here, and other than his recent injury, he's healthy. So while JO and Shaq are hurt, we actually got healthier by trading Perk.

Perk is healthy right now as well.  Except his team uses him as a starter. 

Which is fine. We got Green also. The point was that this isn't solely a Perk being healthy vs. JO/Shaq being healthy argument.

Which was overkill in replacing Daniels.

[bbd24]

 Perk is one of the toughest guy in the NBA.  He is one of the low-post defenders in the league.  He's a great teammate and he fit in beautifully with the Big 4.  He's not nearly as injury prone as some people make him out to be.  That being said, people are delusional if they think he's better than JO.  Even after his surgery, JO if not as intense is just as tough as Perk.  JO while not as good a low post defender, is a better shot blocker and better help defender who takes more charges while drawing less fouls.  JO is a serious offensive threat that cannot be left alone even for a moment.  This fact alone makes KG better because people can't help off him to guard KG.  Although we don't go to him, JO CAN and WILL score on iso situations against smaller or slower guys which was impossible for Perk.  JO is a 6 time all-star who can rebound, pass, shoot free-throws, and finish at the basket better than Perk.  He's 32 and has plenty of gas left in his tank compared to Shaq and KG.  The guy was hand-picked to be our starting center for this season by Danny and Doc.  He's been unlucky this season with the timing of his surgery but that was not his fault but the doctors'.  Giving JO 6 mil a year is a steal.  Giving Perk 8 mil a year is not unreasonable, but we can fill that need for less money for the near future.  Lakers have 3 skilled bigs who will see time in the playoffs.  If healthy, we have Kg, JO, Baby, Shaq and Kristic.  I don't think Troy Murphy will see minutes in the Playoffs.  Even Green might fill in at the 4 for some minutes.  Even without Perk, we have easliy the Biggest Baddest frontline in the NBA.  There is absolutely no need for another Big guy.

In his prime, JO >>> Perk.

JO's an OLD 32.  He's got more left in the tank that Shaq, but there's a reason KG's been mostly healthy this season and JO hasn't been. 

He's also got a LOT less left in the tank than Perk.

Shouldn't Perk have a ton left in his tank ? For the career, he averages 22 mins per game.  Both O'neals trump that.  Your going to pay 9 M per for 22 mins/game, coming off the injuries he had ?  Shoot, your not even guaranteed 20 mins with his knees at this point.

You take more gambles than I do.  No way his production is worth that.  Not on a team with KG already in the middle.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Krstic is here, and other than his recent injury, he's healthy. So while JO and Shaq are hurt, we actually got healthier by trading Perk.

Perk is healthy right now as well.  Except his team uses him as a starter. 

Which is fine. We got Green also. The point was that this isn't solely a Perk being healthy vs. JO/Shaq being healthy argument.

Which was overkill in replacing Daniels.

Well, if overkill means awesome trade and great value for Perk then yeah, complete overkill.

[the_Bird]

I've seen a couple lineups with Pierce at the SG alongside Green at SF.

I think that could be the immediate future of this team, once Ray is gone.

Agreed, I think the last two years where Pierce has put more emphasis on 3 point shooting he has started playing a great deal more like a SG anyways.  Which is part of our problem.  Rondo won't drive, Pierce and Ray like to shoot 3's.  We don't have a center, and KG does his thing.

How's he taking more 3 pointers?  He shoots 3.7/game, this year and last.  For his career, he's averaged 4.4/game.  For his career, 27% of his shot attempts were from behind the arc; this year, it was 29%.  Not really that much of a change.  

Paul's a prototypical small forward.  He can play the off-guard, but he's not really all that quick anymore, if you try to move him to the SG permanently you're liable to hurt yourself on the defensive end.

[OsirusCeltics]

Wow.  There are still people out there that think this was a good trade?

Then again I didn't even think anybody would be for it when it happened.

Actually, I don't think it was just a good trade.  It was a GREAT trade.

You add up all the details involved and you can't think otherwise.

-- Perkins coming off major knee surgery

-- Perkins getting injured yet again after coming back on a standard play

-- Roster depleted with Injuries including Perkins at the time

-- Your team with free agents or additions like Shaq, JO, and Semih didn't miss a beat when Perkins was down and out

-- Can't sign Perk for 4/5 M per

-- Core 4 still here

-- Your not giving him 8/9 M per next season with the core 4 here

-- Received a 24 yr old whose just getting his feet wet in the league who has far more upside than Perkins at this point in his career

-- Also got a backup Center with starter experience, with a future 1st round Clipper pick to help down the road as well

-- Value returned was far greater than letting an injured player walk in the future for virtually nothing

I giveth you a TP

[Chris]

So basically, Green's a player that only really plays well at Pierce's position.  He's not a guy that you really want backing up KG.  He's not a guy that you really want to plug into BBD's role next season.  That limits his worth to the C's...  and if he's not likely to get much more playing time next season as a result, makes it more likely he pushes to go elsewhere as a free agent.

Well, Pierce can also play the 2 against most matchups as well.  

Basically, for this trade to be a success for THIS season, Green needs to be a very productive backup wing, and they need the centers they have to be healthy, and productive.  They may use him at times against certain matchups at PF (many teams play SFs at PFs, which Green can certainly matchup against), but if Green can give them 15-20 minutes per game behind Pierce and Allen of high level basketball, then he will be a plus.  And, if those changes are enough to get this team as far as they would have gone with Perkins, then the future prospects of the trade make it a good deal.

While Doc certainly was intrigued of using Green at the PF at times (and he really is not much different than Posey at that position...a little less defense, a little more offense, but both could be exploited by matchups), they got him to play on the wing.  

The problem with the trade so far has been that neither of those requirements have worked out so far.  The Centers have been injured (Shaq, JO) and inneffective (Krstic), and Green has been very mediocre.  

All of that can change very quickly in the playoffs though, so, just like Doc said, lets wait and see how the season ends before deciding if it was a good trade.

[BudweiserCeltic]

I've seen a couple lineups with Pierce at the SG alongside Green at SF.

I think that could be the immediate future of this team, once Ray is gone.

Agreed, I think the last two years where Pierce has put more emphasis on 3 point shooting he has started playing a great deal more like a SG anyways.  Which is part of our problem.  Rondo won't drive, Pierce and Ray like to shoot 3's.  We don't have a center, and KG does his thing.

How's he taking more 3 pointers?  He shoots 3.7/game, this year and last.  For his career, he's averaged 4.4/game.  For his career, 27% of his shot attempts were from behind the arc; this year, it was 29%.  Not really that much of a change. 

Paul's a prototypical small forward.  He can play the off-guard, but he's not really all that quick anymore, if you try to move him to the SG permanently you're liable to hurt yourself on the defensive end.

Of course he won't be liable to be hurt in the defensive end. There aren't enough players that are good enough to take advantage of the situation. While Pierce might not be the quickest, he has superb footwork.

[LB3533]

I really think you can play Green at the 2 as well.

That's a way to get Green more minutes.

I say play West strictly as back PG to Rondo.

Green can be backup to both Paul and Ray.

[wdleehi]

Krstic is here, and other than his recent injury, he's healthy. So while JO and Shaq are hurt, we actually got healthier by trading Perk.

Perk is healthy right now as well.  Except his team uses him as a starter. 

Which is fine. We got Green also. The point was that this isn't solely a Perk being healthy vs. JO/Shaq being healthy argument.

Which was overkill in replacing Daniels.

Well, if overkill means awesome trade and great value for Perk then yeah, complete overkill.

No.


It means giving up a likely need for a luxury item. 

[the_Bird]

Krstic is here, and other than his recent injury, he's healthy. So while JO and Shaq are hurt, we actually got healthier by trading Perk.

Perk is healthy right now as well.  Except his team uses him as a starter. 

Which is fine. We got Green also. The point was that this isn't solely a Perk being healthy vs. JO/Shaq being healthy argument.

Which was overkill in replacing Daniels.

Well, if overkill means awesome trade and great value for Perk then yeah, complete overkill.

No.


It means giving up a likely need for a luxury item. 

Exactly. 

Green's a nice piece to have, but realistically we'd be in much better shape with a lesser player backing up Pierce (an Anthony Parker-type) and to be going into the playoffs with Perk/Shaq/JO in the frontcourt.  I'm a little shocked this is even still being debated.

[LB3533]

Krstic is here, and other than his recent injury, he's healthy. So while JO and Shaq are hurt, we actually got healthier by trading Perk.

Perk is healthy right now as well.  Except his team uses him as a starter. 

Which is fine. We got Green also. The point was that this isn't solely a Perk being healthy vs. JO/Shaq being healthy argument.

Which was overkill in replacing Daniels.

Well, if overkill means awesome trade and great value for Perk then yeah, complete overkill.

No.


It means giving up a likely need for a luxury item. 

Exactly. 

Green's a nice piece to have, but realistically we'd be in much better shape with a lesser player backing up Pierce (an Anthony Parker-type) and to be going into the playoffs with Perk/Shaq/JO in the frontcourt.  I'm a little shocked this is even still being debated.

You can't always have what you want.

All 3 of those guys were, at the time. hurt or unavailable.

If Danny didn't make a move, we'd have a ton of our core guys even more fatigued than they already are.

I am pretty sure Danny would have made a "smallerish" type deal if there was one to be had.

All reports spoken from Doc and Danny were there may have been 2 deals on the table....both included  trading away Perk....and they pulled the trigger on the best of the 2 deals.