Honestly, Every other NBA team sucks

[OsirusCeltics]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

[barefacedmonk]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

You're biased when comparing those two because you're a Celtics fan..and I can appreciate that. I really don't want to defend a Laker and Kobe on top of that...so, I'll let you have the final word. However, I doubt there are many people who will agree with your post.

[OsirusCeltics]

The Lakers have 3 All-Star caliber bigs and the 2nd best shooting guard in the league, plus a solid defensive stopper at the 3 and a guy who hits clutch shots (despite being a liability in every other way) at PG.  When their top 6 players are healthy and focused, it's really difficult imagining any team beating them.  This is doubly true when they have HCA (and they will, except against SA).

That's the honest, painful truth.


At full strength, the Celtics have the 5th best point guard in the league who is also the league's 2nd best passer, the 4th or 5th best small forward, the 5th best shooting guard (but best pure shooter), the 2nd best defensive player and maybe 10th or 11th best big man in the league, a guy who is maybe the 5th best 6th man, and a bench filled with decent role players.

The Celtics are impressive if at full strength, but the Lakers are more impressive.  Right now, it looks much more likely that the Lakers will be at full strength for the playoffs than that the Celtics will be.

Rankings have nothing to do with who is the best TEAM, and Celtics are that

Yes, but overall talent and impact at each position has something to do with who is the best TEAM, and the Lakers win on both counts, I think.  All that the Celtics can boast is a superior team defense and great chemistry.  Since '08, the Lakers have developed both of those things as well, however, which is why they've been winning.  The Celtics have been inconsistent.

Even individually, Celtics are better.
Rondo > Fisher
Ray > Kobe (Ray had to change his game to come on this team. He is way more clutch than Kobe)
Pierce > Artest
KG > Gasol
Shaq and JO > Bynum

I nearly fell down laughing when I read this. Ray is better than Kobe? And Shaq and JO combined are better than bynum? As for KG and Gasol, I give that one pretty much a tossup. Celts win the other two matchups.

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals?

.......**crickets**....

Are we talking about who's better in regards to the last 30 seconds of a 48 minute game and ignoring the other 47.5 minutes, or the whole game? If it's the first, then you should apply the same to the rest of the match-ups..

Exactly.

Also, its not like Ray was exactly tearing it up in Game 7 last year, either.  3/14?  That's clutch?  Or the 0-13 in Game 3?

Or 6/24 in Game 7 and letting Fisher, Artest, and Gasol hit all the big shots for him...

[OsirusCeltics]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

You're biased when comparing those two because you're a Celtics fan..and I can appreciate that. I really don't want to defend a Laker and Kobe on top of that...so, I'll let you have the final word. However, I doubt there are many people who will agree with your post.

Honestly, it wasn't cause I'm a Celtics fan. I've always thought Kobe was overrated ever since he came in the league. Jordan's retirement and Grant Hill's injury plagued career forced the league to overhype him

[vinnie]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

[Donoghus]

The Lakers have 3 All-Star caliber bigs and the 2nd best shooting guard in the league, plus a solid defensive stopper at the 3 and a guy who hits clutch shots (despite being a liability in every other way) at PG.  When their top 6 players are healthy and focused, it's really difficult imagining any team beating them.  This is doubly true when they have HCA (and they will, except against SA).

That's the honest, painful truth.


At full strength, the Celtics have the 5th best point guard in the league who is also the league's 2nd best passer, the 4th or 5th best small forward, the 5th best shooting guard (but best pure shooter), the 2nd best defensive player and maybe 10th or 11th best big man in the league, a guy who is maybe the 5th best 6th man, and a bench filled with decent role players.

The Celtics are impressive if at full strength, but the Lakers are more impressive.  Right now, it looks much more likely that the Lakers will be at full strength for the playoffs than that the Celtics will be.

Rankings have nothing to do with who is the best TEAM, and Celtics are that

Yes, but overall talent and impact at each position has something to do with who is the best TEAM, and the Lakers win on both counts, I think.  All that the Celtics can boast is a superior team defense and great chemistry.  Since '08, the Lakers have developed both of those things as well, however, which is why they've been winning.  The Celtics have been inconsistent.

Even individually, Celtics are better.
Rondo > Fisher
Ray > Kobe (Ray had to change his game to come on this team. He is way more clutch than Kobe)
Pierce > Artest
KG > Gasol
Shaq and JO > Bynum

I nearly fell down laughing when I read this. Ray is better than Kobe? And Shaq and JO combined are better than bynum? As for KG and Gasol, I give that one pretty much a tossup. Celts win the other two matchups.

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals?

.......**crickets**....

Are we talking about who's better in regards to the last 30 seconds of a 48 minute game and ignoring the other 47.5 minutes, or the whole game? If it's the first, then you should apply the same to the rest of the match-ups..

Exactly.

Also, its not like Ray was exactly tearing it up in Game 7 last year, either.  3/14?  That's clutch?  Or the 0-13 in Game 3?

Or 6/24 in Game 7 and letting Fisher, Artest, and Gasol hit all the big shots for him...

Hence, the either part.

[BballTim]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

  Kobe is at best a fringe top 10 player.

[Chelm]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

  Kobe is at best a fringe top 10 player.

And Ray is not.  To have an argument about overall basketball ability between Ray Allen and Kobe Bryant makes our fanbase look uneducated and completely biased.

EDIT:  I have vague recollections about some fans in the late 90s saying Reggie Miller was better than Michael Jordan.  Kind of a weirdly similar argument.

[BballTim]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

  Kobe is at best a fringe top 10 player.

And Ray is not.  To have an argument about overall basketball ability between Ray Allen and Kobe Bryant makes our fanbase look uneducated and completely biased.

EDIT:  I have vague recollections about some fans in the late 90s saying Reggie Miller was better than Michael Jordan.  Kind of a weirdly similar argument.

  I didn't say Ray was better.

[Chelm]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

  Kobe is at best a fringe top 10 player.

And Ray is not.  To have an argument about overall basketball ability between Ray Allen and Kobe Bryant makes our fanbase look uneducated and completely biased.

EDIT:  I have vague recollections about some fans in the late 90s saying Reggie Miller was better than Michael Jordan.  Kind of a weirdly similar argument.

  I didn't say Ray was better.

Point taken.  But some did.

[CaliCeltics]

I may feel differently, but I still feel confident. After the way they took it to San Antonio yesterday, I feel like NO team can beat us in a seven game series. We may not have the best individual players, but we have the best TEAM.

As for the Lakers? They have the best European influenced Front Court.

[OsirusCeltics]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

  Kobe is at best a fringe top 10 player.

And Ray is not.  To have an argument about overall basketball ability between Ray Allen and Kobe Bryant makes our fanbase look uneducated and completely biased.

EDIT:  I have vague recollections about some fans in the late 90s saying Reggie Miller was better than Michael Jordan.  Kind of a weirdly similar argument.

Seriously, you throw out cliches and act like its truth. And you never explain WHY Kobe is better. Don't hide behind common dogma and tell me why Kobe is better lol
I have been a Ray Allen fan WAY before he became a Celtic

[OsirusCeltics]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

Do you read or know about NBA history and past players? 
Seriously...

[vinnie]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

  Kobe is at best a fringe top 10 player.

And Ray is not.  To have an argument about overall basketball ability between Ray Allen and Kobe Bryant makes our fanbase look uneducated and completely biased.

EDIT:  I have vague recollections about some fans in the late 90s saying Reggie Miller was better than Michael Jordan.  Kind of a weirdly similar argument.

Seriously, you throw out cliches and act like its truth. And you never explain WHY Kobe is better. Don't hide behind common dogma and tell me why Kobe is better lol
I have been a Ray Allen fan WAY before he became a Celtic

Let's start with championships won and then go to just about every stat except for 3-point shooting percentage and my guess is Kobe would win in just about every category. He also has been a very good defensive player when he wants to be. I honestly don't know why I am even bothering arguing this because it is senseless.

[vinnie]

Lol when's the last time Kobe hit a clutch shot deep in the playoffs/NBA Finals? .......**crickets**....

How many playoff games do you think will be decided by a "clutch play"?

Ray is a better 3 point shooter but Kobe is the better overall player.

Ray is the better overall player. If a player is not that clutch and you're not gonna count the final two minutes then he's not a very good player to begin with

The NBA is using Kobe's name to sell Jordan tickets, and its so annoying.
I don't know if you ever watched Ray on the Bucks or Sonics, but he was a totally different player on those teams. He had to change his game greatly to fit the Celtic system. That's unselfishness, something I can't say for Kobe

This is laughable and this is my last comment on it. Kobe is one of the top 10 players in the history of the league.

Do you read or know about NBA history and past players? 
Seriously...

I have been a Celtics fan for nearly 50 years. If Kobe is not top 10, he is top 15-20 all time. There really is no debate about it.