Optimistic about Shaq/JO

[StartOrien]

I've tried to stay out of the "optimism" threads lately, because I still have a pretty sour demeanor about anything related to the trade.  However, there's really no other place to talk about Shaq's recovery right now, so...

I have absolutely no faith that Shaq will return at a high level.  The continual pushing back of his return date is a vivid reminder of the KG injury, and to me it suggests that the team doctors don't have a clue of when -- or if -- he'll be back.  Sure, he can probably get on the court, but will he be mobile and effective?  That's the big concern.

I'd love to know how much of this Danny knew at the time of the Perk trade.  Did he legitimately believe that Shaq's return was fairly imminent, or did he know that there was no firm diagnosis?  I know some will say that Shaq is fine and that the team is just resting him, but I don't buy that.  With the team struggling how it is, and with the need to get everyone used to playing together as a cohesive unit, I don't think the team would have the hubris to try to plug Shaq in at the last minute if they could avoid it.

So, yeah...  I'm not all that optimistic about Shaq.  As for JO, I like the guy, but I'll believe it when I see it.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_lGupq7qao

In all honesty, I agree with you somewhat as far as Shaq goes. Especially with the reports that it could actually be tendinitis, which would explain a lot.

I said this before, but my guess is that Danny didn't know and this summer you might see a changes to the training staff this summer. I recall when Ainge was on EEI post-trade he answered a question pretty matter-of-fact-ly that he thought Shaq would be on the floor before Perkins would. Perhaps he just has a good poker face, but he sounded like he was answering pretty hoenstly.

[greenpride32]

Just to clarify for everyone; Shaq has an injury to the achilles tendon.  It is not uncommon for this injury to reoccur (chronic condition) and take a long time to heal.  Shaq's return date keeps getting pushed because the doctors are just using guestimates.  It's not something they can just patch up and fix.  I suspect there may have been a setback; trying to come back too early and reaggrivation.

[Roy H.]

Just to clarify for everyone; Shaq has an injury to the achilles tendon.  It is not uncommon for this injury to reoccur (chronic condition) and take a long time to heal.  Shaq's return date keeps getting pushed because the doctors are just using guestimates.  It's not something they can just patch up and fix.  I suspect there may have been a setback; trying to come back too early and reaggrivation.

Yeah, definitely.  The two questions that poses, though, are:

1) Is there any probability that the injury will heal prior to the playoffs, to the point where Shaq can play effectively?; and

2) If the prognosis really was up in the air, did it make sense to rely on Shaq's health in the Perk trade?

[winsomme]

I've tried to stay out of the "optimism" threads lately, because I still have a pretty sour demeanor about anything related to the trade.  However, there's really no other place to talk about Shaq's recovery right now, so...

I have absolutely no faith that Shaq will return at a high level.  The continual pushing back of his return date is a vivid reminder of the KG injury, and to me it suggests that the team doctors don't have a clue of when -- or if -- he'll be back.  Sure, he can probably get on the court, but will he be mobile and effective?  That's the big concern.

I'd love to know how much of this Danny knew at the time of the Perk trade.  Did he legitimately believe that Shaq's return was fairly imminent, or did he know that there was no firm diagnosis?  I know some will say that Shaq is fine and that the team is just resting him, but I don't buy that.  With the team struggling how it is, and with the need to get everyone used to playing together as a cohesive unit, I don't think the team would have the hubris to try to plug Shaq in at the last minute if they could avoid it.

So, yeah...  I'm not all that optimistic about Shaq.  As for JO, I like the guy, but I'll believe it when I see it.

Danny is a great GM. He brought this franchise back from the brink and to the top of the league...but he made this crazy move, so he needs to be out front of it the whole way now. I honestly want daily updates at this point on Shaq because he knew the ONLY way this trade many any sense was if Shaq was coming back.

He may get sick of the questions, but is there  really anything else for us to know about? I think think we saw in the IND game that the other hot button issue (the Rondo's lost it angle) is not  really an issue....

all we need to know at this point IMO is whether Shaq is gonna play at any kind of an effective level. and I am constantly checking for updates.

[winsomme]

2) If the prognosis really was up in the air, did it make sense to rely on Shaq's health in the Perk trade?

I think it's pretty clear that the answer to this question is no. even Danny said in the days after the trade that we could be in trouble if the ONeals don't return.

our system just doesn't work without a defensive center.

In our two Title runs we had Perk + PJ and Perk + Sheed with KG to complement. that's the mixture that works at that position.

now we are down TWO defensive centers. It needs to be Shaq + JO to make me feel at all comfortable going into the playoffs.

[Eddie20]

I'm pretty confident JO can have at least the same impact as PJ did in 08. PJ averaged 2.9 ppg, and 2.4 rpg in 13.6 mpg. And did so at 38 years of age.

And since it's an optimism thread, I'll also add that Shaq will probably give us more than Perkins did in 08. Perk just wasn't that good that year.

[winsomme]

I'm pretty confident JO can have at least the same impact as PJ did in 08. PJ averaged 2.9 ppg, and 2.4 rpg in 13.6 mpg. And did so at 38 years of age.

And since it's an optimism thread, I'll also add that Shaq will probably give us more than Perkins did in 08. Perk just wasn't that good that year.

well in the Finals in 08, LA didn't have the same depth at center they did last year.

[Assassin70]

I'm pretty confident JO can have at least the same impact as PJ did in 08. PJ averaged 2.9 ppg, and 2.4 rpg in 13.6 mpg. And did so at 38 years of age.

And since it's an optimism thread, I'll also add that Shaq will probably give us more than Perkins did in 08. Perk just wasn't that good that year.

well in the Finals in 08, LA didn't have the same depth at center they did last year.

Stats are really irrelevant in this conversation.  Thing is PJ never did anything to hurt us.  He made no real mistakes...he just came in put on his hard hat and did what the foreman asked of him.

Will we get this from JO?  If we do I like our chances.

[get_banners]

Yeah, definitely.  The two questions that poses, though, are:

1) Is there any probability that the injury will heal prior to the playoffs, to the point where Shaq can play effectively?; and

2) If the prognosis really was up in the air, did it make sense to rely on Shaq's health in the Perk
trade?

the real question is: is the injury legit? many believe shaq really did hurt himself, but the celtics have told him to basically try and heal completely and get in better shape before coming back because they want him as close to the diesel for the entire playoff run as possible. thus, these "setbacks" might be about the team finding ways to justify their strategy. this seems to make sense, as shaq seemed ready to play more than a month ago. then again, he's older, so maybe this is a real problem.

[angryguy77]

We can't forget him saying he would be playing right now if the playoffs had started. That was a couple of weeks ago, so my guess(that's all we can do) is that he will be back. I'm not too worried about him working his way back in because of the type of game he plays.

I don't think he will lose his defense by missing 2 months. We don't need the offense, but I don't think rust will affect layup and dunking abilities either.

either way, if we didn't get a legit backup for PP, none of this would have mattered anyway.

[Roy H.]

I love the new company line from the Jackie article.  Danny "thinks" Shaq and JO will be playing and contributing, but even if they don't, the trade was a win, because our struggles have nothing to do with the center position.

In other words, nothing to see here, move along.  All the words about the importance of Shaq after the trade were just nonsense, apparently.  Also, Roy Hibbert and Darko Milicic looking like all-stars?  That must be Rondo's fault.

[Roy H.]

either way, if we didn't get a legit backup for PP, none of this would have mattered anyway.

I'd rather have Anthony Parker playing 10 minutes as my backup 3 than Nenad Krstic as my starting center.

[angryguy77]

either way, if we didn't get a legit backup for PP, none of this would have mattered anyway.

I'd rather have Anthony Parker playing 10 minutes as my backup 3 than Nenad Krstic as my starting center.

I'd rather have Green. If Oneal bros don't comeback, I don't think having Perk alone would have brought us a championship. Green will be a better asset to us down the road imo.

[P2]

I've been saying for over a month now that Shaq is done for the season. And with each game he doesn't play and each return date pushed back it looks more and more like it.

[StartOrien]

either way, if we didn't get a legit backup for PP, none of this would have mattered anyway.

I'd rather have Anthony Parker playing 10 minutes as my backup 3 than Nenad Krstic as my starting center.

I think you're likely to see KG at the center position if those two are unhealthy in the playoffs.

Which wouldn't be an issue unless we were to play the Magic.