Would you trade JO for JJ Redick?

[indeedproceed]

I look at what the team's weaknesses are at the time of a possible trade and just like last season we are a poor rebounding team(presently rank 26th).A healtier JO could probably contribute close to(5)boards a game in a backup role with a block or two here and there.JJ would only strengthen our shooting in instances when he's hot.He goes thru some cold spells like Nate.In the playoffs possessions are at a premium and each rebound grabbed gives us an extra opportunity to score.

Disagree about JJ's game. He really is a poor man's Ray Allen..and like Ray Allen, people always talk about his shooting, but he's able to put the ball on the floor, and be pretty crafty with it when he does. On top of that his defense, while not elite by anyone's standards, is good enough to be worked into our team's defense, especially on the second unit, when he'd be defending a lot of second unit guards. 

But, that said, a healthy Nate and a healthy Delonte makes JJ redundant.

[Eja117]

Would I trade JO for Redick? Yes,

Would Orlando? No.

Does wanting to trade JO for Redick automatically make JO washed up? No.

Pretty much my feelings. Especially since I think Semih might be better, we got Perk coming back, and I'm not even 100% sure that Luke H isn't better.

JJ is a good thing to have.  

[Eja117]

Actually I sorta see this as a no brainer due to the nature of the beast. JO is clearly clearly on the downside, and JJ is coming into his prime. We have next year and the year after that to think of.  It would be nice to have a guy like JJ to back up older guys like Ray in the future.

[nickagneta]

I look at what the team's weaknesses are at the time of a possible trade and just like last season we are a poor rebounding team(presently rank 26th).A healtier JO could probably contribute close to(5)boards a game in a backup role with a block or two here and there.JJ would only strengthen our shooting in instances when he's hot.He goes thru some cold spells like Nate.In the playoffs possessions are at a premium and each rebound grabbed gives us an extra opportunity to score.

The Celtic's are 9th in rebound differential.  (+1.3)

The defensive rebounding is really strong.  The offensive rebounding is weak because the Celtics put emphasis on getting back on defense vs. chasing offensive rebounds.   

Agree 100% with wd. The C's are not a poor rebopunding team. They are on average, outrebounding the team they play against. They are an excellent defensive rebounding team, currently 3rd in the league in defensive rebounding percentage.

The C's scheme that has them get back on defense rather than hit the offensive boards and their pace make it look like they aren't a good rebounding team if you look strictly at the rebounds per game. But that's a flawed way to look at team rebounding.

It reminds me of the people who call the Patriot's defense bad because they give up a lot of yards, it's a deceiving stat that needs context from other stats to tell the true story.

[ManUp]

If Redick were a 6-7/6-8 SF, yes.

Since he isn't I'll pass, we're covered at the 2 spot.

[Tai]

The real question should be this: would Orlando trade JJ Redick for JO?

I think you would find that the answer is a big fat NO. At this point, he is worth more than a has-been big man who just came off knee surgery and is yet to make any meaningful contribution to this team.

I agree, and on top of that, trading JO to the magic would eliminate their biggest weakness since their revamping, backup center. No way, let them find a backup to Howard from someone else.

O'Neal would shore up their center position the same way he's shoring up our's.  O'Neal's value will be next season when there's a contract on the line.  Whether he's here or in Orlando he'll be a waste of a roster spot this season.  I'd do the trade in a heartbeat.

as Roy said, don't count JO out yet. He is too proud a player and too close to some of the guys on this team to mail it in until his contract year. He will be very productive when fully recovered. Our main advantage over the magic, heat, and even LA is our size when healthy. I wouldn't give that up for an additional SG who would play behind Ray, Nate, Dwest, and Daniels.

The one area where I agree with Roy is that I don't think O'Neal is close to being washed up yet.  Where we differ is that I think he tanks in non-contract years.  I watched him admittedly only a few games last year beyond our's.  He looked last year like he was putting up numbers in his sleep.  He's that talented.  In a lot of ways, talented like Shaq where if he gets on the court he'll put up numbers. 

He's going to put up 10 and 8 next year for somebody.  Maybe better. 

I think O'Neal's demeanor and zest for the game changed after the brawl.  He put up good numbers last season in his sleep.  At no point when I saw him did he ever look like he was busting his butt.  He's that talented.  He can do it going through the motions.....As long as he has something to play for.  He, IMHO, doesn't play for the love of the game...Or for championships.  He has the greatest opportunity for a championship he's ever had on this team...And he's out of shape.  He, IMHO, plays for the money. 

I don't think we'll see any of that this season because he's simply not in shape.  Look at him.  He looks about 30 lbs bigger than last season.  Opposed to Perk, who had a major knee injury...Looks chisled.

Next season will mirror last season for O'Neal.  So if he's not traded, Danny essentially signed him for a 1 year, 11.8m contract.

So basically, you've looked for every opportunity since he was signed to say JO won't help the Celtics.

It's hard to play hard all the time when you're injured; just know that, please.

I wish I could mistake this for anything other than a slam on JO, but I can't. Not when OP's willing to trade a viable bigs to the Magic AND that the C's can use all the big they can get. Are you serious?

[KungPoweChicken]

A bench backcourt of West and Redick is far more formidable than Robinson and West.

yes, but a Orlando C combo of Dwight and JO is more formidable than just Dwight.  Don't forget we have Robinson, west, Daniels and Bradley than can back up the 2 spot.  (granted, Bradley is a "break glass only in case of emergency' situation)

The problem is all of those players you mentioned are terrible undersized. Sure, J.O. would make the Magic a better team, but Redick would made the Celtics a better team. To get something, you've got to give something. I think it's a fair trade that equally benefits both teams in an area of need.

[wdleehi]

A bench backcourt of West and Redick is far more formidable than Robinson and West.

yes, but a Orlando C combo of Dwight and JO is more formidable than just Dwight.  Don't forget we have Robinson, west, Daniels and Bradley than can back up the 2 spot.  (granted, Bradley is a "break glass only in case of emergency' situation)

The problem is all of those players you mentioned are terrible undersized. Sure, J.O. would make the Magic a better team, but Redick would made the Celtics a better team. To get something, you've got to give something. I think it's a fair trade that equally benefits both teams in an area of need.

Do the Celtics need Redick?


I think the combo of West and Daniels is more then enough behind Ray and Pierce.


The Magic do need JO.  There is no defensive big (who is actually big) behind Howard.  Get him in foul trouble, they become the under 6'10 team. 


It makes no sense for the Celtics when the overall advantage goes to the Magic.

[Finkelskyhook]

The real question should be this: would Orlando trade JJ Redick for JO?

I think you would find that the answer is a big fat NO. At this point, he is worth more than a has-been big man who just came off knee surgery and is yet to make any meaningful contribution to this team.

I agree, and on top of that, trading JO to the magic would eliminate their biggest weakness since their revamping, backup center. No way, let them find a backup to Howard from someone else.

O'Neal would shore up their center position the same way he's shoring up our's.  O'Neal's value will be next season when there's a contract on the line.  Whether he's here or in Orlando he'll be a waste of a roster spot this season.  I'd do the trade in a heartbeat.

as Roy said, don't count JO out yet. He is too proud a player and too close to some of the guys on this team to mail it in until his contract year. He will be very productive when fully recovered. Our main advantage over the magic, heat, and even LA is our size when healthy. I wouldn't give that up for an additional SG who would play behind Ray, Nate, Dwest, and Daniels.

The one area where I agree with Roy is that I don't think O'Neal is close to being washed up yet.  Where we differ is that I think he tanks in non-contract years.  I watched him admittedly only a few games last year beyond our's.  He looked last year like he was putting up numbers in his sleep.  He's that talented.  In a lot of ways, talented like Shaq where if he gets on the court he'll put up numbers.  

He's going to put up 10 and 8 next year for somebody.  Maybe better.  

I think O'Neal's demeanor and zest for the game changed after the brawl.  He put up good numbers last season in his sleep.  At no point when I saw him did he ever look like he was busting his butt.  He's that talented.  He can do it going through the motions.....As long as he has something to play for.  He, IMHO, doesn't play for the love of the game...Or for championships.  He has the greatest opportunity for a championship he's ever had on this team...And he's out of shape.  He, IMHO, plays for the money.  

I don't think we'll see any of that this season because he's simply not in shape.  Look at him.  He looks about 30 lbs bigger than last season.  Opposed to Perk, who had a major knee injury...Looks chisled.

Next season will mirror last season for O'Neal.  So if he's not traded, Danny essentially signed him for a 1 year, 11.8m contract.

So basically, you've looked for every opportunity since he was signed to say JO won't help the Celtics.

It's hard to play hard all the time when you're injured; just know that, please.

I wish I could mistake this for anything other than a slam on JO, but I can't. Not when OP's willing to trade a viable bigs to the Magic AND that the C's can use all the big they can get. Are you serious?

Yes.  I am serious.  I don't see O'Neal contributing this season and I've said that since he was signed.  We need all the bigs we can get.  You're right.  But an out of shape center who doesn't play doesn't qualify as viable.  Our definitions of viable differ greatly.

[KungPoweChicken]

A bench backcourt of West and Redick is far more formidable than Robinson and West.

yes, but a Orlando C combo of Dwight and JO is more formidable than just Dwight.  Don't forget we have Robinson, west, Daniels and Bradley than can back up the 2 spot.  (granted, Bradley is a "break glass only in case of emergency' situation)

The problem is all of those players you mentioned are terrible undersized. Sure, J.O. would make the Magic a better team, but Redick would made the Celtics a better team. To get something, you've got to give something. I think it's a fair trade that equally benefits both teams in an area of need.

Do the Celtics need Redick?


I think the combo of West and Daniels is more then enough behind Ray and Pierce.


The Magic do need JO.  There is no defensive big (who is actually big) behind Howard.  Get him in foul trouble, they become the under 6'10 team.  


It makes no sense for the Celtics when the overall advantage goes to the Magic.

They don't need Redick, but he certainly would make the team better. I don't want Robinson on the floor in the playoffs. Having Redick on the floor would allow Delonte to play point and Redick to play shooting guard--a lot better than a  Robinson and West combination.

[wdleehi]

A bench backcourt of West and Redick is far more formidable than Robinson and West.

yes, but a Orlando C combo of Dwight and JO is more formidable than just Dwight.  Don't forget we have Robinson, west, Daniels and Bradley than can back up the 2 spot.  (granted, Bradley is a "break glass only in case of emergency' situation)

The problem is all of those players you mentioned are terrible undersized. Sure, J.O. would make the Magic a better team, but Redick would made the Celtics a better team. To get something, you've got to give something. I think it's a fair trade that equally benefits both teams in an area of need.

Do the Celtics need Redick?


I think the combo of West and Daniels is more then enough behind Ray and Pierce.


The Magic do need JO.  There is no defensive big (who is actually big) behind Howard.  Get him in foul trouble, they become the under 6'10 team.  


It makes no sense for the Celtics when the overall advantage goes to the Magic.

They don't need Redick, but he certainly would make the team better. I don't want Robinson on the floor in the playoffs. Having Redick on the floor would allow Delonte to play point and Redick to play shooting guard--a lot better than a  Robinson and West combination.

Every time we see the West/Nate combo, the Celtics have looked good during that time.  West allows Nate to be the scorer that he is . 


I rather see Nate out there for the Celtics then to see JO come in and play the defense he is capable against the Celtics.

[dark_lord]

to answer the question....in a heartbeat!

[KungPoweChicken]

A bench backcourt of West and Redick is far more formidable than Robinson and West.

yes, but a Orlando C combo of Dwight and JO is more formidable than just Dwight.  Don't forget we have Robinson, west, Daniels and Bradley than can back up the 2 spot.  (granted, Bradley is a "break glass only in case of emergency' situation)

The problem is all of those players you mentioned are terrible undersized. Sure, J.O. would make the Magic a better team, but Redick would made the Celtics a better team. To get something, you've got to give something. I think it's a fair trade that equally benefits both teams in an area of need.

Do the Celtics need Redick?


I think the combo of West and Daniels is more then enough behind Ray and Pierce.


The Magic do need JO.  There is no defensive big (who is actually big) behind Howard.  Get him in foul trouble, they become the under 6'10 team.  


It makes no sense for the Celtics when the overall advantage goes to the Magic.

They don't need Redick, but he certainly would make the team better. I don't want Robinson on the floor in the playoffs. Having Redick on the floor would allow Delonte to play point and Redick to play shooting guard--a lot better than a  Robinson and West combination.

Every time we see the West/Nate combo, the Celtics have looked good during that time.  West allows Nate to be the scorer that he is . 


I rather see Nate out there for the Celtics then to see JO come in and play the defense he is capable against the Celtics.

How many games have Robinson and West played together--three or four? That's not a large sample size. I feel that Robinson has been mediocre at best all season, and in the playoffs his deficiencies will only be magnified. In my opinion, he is a liability. It seems we just have a difference of opinion, which I can respect. But when it comes to trades, I'm always in favor of bettering the Celtics even if, with this specific example, they may potentially better the Magic in the process.

[hpantazo]

The real question should be this: would Orlando trade JJ Redick for JO?

I think you would find that the answer is a big fat NO. At this point, he is worth more than a has-been big man who just came off knee surgery and is yet to make any meaningful contribution to this team.

I agree, and on top of that, trading JO to the magic would eliminate their biggest weakness since their revamping, backup center. No way, let them find a backup to Howard from someone else.

O'Neal would shore up their center position the same way he's shoring up our's.  O'Neal's value will be next season when there's a contract on the line.  Whether he's here or in Orlando he'll be a waste of a roster spot this season.  I'd do the trade in a heartbeat.

as Roy said, don't count JO out yet. He is too proud a player and too close to some of the guys on this team to mail it in until his contract year. He will be very productive when fully recovered. Our main advantage over the magic, heat, and even LA is our size when healthy. I wouldn't give that up for an additional SG who would play behind Ray, Nate, Dwest, and Daniels.

The one area where I agree with Roy is that I don't think O'Neal is close to being washed up yet.  Where we differ is that I think he tanks in non-contract years.  I watched him admittedly only a few games last year beyond our's.  He looked last year like he was putting up numbers in his sleep.  He's that talented.  In a lot of ways, talented like Shaq where if he gets on the court he'll put up numbers.  

He's going to put up 10 and 8 next year for somebody.  Maybe better.  

I think O'Neal's demeanor and zest for the game changed after the brawl.  He put up good numbers last season in his sleep.  At no point when I saw him did he ever look like he was busting his butt.  He's that talented.  He can do it going through the motions.....As long as he has something to play for.  He, IMHO, doesn't play for the love of the game...Or for championships.  He has the greatest opportunity for a championship he's ever had on this team...And he's out of shape.  He, IMHO, plays for the money.  

I don't think we'll see any of that this season because he's simply not in shape.  Look at him.  He looks about 30 lbs bigger than last season.  Opposed to Perk, who had a major knee injury...Looks chisled.

Next season will mirror last season for O'Neal.  So if he's not traded, Danny essentially signed him for a 1 year, 11.8m contract.

So basically, you've looked for every opportunity since he was signed to say JO won't help the Celtics.

It's hard to play hard all the time when you're injured; just know that, please.

I wish I could mistake this for anything other than a slam on JO, but I can't. Not when OP's willing to trade a viable bigs to the Magic AND that the C's can use all the big they can get. Are you serious?

Yes.  I am serious.  I don't see O'Neal contributing this season and I've said that since he was signed.  We need all the bigs we can get.  You're right.  But an out of shape center who doesn't play doesn't qualify as viable.  Our definitions of viable differ greatly.

I understand you have a bias against JO, but he is pretty close with some of the guys on this team, he's not going to mail it in. Danny wouldn't have signed him to the full MLE if he thought there was a chance that he would mail it in. He will perform very well when healthy, and we will see that in the next 5-10 games. Let's see if you still have the same opinion at the end of the season. I have to give injured players a pass. KG looked bad last year, Rondo played poorly when trying to battle his injuries, Pierce was downright awful when he played a couple of games with the flu, and Perk will not look good for a while when he comes back. It doesn't mean any of them are lazy and saving their efforts for contract years. JO has had major knee issues for years, it significantly affects his play (again: see KG last year). When healthy, he is a proven talent and will bring his best effort, and unlike guys like Mikki Moore, Patrick Obryant, etc., he definitely has the killer instinct in him.

[hokinanaz]

NO WAY!! you already have ray quise west von bradley and nate that can all play sg/off guard, why would we trade a tall C/PF that Orlando needs for a guard we dont need, and that isn't an improvement on what we have. we need a tall/athletic SF not reddick.