Stop it with the Amar'e MVP talk...please

[housecall]

By that logic, Kobe and Iverson should have been 5-6 time MVP's...Durrant last year...
When he starts doing something else but scoring let me know about it.
I love him and his game, but IMO he is not worth mentioning in a sentence about MVP this year. Yes he is a scoring beast, but his team is 17-12 and the W came against below .400 teams mostly, just OKC and DEN are somewhat good teams they were able to beat.

I agree with most of what you're saying,especially"he is not worth mentioning in a sentence about MVP this year".If this is any help if history repeats itself the player who is mentioned the earliest for the award is usually not the one who ends up winning it...remember last season around this time Melo was the front runner...we saw how that turned out.Seems like right around the All Star break the media will lock into one player for the rest of the season.

[makaveli]

How is he not? When his team had a 3 and 9 record he led them to, what, 9 straight wins scoring 30 plus points in each of those games? Take Stodemire off the Knicks and they are a lottery team. He should definitely be in consideration during MVP talks... At the moment the only other player worth debating against Amare is probably Dirk.

look at what he achieved with PHX with one of the best PG in Steve Nash...he deserves the Knicks

[housecall]

What annoys me is that offense seems to be enough to get the MVP. Defense is what wins championships. Why not just call it offensive player of the year. They do that with defense.

TP...it always pays to reread some threads because you might have missed something said that is better than most.I feel the exact same way in this MVP award.At least Lebron(as much as i hate to give him any credit)was considered as one of the NBA's top defenders when he won.I never felt some winners in the past 10yrs. were deserve'd of it because of their offensive greatness only.If defense really counted in this race KG would be in the conversation.It seems to be about which player brings the better offensive highlights to Sports Center on a nightly basis.

[ChainSmokingLikeDino]

How is he not? When his team had a 3 and 9 record he led them to, what, 9 straight wins scoring 30 plus points in each of those games? Take Stodemire off the Knicks and they are a lottery team. He should definitely be in consideration during MVP talks... At the moment the only other player worth debating against Amare is probably Dirk.

look at what he achieved with PHX with one of the best PG in Steve Nash...he deserves the Knicks

And look at what he is achieving now with Felton. Perhaps Amar'e contributed just as much to Steve Nash as Nash got credit for Amar'e.

What annoys me is that offense seems to be enough to get the MVP. Defense is what wins championships. Why not just call it offensive player of the year. They do that with defense.

TP...it always pays to reread some threads because you might have missed something said that is better than most.I feel the exact same way in this MVP award.At least Lebron(as much as i hate to give him any credit)was considered as one of the NBA's top defenders when he won.I never felt some winners in the past 10yrs. were deserve'd of it because of their offensive greatness only.If defense really counted in this race KG would be in the conversation.It seems to be about which player brings the better offensive highlights to Sports Center on a nightly basis.

And to further the Nash mention above. The most undeserving of MVP's (and multiple!) for the very fact that he is an awful defensive player. But, there you go. One of the worst defensive players in the NBA in Steve Nash wins multiple MVP's. I could never get down with Nash MVP for this reason (and if those who voted for Nash really valued the principles that got Nash the MVP then Jason Kidd should have multiple MVP's).

[Celtic#9]

Mare is averaging over 2 blocks per game (7th in the NBA) and almost 1 steal per game (0.9).

[Edgar]

Regular season fantasy no.1 ranked is not equal to MVP

[Fafnir]

Mare is averaging over 2 blocks per game (7th in the NBA) and almost 1 steal per game (0.9).

Blocks and steals don't mean all that much overall. Especially when Amar'e plays at a high pace and a lot of minutes.

[Who]

Amare's effort level has been a lot higher defensively. You can see him trying more. More concentration. More second efforts. A little bit more aware of his positioning. All are excellent signs. Early signs ... signs of progress.

To me, Amare is still a below average defender (albeit a serviceable one) despite him making real improvements to his defensive game this season ... I'd also add ... I think if he was on a quality defensive team, I think his progress would be even greater and he'd be well on his way to being an above average defender.

Amare has truly taken on some more responsibility for his own performance defensively + is making the initial efforts to improve. Which is great.

Unfortunately, the same can't be said about his rebounding.

[PosImpos]

Mare is averaging over 2 blocks per game (7th in the NBA) and almost 1 steal per game (0.9).

That's nice, but look at the numbers his matchup puts up on any given night.  The numbers he gives up are almost as impressive as the ones he gets himself.

[Cman]

I don't get all the NY Knicks and Amare hate.
I mean, this is a team that has sucked for so long, and looked rudderless after losing out on LeBron. But they've been playing better than anyone thought, and Amare is one reason why.  MVP?  No, but ... i just don't get why everyone loves to hate on them.  I mean, they're like the runty stepchild of the Atlantic -- they wont win, so we shouldn't act so threatened by them.

[Fafnir]

I don't get all the NY Knicks and Amare hate.
I mean, this is a team that has sucked for so long, and looked rudderless after losing out on LeBron. But they've been playing better than anyone thought, and Amare is one reason why.  MVP?  No, but ... i just don't get why everyone loves to hate on them.  I mean, they're like the runty stepchild of the Atlantic -- they wont win, so we shouldn't act so threatened by them.

So you're trying to say we shouldn't hate the Knicks?

 

[Fan from VT]

Well, the real issue is that the NBA already established that Steve Nash was fully responsible for the success of Amare on those Suns teams...so he can't be in the discussion, because that might mean that, actually, Nash had really good teammates during his MVP years and actually wasn't fully responsible for making them better. It doesn't fit the narrative.

[guava_wrench]

Well, the real issue is that the NBA already established that Steve Nash was fully responsible for the success of Amare on those Suns teams...so he can't be in the discussion, because that might mean that, actually, Nash had really good teammates during his MVP years and actually wasn't fully responsible for making them better. It doesn't fit the narrative.

No one is fully responsible for their team's success, but in Nash's MVP years, people focused on how the team looked with Nash on the floor and with Nash off the floor. Their offense was all about Nash controlling tempo, their team was all about their offense, and their team was very successful.

Nash's MVP is based on qualitative judgments with the assumption that not all player contributions can be gleaned from points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks.

Let's also not pretend that Amare hasn't improved over the years. Amare worked hard to extend his range a few years ago. I don't see how Amare's performance this season says anything conclusive about Nash's performance during his MVP years.

[Fan from VT]

Well, the real issue is that the NBA already established that Steve Nash was fully responsible for the success of Amare on those Suns teams...so he can't be in the discussion, because that might mean that, actually, Nash had really good teammates during his MVP years and actually wasn't fully responsible for making them better. It doesn't fit the narrative.

No one is fully responsible for their team's success, but in Nash's MVP years, people focused on how the team looked with Nash on the floor and with Nash off the floor. Their offense was all about Nash controlling tempo, their team was all about their offense, and their team was very successful.

Nash's MVP is based on qualitative judgments with the assumption that not all player contributions can be gleaned from points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks.

Let's also not pretend that Amare hasn't improved over the years. Amare worked hard to extend his range a few years ago. I don't see how Amare's performance this season says anything conclusive about Nash's performance during his MVP years.

Point being...for arbitrary reasons, the majority of people seem to search out extra reasons why Nash should be MVP to legitimize their desire to see him be MVP while the majority of people search for extra reasons Amare shouldn't even be considered MVP  to legitimize their desire to not see him be MVP.

[guava_wrench]

Well, the real issue is that the NBA already established that Steve Nash was fully responsible for the success of Amare on those Suns teams...so he can't be in the discussion, because that might mean that, actually, Nash had really good teammates during his MVP years and actually wasn't fully responsible for making them better. It doesn't fit the narrative.

No one is fully responsible for their team's success, but in Nash's MVP years, people focused on how the team looked with Nash on the floor and with Nash off the floor. Their offense was all about Nash controlling tempo, their team was all about their offense, and their team was very successful.

Nash's MVP is based on qualitative judgments with the assumption that not all player contributions can be gleaned from points, rebounds, assists, steals and blocks.

Let's also not pretend that Amare hasn't improved over the years. Amare worked hard to extend his range a few years ago. I don't see how Amare's performance this season says anything conclusive about Nash's performance during his MVP years.

Point being...for arbitrary reasons, the majority of people seem to search out extra reasons why Nash should be MVP to legitimize their desire to see him be MVP while the majority of people search for extra reasons Amare shouldn't even be considered MVP  to legitimize their desire to not see him be MVP.

There is a clear non-arbitrary reason why Amare should not yet be considered. His team's record.

You need to be on a top regular season team to be considered for MVP. Until the Knicks are a top team, the discussion can be tabled. That's just how things work in the NBA.