BBD vs Chris Bosh

[wiley]

BBD is able to be effective because of the other weapons on the floor when he plays with the first unit. Last year when he was with the second unit he struggled to get his shots off.

How come when I make the same argument swapping Rondo for BBD nobody every agrees?  It's the same situation.  Of course Rondo is by far the superior talent over BBD.  But his stats would not be as good without the players around him.  The proof is Rondo hasn't exactly been able to get the second unit to go.

I think some do agree, though I'm not one of them.  In general, nobody agrees because it's not the same situation.  Rondo's too far beyond to make a parallel sort of argument.  You're talking about a guy who's broken some very long standing records, both regular season and playoff records, at a very young age.

[Celtics4ever]

BBD is a stronger  and hustles more but I think Bosh has the better over all game and more versatile skillset.   

Their ( MIA ) stats have took a nosedive and they don't have the maturity that the Big Three had to come together as smoothly.   They also don't have the desperation to win a title that the Big Three had yet.   

They are the Tres Perdedors to me!  That is Three Losers, no?

[nba is the worst]

Are you saying that Baby could put up 20/10 on a crappy team; because it think that is where your argument falls apart. BBD is able to be effective because of the other weapons on the floor when he plays with the first unit. Last year when he was with the second unit he struggled to get his shots off.

Is it really beyond all possibility?

Speculating (only as devil's advocate)for entertainment purposes, let's say the Raptors replaced Bosh with BBD, and built their offensive game around him the same way.

Who is to say definitively that he wouldn't get 20/12 in that system - while being an improvement defensively?

I haven't seen that Bosh's height has been much of a factor so far this season due to his soft play...

[Jon]

Let me preface my comments with this: I think Bosh is overrated, I hate Miami, and I like Big Baby.

However, the notion that Bosh and Baby are even close to the same level is just plain silly.  The simple fact of the matter is that all three of their superstars' stats are going to slip, just like our Big Three all had their stats slip when they came to play together.  

Furthermore, I see Bosh's rebounding numbers down as a byproduct of having to space the floor to allow Wade and James to penetrate.

Finally, while Baby's played incredibly on the offensive end and taken a ton of charges, if you go back and watch the game tape from last night, you'll still see that when he's in the game, team's get to the basket far easier than when he's not.  For all of his hardwork, he'll never make up for the fact that he's very short and not very athletically gifted.  

I don't understand. You seem to be saying Bosh is playing at a higher level than Davis, when the opposite is true - at least from watching games and reviewing stats are concerned.

Talk about teams "getting to the basket easier":

When Bosh is on the floor, players like David West, Jason Smith and Okafor go nuts!

Bosh is a jump shooter who is presently 25th among PFs in scoring, 48th in FG%, and 34th in rpg.

He has been exposed as totally overrated - while Davis is just as clearly underrated - at least by you!

I'm not saying that Bosh is playing at a high level.  However, I am saying that when you get a triumvirate like you have in Miami or you have here in Boston, you have to stop evaluating players based on stats.  Statistically speaking, Pierce, KG, and Allen are all shells of their former selves.  However, certainly in 2008 and arguably now, each is a better player than he's ever been.  

So that was my gripe about judging Bosh in the same way.  

Furthermore, I'm not trying to say that Bosh is playing well.  I'm simply saying that though Bosh and Baby's numbers are similar, Bosh is still clearly the better player.  

[guava_wrench]

Let me preface my comments with this: I think Bosh is overrated, I hate Miami, and I like Big Baby.

However, the notion that Bosh and Baby are even close to the same level is just plain silly.  The simple fact of the matter is that all three of their superstars' stats are going to slip, just like our Big Three all had their stats slip when they came to play together.  

Furthermore, I see Bosh's rebounding numbers down as a byproduct of having to space the floor to allow Wade and James to penetrate.

Finally, while Baby's played incredibly on the offensive end and taken a ton of charges, if you go back and watch the game tape from last night, you'll still see that when he's in the game, team's get to the basket far easier than when he's not.  For all of his hardwork, he'll never make up for the fact that he's very short and not very athletically gifted.  

I don't understand. You seem to be saying Bosh is playing at a higher level than Davis, when the opposite is true - at least from watching games and reviewing stats are concerned.

Talk about teams "getting to the basket easier":

When Bosh is on the floor, players like David West, Jason Smith and Okafor go nuts!

Bosh is a jump shooter who is presently 25th among PFs in scoring, 48th in FG%, and 34th in rpg.

He has been exposed as totally overrated - while Davis is just as clearly underrated - at least by you!

I'm not saying that Bosh is playing at a high level.  However, I am saying that when you get a triumvirate like you have in Miami or you have here in Boston, you have to stop evaluating players based on stats.  Statistically speaking, Pierce, KG, and Allen are all shells of their former selves.  However, certainly in 2008 and arguably now, each is a better player than he's ever been.  

So that was my gripe about judging Bosh in the same way.  

Furthermore, I'm not trying to say that Bosh is playing well.  I'm simply saying that though Bosh and Baby's numbers are similar, Bosh is still clearly the better player.  

Why would you give Bosh that special consideration when he is #3 on the go-to chart, and BBD is at best #5? Sure, Bosh can be expected to do less playing with those other 2, but Baby has been playing with Ray, Pierce, KG and Rondo.

I suppose you can argue that Bosh is still adjusting to his situation, and that may very well be the case.

If Bosh continues like this the entire season and Miami doesn't impress in the playoffs, I can see Bosh being trade bait for a more complimentary big man.

[Jon]

Let me preface my comments with this: I think Bosh is overrated, I hate Miami, and I like Big Baby.

However, the notion that Bosh and Baby are even close to the same level is just plain silly.  The simple fact of the matter is that all three of their superstars' stats are going to slip, just like our Big Three all had their stats slip when they came to play together.  

Furthermore, I see Bosh's rebounding numbers down as a byproduct of having to space the floor to allow Wade and James to penetrate.

Finally, while Baby's played incredibly on the offensive end and taken a ton of charges, if you go back and watch the game tape from last night, you'll still see that when he's in the game, team's get to the basket far easier than when he's not.  For all of his hardwork, he'll never make up for the fact that he's very short and not very athletically gifted.  

I don't understand. You seem to be saying Bosh is playing at a higher level than Davis, when the opposite is true - at least from watching games and reviewing stats are concerned.

Talk about teams "getting to the basket easier":

When Bosh is on the floor, players like David West, Jason Smith and Okafor go nuts!

Bosh is a jump shooter who is presently 25th among PFs in scoring, 48th in FG%, and 34th in rpg.

He has been exposed as totally overrated - while Davis is just as clearly underrated - at least by you!

I'm not saying that Bosh is playing at a high level.  However, I am saying that when you get a triumvirate like you have in Miami or you have here in Boston, you have to stop evaluating players based on stats.  Statistically speaking, Pierce, KG, and Allen are all shells of their former selves.  However, certainly in 2008 and arguably now, each is a better player than he's ever been.  

So that was my gripe about judging Bosh in the same way.  

Furthermore, I'm not trying to say that Bosh is playing well.  I'm simply saying that though Bosh and Baby's numbers are similar, Bosh is still clearly the better player.  

Why would you give Bosh that special consideration when he is #3 on the go-to chart, and BBD is at best #5? Sure, Bosh can be expected to do less playing with those other 2, but Baby has been playing with Ray, Pierce, KG and Rondo.

I suppose you can argue that Bosh is still adjusting to his situation, and that may very well be the case.

If Bosh continues like this the entire season and Miami doesn't impress in the playoffs, I can see Bosh being trade bait for a more complimentary big man.

I doubt it.  Riley is not going to give up on the experiment that early. 

[snively]

Got to agree with Jon here.  Baby needs to shoot at 57% to make up for his severe limitations on the glass and defensively.

This comparison will probably look really silly once each player regresses/progresses to their norms.

[action781]

Are you saying that Baby could put up 20/10 on a crappy team; because it think that is where your argument falls apart. BBD is able to be effective because of the other weapons on the floor when he plays with the first unit. Last year when he was with the second unit he struggled to get his shots off.

No I am not saying that BBD would ever average 20/10 on any team( he simply is too short). I realize that Bosh is the better talent,but BBD gets the more out of his talent while Bosh struggles to contribute much if he isn't scoring. If BBD isn't scoring he is still taking charges,setting great picks and doing the dirty work and getting the crowd pumped up.

Tell Charles Barkley he was too short to average 20/10.  Baby isn't too short - he's not talented enough.

"Great" picks?  I don't think getting blown for illegal screens 5% of the time qualifies him as a great pick setter

[pearljammer10]

As much as I hate Bosh, I would gladly take him over Baby in a heartbeat. I mean I think that's a no brainer.

[wdleehi]

I think Bosh is wishing he had joined someone like Paul instead of Wade and Lebron. 





Davis is playing great right now.  But his offense is hitting the open shots created by others.  He has been working on that since he got here.

Bosh is not playing well.  He is being asked to be the third option after years of being the number one option.  He is struggling and it effects the rest of his game. 

[Fafnir]

Bosh said it is all about being on TV. Well he got that at least, I think his play will come around as he becomes more comfortable with his role. He was attacking the glass hard against Boston.

[youcanthandlethetruth113]

I hope Baby can keep it up.

Bosh is a sissy.

[Birdbrain]

BBD does a lot more on the court without a doubt.  I noticed when they played Miami he couldn't get around BBD either which while I knew BBD had very quick feet was still sort of surprising.  I wouldn't want a player like Bosh on my favorite team due to his lack of heart so I yes I would probably take the better all around player for less money and hope to pair him with a good defensive player to cover the hoop.  Of course even that limitation of BBDs is not any worse than Bosh who plays like a SF.

If he can't handle being a 3rd option imagine what it would be like to be in BBDs shoes and be a 5th option most of the time. 

He's a very weak mentally as well.

[Birdbrain]

Are you saying that Baby could put up 20/10 on a crappy team; because it think that is where your argument falls apart. BBD is able to be effective because of the other weapons on the floor when he plays with the first unit. Last year when he was with the second unit he struggled to get his shots off.

No I am not saying that BBD would ever average 20/10 on any team( he simply is too short). I realize that Bosh is the better talent,but BBD gets the more out of his talent while Bosh struggles to contribute much if he isn't scoring. If BBD isn't scoring he is still taking charges,setting great picks and doing the dirty work and getting the crowd pumped up.

Tell Charles Barkley he was too short to average 20/10.  Baby isn't too short - he's not talented enough.

"Great" picks?  I don't think getting blown for illegal screens 5% of the time qualifies him as a great pick setter

Can you elaborate on the 5% comment?  I don't agree with your overall point but, I'm wondering what the 5% means in regards to your point.

I've never seen a player so 'underrated' by his own fans.

[BballTim]

I've never seen a player so underrated by his own fans.

  How about Rondo? He's a mediocre defender and it's very difficult for his teammates to score with him in a half court setting because he's such a liability offensively.

  Or so I've been told.