Rondo's Post Game

[pearljammer10]

We are going to see everybody in the post this year. I'm sure Rondo was just getting some extra post practice in for the preseason. This team, as we saw multiple times last season, settle for jump shots way too often. With a healthy Garnett and a couple additions to the front court in the Oneal's, there is no reason we shouldn't post up for a majority of the time. Pierce is great out of the post especially when he catches and faces up his opponent. We have seen Allen post up and be successful with it. And now with Rondo also posting up, I am excited to see the teams half court game.

[Fafnir]

I'm not huge on Rondo posting up, a nice wrinkle sometimes sure. But I'd rather see him become more involved in offense in a way that better utilizes his strengths.

[Fafnir]

I'll put on caveat on Rondo posting up, if a smaller guard is playing way off of him and the team is having trouble scoring posting up is an excellent way to generate a shot for himself or someone else.

Though again I'd prefer him to drive in that situation a higher percentage of the time.

[Section301]

Won't happen against Kobe or Wade. But the fact that he is always expanding his game is very smart on his part. And it gives Celtics more option which is always a +PLUS. I always say Rondo has no ceiling. The game comes easy to him, a natural. He is truly a Joy to watch.

Wouldn't Rondo taking the ball into the post force Kobe to play him more honestly?  One of our problems playing the Lakers is that Kobe would sag off Rondo to play a little more help defense.  Rondo's offense would be neutralized, but so would Kobe's ability to help off of Rondo.  I just don't see Kobe sagging off Rondo close to the basket.  Isn't this just more of the chess game that Doc can employ or am I off base here?

This.  Rondo going into the post on Kobe means Kobe can't roam, which means the spacing is better on the floor.  If Kobe plays him to shoot, Rondo passes (which we all agree he does pretty well), if he plays him to pass, Rondo is fast enough to get past him, forcing a rotation, which leads to a pass to a big for a lay-in.  

It certainly should not be a mainstay of the offense, but it's a way to shake things up if his defender is playing too far off him.  I'd love to see them do it 3-4 times a game, especially because it will create a higher percentage shot than Rondo unguarded 15 feet from the basket.  

Once they start forcing rotations, the C's are very likely to find the open man, but that can only be effective if the other team has to cover all 5 guys.  This would force their hand.

[Fafnir]

Kobe has 4 inches and a strength advantage on Rondo. Rondo can't post him up effectively.

[Section301]

Kobe has 4 inches and a strength advantage on Rondo. Rondo can't post him up effectively.

Possibly.  But if Kobe is on Rondo, Ray is likely being guarded by some guy he has a height advantage over.  Pass it out of the post to Ray for the jumper.  I'd rather have Ray shooting from distance then Rondo.  If Kobe goes to help on Ray, Rondo's still under the basket, only now he's unguarded. 

[indeedproceed]

Won't happen against Kobe or Wade. But the fact that he is always expanding his game is very smart on his part. And it gives Celtics more option which is always a +PLUS. I always say Rondo has no ceiling. The game comes easy to him, a natural. He is truly a Joy to watch.

It will happen against Fisher and Chalmers, though. Just saying.

Posting Rondo on Fisher is exactly what LA wants us to do. It completely minimizes Rondo's biggest advantage on Fisher (speed) while maximizing Fisher's advantages on Rondo (size+strength)

[Fafnir]

Kobe has 4 inches and a strength advantage on Rondo. Rondo can't post him up effectively.

Possibly.  But if Kobe is on Rondo, Ray is likely being guarded by some guy he has a height advantage over.  Pass it out of the post to Ray for the jumper.  I'd rather have Ray shooting from distance then Rondo.  If Kobe goes to help on Ray, Rondo's still under the basket, only now he's unguarded. 

Ray's man will be right at home on Ray though, as Kobe won't require any help at all if Rondo tries to post him up.

[Section301]

Kobe has 4 inches and a strength advantage on Rondo. Rondo can't post him up effectively.

Possibly.  But if Kobe is on Rondo, Ray is likely being guarded by some guy he has a height advantage over.  Pass it out of the post to Ray for the jumper.  I'd rather have Ray shooting from distance then Rondo.  If Kobe goes to help on Ray, Rondo's still under the basket, only now he's unguarded. 

Ray's man will be right at home on Ray though, as Kobe won't require any help at all if Rondo tries to post him up.

That's fine, let whoever's guarding Ray chase him around screens, etc. - ray will get open  The point is that Kobe will not be available to sag off his man and cause trouble for others. 

And again, I'm not advocating that this should be the established starting point of all their half court sets, far from it.  I'm just saying that it could be used a few times a night to space the floor better and increase the odds that if there is an outside shot, it's taken by someone (Ray, Paul) with the ability to hit that outside shot with an acceptable regularity.  I'd be curious to see it in action to replace some of those sets where Rondo dribbles the ball unguarded for 6-8 seconds waiting for someone to get open.   

[Fafnir]

Kobe has 4 inches and a strength advantage on Rondo. Rondo can't post him up effectively.

Possibly.  But if Kobe is on Rondo, Ray is likely being guarded by some guy he has a height advantage over.  Pass it out of the post to Ray for the jumper.  I'd rather have Ray shooting from distance then Rondo.  If Kobe goes to help on Ray, Rondo's still under the basket, only now he's unguarded. 

Ray's man will be right at home on Ray though, as Kobe won't require any help at all if Rondo tries to post him up.

That's fine, let whoever's guarding Ray chase him around screens, etc. - ray will get open  The point is that Kobe will not be available to sag off his man and cause trouble for others. 

And again, I'm not advocating that this should be the established starting point of all their half court sets, far from it.  I'm just saying that it could be used a few times a night to space the floor better and increase the odds that if there is an outside shot, it's taken by someone (Ray, Paul) with the ability to hit that outside shot with an acceptable regularity.  I'd be curious to see it in action to replace some of those sets where Rondo dribbles the ball unguarded for 6-8 seconds waiting for someone to get open.   

If you have Rondo in the post just waiting for someone to get open that will stagnate our offense more.

Passing out of the post is harder because its easier to defend the angles. Only when help is forced to come does it create open shots elsewhre on the floor.

[BballTim]

Kobe has 4 inches and a strength advantage on Rondo. Rondo can't post him up effectively.

Possibly.  But if Kobe is on Rondo, Ray is likely being guarded by some guy he has a height advantage over.  Pass it out of the post to Ray for the jumper.  I'd rather have Ray shooting from distance then Rondo.  If Kobe goes to help on Ray, Rondo's still under the basket, only now he's unguarded. 

Ray's man will be right at home on Ray though, as Kobe won't require any help at all if Rondo tries to post him up.

  We should have a big advantage for Ray with Kobe on Rondo. If you look at game 2 last year Ray went wild with Fisher on him. They switched Kobe onto him and Rondo was great down the stretch. That's why the biggest play in the series wasn't Perk getting hurt, it was Ray getting kneed in the thigh by Artest. After that Kobe stayed on Rondo and  Ray went on to miss a boatload of open outside shots.

[BballTim]

Won't happen against Kobe or Wade. But the fact that he is always expanding his game is very smart on his part. And it gives Celtics more option which is always a +PLUS. I always say Rondo has no ceiling. The game comes easy to him, a natural. He is truly a Joy to watch.

Wouldn't Rondo taking the ball into the post force Kobe to play him more honestly?  One of our problems playing the Lakers is that Kobe would sag off Rondo to play a little more help defense.  Rondo's offense would be neutralized, but so would Kobe's ability to help off of Rondo.  I just don't see Kobe sagging off Rondo close to the basket.  Isn't this just more of the chess game that Doc can employ or am I off base here?

  We did a lot of that kind of thing in the Finals. Rondo spent a lot of time in our half court offense near the baseline, so Kobe had to stay fairly close to him as opposed to leaving Rondo alone on the outside and roaming freely.

[Fafnir]

Won't happen against Kobe or Wade. But the fact that he is always expanding his game is very smart on his part. And it gives Celtics more option which is always a +PLUS. I always say Rondo has no ceiling. The game comes easy to him, a natural. He is truly a Joy to watch.

Wouldn't Rondo taking the ball into the post force Kobe to play him more honestly?  One of our problems playing the Lakers is that Kobe would sag off Rondo to play a little more help defense.  Rondo's offense would be neutralized, but so would Kobe's ability to help off of Rondo.  I just don't see Kobe sagging off Rondo close to the basket.  Isn't this just more of the chess game that Doc can employ or am I off base here?

  We did a lot of that kind of thing in the Finals. Rondo spent a lot of time in our half court offense near the baseline, so Kobe had to stay fairly close to him as opposed to leaving Rondo alone on the outside and roaming freely.

Yeah, but you don't want Rondo to have the ball down there, that just limits the area the Lakers had to defend.

[Who]

I wouldn't be concerned about the Lakers. The Celtics have their number.

LA can't beat a Boston team that has Kendrick Perkins, Shaquille O'Neal and Jermaine O'Neal. Their offense simply isn't good enough to beat a top notch team who's post defense is strong as the Celtics will be this season.

[moiso]

I hope it's not a staple feature of our offense, but i would like to see it used on occasion. I've been a big fan of it since that last game of the regular season against Milwaukee and Jennings that you had alluded to.

Nothing wrong with adding a little more Gary Payton to his game.

I was thinking the same thing about the Payton comparison.  I don't mind the occasional post up wrinkle in his game.  Maybe not when Shaq is in there, but it would be nice with our jumpshooting bigs in.  And if someone cuts, you know Rondo will find them.  Once or twice a game it would be a nice option.