Noah and Bulls agree on $60 million extension

[Roy H.]

  I'd agree with Chris. He might lose fewer rebounds than Boozer but they'll both go down some. Boozer's also a bigger part of the offense so Noah might not get as many shots.

The rebounds thing is debateable..but the fewer points I don't see. How are you going to take points away from a guy who scores primarily on opportunistic baskets?

Boozer is a much more efficient player inside than Gibson or Miller, so presumably there will be fewer put backs, etc., for Noah.  That's one way that Noah's points will go down.  There will also be more defenders in the paint in general, which could cut down on opportunities.

Defenders will leave Noah to double Boozer, that's one way that he'll get more open looks.

Noah will also take Gibson's role as primary pick and roll player, so he'll get more looks as Boozer gets his position in the paint.

And also, how are there going to more defenders in the paint? Am I missing something, or does Carlos Boozer's addition mean the Bulls opponents get to have 6 players on the court at all times?

Boozer's shot selection mirrors Taj Gibson's almost identically.

Taj Gibson: 48% jumpshots, 52% inside
Carlos Boozer: 49% jumpshots, 51% inside

If anything the added attention to Boozer will help Noah, not hurt him.

See, I think it could go either way.  There really is no way to know how either player is going to respond.  But isn't that another reason to wait it out?  See what happens. 

Who's list of salaries showed that Noah is already near the top of the pay tier for non-superstar centers on the old CBA.  So, based on that, I really see little risk that the Bulls would be losing a lot of money.  So why not wait, and have the possibility to actually save money...and also keep alive the possibility of a trade for a superstar like Melo.

Well if anything this also helps the odds of getting Melo, because Noah is under a long-term contract.

But I agree, I will defend Noah the player to the death, but the Bulls should've waited.

How does it help?  It makes him very difficult to trade, because he is a poison pill contract.  He was a much more valuable asset before he was signed.

Yep, he's poison pill this year, and BYC next year.  It will be very, very hard to trade Noah now.

[Fan from VT]

  I'd agree with Chris. He might lose fewer rebounds than Boozer but they'll both go down some. Boozer's also a bigger part of the offense so Noah might not get as many shots.

The rebounds thing is debateable..but the fewer points I don't see. How are you going to take points away from a guy who scores primarily on opportunistic baskets?

Boozer is a much more efficient player inside than Gibson or Miller, so presumably there will be fewer put backs, etc., for Noah.  That's one way that Noah's points will go down.  There will also be more defenders in the paint in general, which could cut down on opportunities.

Defenders will leave Noah to double Boozer, that's one way that he'll get more open looks.

Noah will also take Gibson's role as primary pick and roll player, so he'll get more looks as Boozer gets his position in the paint.

And also, how are there going to more defenders in the paint? Am I missing something, or does Carlos Boozer's addition mean the Bulls opponents get to have 6 players on the court at all times?

Boozer's shot selection mirrors Taj Gibson's almost identically.

Taj Gibson: 48% jumpshots, 52% inside
Carlos Boozer: 49% jumpshots, 51% inside

If anything the added attention to Boozer will help Noah, not hurt him.

See, I think it could go either way.  There really is no way to know how either player is going to respond.  But isn't that another reason to wait it out?  See what happens. 

Who's list of salaries showed that Noah is already near the top of the pay tier for non-superstar centers on the old CBA.  So, based on that, I really see little risk that the Bulls would be losing a lot of money.  So why not wait, and have the possibility to actually save money...and also keep alive the possibility of a trade for a superstar like Melo.

Well if anything this also helps the odds of getting Melo, because Noah is under a long-term contract.

But I agree, I will defend Noah the player to the death, but the Bulls should've waited.

Except for 2 things:
1. Denver already went through TWO "extend and immediately regret" scenarios with Kenyon and Nene.

2. Technically, it's exceedingly difficult to trade someone if they've already agreed to an extension from their rookie deal: they become a "poison pill contract," meaning they only count as their rookie salary for outgoing purposes but the receiving team must count them as the per season average of their last rookie contract year and all the years of the extension. So it's even harder to trade the poison pill player than the BYC player. I don't see Noah turning down this proposed contract in any scenario, so maximal flexibility would have been to put off signing the extension so that he was still an extremely easy to trade piece, then, if traded, he could always sign an extension immediately after the trade.


In general, I agree with the above posters:
What did Chicago gain by jumping the gun?
Absolute worst case scenario is Noah plays the same or better, the CBA stays the same, Noah becomes a RFA, and someone offers him the max and they match. In this case, they'd pay 5 years 80 million, or 4 million more per year. Yes, that seems like a lot, but keep this in mind:
-He would presumably have played well enough to earn a Max RFA offer, so that'd be good for Chicago
-Chicago is trying to contend and is over the cap for now and the future, so it's not like they're trying to budget to add FA's
-Chicago is a huge market
-All signs point to the CBA being quite different, leading me to believe it would be highly unlikely for Noah to earn 80 million this year.

On the flipside, by waiting, they would absolutely keep the possibility of a trade alive, or they could have let the market get a lower price for Noah, and not risk the distinct possibility that Noah, a 25 year old hustle lanky center, has almost peaked or gets injured.

I just don't see the risk.

[indeedproceed]

Hey Roy, Kelly Dwyer wrote this:

Joakim Noah(notes) has agreed to a five-year, $60 million contract extension with the Chicago Bulls  -- a deal with incentives that could push the contract up a few quid, perhaps around the realm of $65 million total. And count me in as one of the people who consider this one of the more reasonable things that has happened during a pretty nutty offseason.

For several factors. Justifying this deal for Chicago goes well beyond pointing out that Rudy Gay(notes) will make more per year over the course of his contract extension, or that this move allows Noah to play for about half of what the oft-injured Jermaine O'Neal(notes) worked under with his massive deal that expired last summer. Need, fit and position play the biggest roles in this move, and while that isn't what Bulls fans want to hear (though it's certainly what the deal's detractors will chortle at), this isn't a bad thing.

The Bulls need Noah badly, which is why the team never seriously entertained thoughts of moving him for Carmelo Anthony(notes) -- beyond the fact that they'd be giving up two younger starters for a guy who doesn't do much but pump fake and get 25-plus a game not all that efficiently.

The Bulls need Noah to work as an anchor of their defense, which, after spending all sorts of money on free-agent pickups and hirings during the offseason, will continue to be the thing that the team will have to hang its hat on. The Bulls still can't shoot, and they're going to have to go defense-first if they want to make it past the first round. Noah still has quite a bit of work to do when it comes to trying to find that delicate balance between all-out help defense and sticking with his man. He pulls it off, though, more often than not.

And that's before Noah even opens his mouth, because as anyone who's been remotely close to the action down low during Bulls games can tell you, the guy won't stop talking. In a good way. Pointing plays out, positioning teammates, letting everyone know where he is -- and then actually executing, when it comes time to be "where he is."

This is why he fits. Because as important as he was in Vinny Del Negro's pell-mell schemes over the last two seasons, he'll be significantly more important working under former Boston assistant Tom Thibodeau, known for his game tape-heavy ways and exacting defensive work behind the scenes. He'll be so vital to the success of this team in ways that can't be explained in rebounds, blocks, or even raw plus/minus.

Partially because of the fact that he is a true center, which is also the hardest position to fill adequately in this league. Which is why, yes, position plays a big part in Noah earning in upwards of $13 million a year if incentives are met.

Centers are hard to find. Finding one that doesn't feel like a stopgap pivot takes time and luck, and the Bulls lucked out when Minnesota went with Corey Brewer(notes) in the 2007 draft and the eventual-Thunder went with Jeff Green(notes). Picking up a 7-footer who would be averaging a double-double in just under 31 minutes per game by his third year? This is something you hang onto. Especially when you consider the defensive merits of Noah's game.

And, yes, in terms of raw numbers irrespective of worth, NBA centers are usually paid in U.S. dollars, while the rest of the league is paid in British Pounds. A darn good center will usually make 1.6 times the number of what a darn good small forward makes, because that's just a function of the scarcity (and, as is often the case in this league, the optimism in too many NBA GMs, thinking the best out of that 7-foot plodder that had three great weeks last April).

Joakim won't turn 25 until after this season's All-Star break, and he did hit the double-double mark in minutes per game (30.7) that usually don't result in a double-double. But big men don't usually turn into Kevin McHale in their mid-20s. Joakim will improve as he gains more confidence and more strength, but right now we're looking at Noah at about 80-85 percent of what he'll turn into in his prime. A double-double guy with great defense, but nothing much on the offensive end.

Is that worth well into eight figures a year? For the reasons listed above, I think so. Joakim's issues with plantar fasciitis are a major worry, because that stuff just does not go away. But this is still a center you can rely on to play smart and play hard and play talented for huge stretches of the season.

He's 24, and seems to be more than making up for that worrying off-court behavior (particularly the stuff you can be suspended for) with essential doses of locker-room know-how. It's been that way since his rookie year -- Ben Wallace(notes) and the old guard (say, the former Wake of the News columnist for the Chicago Tribune) were wrong, and Noah was right.

And heading into 2010-11, it's safe to say that this is the right move for all involved. Now things just need to continue apace, and Noah will prove why he's earned this extension.

EDIT: Unless you read the CB draft threads, you won't get this. But if you did,