Author Topic: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal  (Read 4551 times)

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CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« on: September 20, 2010, 08:47:50 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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The Playoffs are here! All discussion and voting will be done Thursday and this thread will be unlocked at midnight EST on Sunday.

Voting will all be done via PM to CB Draft Voting. Voting will close at midnight EST Monday.

Please use the following format for your ballot.

*Your Name Here*
Chicago/Milwaukee
Phoenix/Sacramento

So for an example if Jeff were to vote he might send this (if he decided to vote solely on "mod conspiracy";)):

Jeff
Chicago
Sacramento

Here are links to the Press Conferences for each team:

East:
(1) Chicago
(2) Milwaukee

West:
(1) Phoenix
(3) Sacramento

GMs should post what their tactics would be, how they feel they'd match up, and how they'd handle their rotations. Note that HCA will be the tie-breaker if voting is tied at the end of today.

Note to GMs off playoff teams:
Quote
7. You may not vote for your own team, this is to prevent skewing of overall results by every game theory loving GM from voting themselves in first place.
This rule is a bit unclear it was meant for regular season voting, it doesn't matter in a head to head situation so feel free to list your own team as the winner. If a GM doesn't think his team will win (or fails to vote) boo to him!

Each GM team will still however only get a single vote however, I will count the first ballot I receive.

In this thread each GM will make one argument post for their team. They can go over their strategy, lineups, matchup breakdowns, etc.... Only one post though! After both GMs have made their posts they can have one rebuttal post to respond to their opponents arguments.

This is meant to be a quick summary thread for observers to take a look at. Any back and forth arguing and questions should occur in the Q&A thread that Rondo2287 started.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2010, 09:13:30 AM by Fafnir »

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2010, 08:56:55 AM »

Online Roy H.

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Um, Faf?

Quote
Here are links to the Press Conferences for each team:

East:
(1) Chicago
(2) Milwaukee

West:
(1) Phoenix
(2) Utah

I think we've got a little bit of Dewey beats Truman going on here.  ;)


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2010, 09:02:01 AM »

Offline StartOrien

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That's how bad the Sacramento team is.  ;)

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2010, 09:14:09 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Oh the dangers of cut and paste.

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2010, 09:17:42 AM »

Offline Rondo2287

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I am going to outline my offensive and defensive strategies

Defense:
I am going to Matchup Rip Hamilton on Brandon Jennings and Kidd on Mike Miller.  Kidd has been more effective in recent memory at defending SG than he has pgs.  Rip is one of my Better Defenders and i think that his length and quickness will bother Jennings. 

I feel like Disrupting Jennings is the key to stopping Chicago.  I dont think anything i say here can make me convince people that i can stop lebron, nor do i think anything i say here can convince myself that i can stop lebron.  But limiting the scorers around him has always been the key to beating lebron lead teams. 

With Lebron, I hope that Maggettes strength and athleticism is enough to disrupt him on occasion.  and Maggette can make him work on the other end.

for the big guys, I think that Dirk is an underrated defender and shouldnt have a problem limiting what Ilyasova wants to do.  I think Noah and gortat should be an interesting matchup, I think Noah will get his usual garbage points but i don't expect it to be a matchup that IP looks at to exploit, I think Gortat will be able to defend Noah well.

Offensively:
Offensively we will be looking to break out in transition.  Which against a lebron team can be dangerous because of the threat of a chasedown, but we will look to do it anyways.  Kidd is great at running the fast break and with an Athletic Wing player like Maggette, and two knock down shooters in Dirk and Rip I feel like we can have some success there.

In the half court, Kidd will be running the show.  Dirk playing some in the post and some outside, it depends on where he feels he is having the most success on any given night.  Clearly he is our number one option and I believe that with his quickness and overall arsenal he should be able to get where he wants on the court against ilyasova. 

When Dirk is on the perimeter he will be setting screens for Rip who i believe should have a significant advantage over miller. Rip should be able to get a great deal of seperation and alot of open shots off the feeds from Kidd.

Maggette will be looking to drive any chance he can against lebron.  I think with his athleticism and quickness he can get around lebron and will either force lebron or the bigs behind him into foul trouble. 

When you look at the box scores, (And i may be misinterpreting here IP you can feel free to correct me)  Maggette gets to the line a great deal against lebron but Lebron doesn't seem to have many fouls in those games, the bigs behind him do however.  My interpretation here is that Maggette can get by lebron because lebron doesn't want to risk getting into foul trouble and as a result puts the pressure on his big men.  This could be trouble for a team like Chicago who doesnt have great depth at the big positions.

The rest of our offensive will be initiated from ball movement based on these three situations.  I believe that Dirk and Rip are both very good passers, and when chicago starts to overplay either of them they can move the ball to an open shooter or cutter. 

CB Draft LA Lakers: Lamarcus Aldridge, Carmelo Anthony,Jrue Holiday, Wes Matthews  6.11, 7.16, 8.14, 8.15, 9.16, 11.5, 11.16

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2010, 09:24:47 AM »

Online Roy H.

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Sadly, I don't have time today to really sell this matchup, so I'll understand if people want to vote Phoenix by default.  I've got court this morning, and then have an appellate brief to write, which is due tomorrow.

Here's a thumbnail sketch of the matchup from my perspective:

Sacramento's rotation:

Sacramento will start the game with a lineup of Dampier / Boozer / Lewis / Garcia / Rose. 

Dampier is in the game to muscle Dwight Howard, and to take away some of Howard's dominance on the boards.  No player is going to stop Howard, but Dampier is exactly the type of guy that he struggles with:  big and strong and mean.  Howard has only averaged 18 ppg against Dampier historically, with a lot of those points coming when Dampier was resting on the bench. 

Boozer, obviously, is a given in the starting lineup.  He'll defend Jamison -- not exactly a tough cover -- and will presumably matchup up offensively against Howard.  Boozer has done extremely well when covered by Howard, averaging 21 points and 10 rebounds in his career.

Rashard Lewis and Francisco Garcia will be the wings.  Their height -- 6'10" and 6'7", respectively -- will cause matchup problems for Phoenix.  I expect my wings to be doing a lot of posting up in this series, and obviously both guys are deadly from down town (we all know what Lewis can do, and Garcia shoots 39% from three).

Derrick Rose plays PG, and as noted earlier, he steps up his play in big games against great defenses.  He averaged 20/6/6 against Rondo and the Celtics, and 27/3/7 against Lebron and the Bulls.  Also, Rose isn't intimidated by Dwight Howard; the last healthy game he played against Howard, he went for 30/6/7.

Sacramento's Philosophy:

Sacramento intends to be aggressive on offense, attacking the post with Boozer, Randolph, and Rose.  Howard has shown a propensity to get in foul trouble in the playoffs, fouling out of two games in the 2010 playoffs, and picking up 4+ fouls in 11 out of 14 games.  If Howard follows a similar path in this series, I think he's doomed, because he's got two rookies backing him up (and Ed Davis is facing surgery for a knee injury).

Defensively, Sacramento will play tight on Phoenix's shooters.  Antwan Jamison had a poor season last year -- especially in the playoffs -- and John Salmons is notoriously streaky and inconsistent.  Baron Davis has never been confused with being a good shooter, and the defense can sag off of him at times to help elsewhere (i.e., the Rondo strategy, except that Davis doesn't have the mobility any more to hurt teams like Rondo does).

Sacramento will exploit Phoenix's lack of depth.  Sacramento's bench is a big, big advantage, with Zach Randolph, Richard Jefferson, Courtney Lee, etc., matching up with a broken down Turkuglu, several rookies, and no backup PG.

What Phoenix has said about its own team:


Why should I criticize Phoenix, when its own GM has spent so much team criticizing it?

Quote from: On Baron Davis (quoting Kelly Dwyer)
[Baron Davis]'s defense came and went, his shot selection from behind the arc (3.9 attempts per game while shooting just 27.7 percent) was terrible, and he still seemed to coast when the Clippers needed him most.

Quote
. . . B-Diddy isn't an elite defender

Quote from: On John Salmons (quoting Kelly Dwyer)
I've been warning people about John Salmons' age for years . . .

Quote from: responding to criticism about the drafting of John Salmons[/quote

. . . I was on the fence for him myself

Quote from: On Antwan Jamison (quoting Kelly Dwyer)
. . . efficiency and defense matter here, and it's worth noting that the 34-year-old Jamison was dropping off in production even before his trade to Cleveland. Appreciate the heck out of the guy, I'd just want some more well-rounded big men on my team before him at this point.

Quote from: Describing Al Horford vs. Antwan Jamison
I ended up deciding that it was better to address the [/b]Jamison mistmatch[/b] as opposed to ignoring it.
. . . Jamison . . . doesn't matchup well against Horford/Cousins. Unfortunately, in this series his minutes have to be limited in favor of Turk & Monroe.
. . . I'm not blind to a glaring mismatch against Antawn Jamison when Al Horford and Demarcus Cousins are on the floor together

Quote from: Describing Rashard Lewis vs. Antwan Jamison
we're made in a similar mold to the 2008 Orlando Magic. Admittedly Jamison isn't the player Lewis was, but I think we make up for it at other positions

Quote from: On Hedo Turkoglu (quoting Kelly Dwyer)
It hardly matters as if 2009-10 actually happened or not. Because while Turkoglu's drop-off wasn't really commensurate with the sort of play we'd seen from him in his career, his latter turn with Orlando was criminally overrated, and what we saw in Toronto last year (11 points, about nine combined rebounds/assists, 41 percent shooting, bad D) wasn't far off in Hedo's future anyway.

Quote from: On Hedo Turkoglu's defense
I don't think I neccesarily let the cat out of the bag on Hedo's d
. . . Defensively, he's a bit of a liability . . .
. . . his defense is . . . worse than Jamison's

Quote from: On Phoenix's failed attempts to add a veteran big man for the bench
I'll also state that we're not without a veteran big due to effort. I offered some pretty favorable deals to try and land another guy.

Quote from: On the front court's defense
Defensively, our power forwards aren't the strongest on the surface. It's something I'm looking into

Quote from: On Phoenix's lack of organizational direction. . .
I can't decide what my depth chart should look like
. . . Antawn Jamison on the block
. . . Jamison & Fernandez/Matthews for an upgrade at SF
. . . [John Salmons] is a piece that's slightly expendible
. . . I'm entertaining offers for Dwight Howard

Quote
On rookies (such as Greg Monroe, Ed Davis, and Dominique Jones]Rookies are unproven in the game, and it's really tough to sell them. Particularly this rookie class.

Why Sacramento Wins:

Simply put, three stars beats one star.  Sacramento has a huge talent advantage, a huge rebounding advantage, and a huge depth advantage.  Outside of Dwight Howard, Phoenix lacks talent, and it lacks defense (other than Wesley Matthews).  Jamison, Turkuglu, Salmons, Fernandez and Davis are all well below-average defenders, and Phoenix has no depth on its bench except for rookies (one of whom is injured and facing surgery).

Dwight Howard will get into foul trouble, dooming Phoenix.  Howard couldn't get it done on an Orlando team that had four all-stars, perfectly tailor-made for his game.  How's he going to do when surrounded by poor-defending, inconsistent, spotty-shooting guys (i.e., Davis), with no depth behind him? 

Howard is a great player, but he can't do it alone.  It's a testament to StartOrien that he's gotten as far as he has, with a very limited roster.  However, his run should stop here, as Sacramento simply has more talent and a deeper team.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2010, 10:33:39 AM »

Offline StartOrien

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PHOENIX GORILLAZ REBUTAL:

These quotations, are unquestionably the work the Roy H we've come to know: The same lawyer who will talk you into believing Michael Redd is going to return to form on whatever cyborg legs he has left. The type of man who amittedly markets ideas/opinions he doesn't believe just to get ahead.

As you might've expected, a lot of these quotes are rather misleading, for the most part taken out of context or pretty carefully, and manipulatively edited, much like Ric Flair photoshopping images in an effort to ruin Randy Savage & Miss Elizabeth's perfect marriage or Hard Copy ruining the good name of Homer J. Simpson:

So you'll see Roy post something to the extent of me saying "Rookies are unproven in this game" (and he added those rookie names, I didn't include them), but will somehow forget to post that after I said this I drafted rookie, Ed Davis. I also told everyone I was strictly posturing b/c I wanted Davis to fall, and also PM'd a couple GM's (INCLUDING then co-commish roy) immediately after making the 'rookies are unproven' comment stating I was posturing and suprised that so many very talented rookies were slipping. The Walker Wiggle can attest, and I'm sure a few others. This is BLATANT manipulating in the fullest of senses. He's presenting a case that he knows is not true.

You'll also notice that in the comment about Salmons' age he somehow forgot to also cut & past the follow up about how Dwyer thought he had MULTIPLE good years left him. As proof Dwyer ranked him as his 12th best shooting guard.

Or he'll chop up my comments like "....B-Diddy isn't an elite defender..." What a CURIOUS cut and paste, Roy. Let me ask you, reader, why do SO many of the comments he posted have "...." in it?


Again, this is Roy H. at his finest. Manipulating you to read things quickly, banking on you forgetting about context. The same way he'll manipulate you to believe that he's got depth for days, despite that his most common lineup will feature THREE POWER FORWARDS, none of which have shown the ability to defend at that position. Oh, but thats right, despite my TWO ELITE defenders, I'M the team that can't defend a chair.

Ladies and gentleman of the jury, you've fallen for these tricks before. A wise man once said "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice..... well, the point is you won't fool me twice." I ask you to see through the magic tricks Roy has presented you. The-truth, is out there.

I'll end up my statement with a quote DIRECTLY from Roy H himself

Quote
Sadly,
Quote
Phoenix
Quote
equals
Quote
dominance


« Last Edit: September 20, 2010, 10:46:54 AM by StartOrien »

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2010, 11:41:14 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Oh my god.

I've been working for about an hour. Lost all of it.

Good Lord I am angry.

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2010, 11:49:19 AM »

Offline Rondo2287

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Oh my god.

I've been working for about an hour. Lost all of it.

Good Lord I am angry.

So is this your argument or rebutal?
CB Draft LA Lakers: Lamarcus Aldridge, Carmelo Anthony,Jrue Holiday, Wes Matthews  6.11, 7.16, 8.14, 8.15, 9.16, 11.5, 11.16

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2010, 12:09:04 PM »

Offline Fafnir

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Oh my god.

I've been working for about an hour. Lost all of it.

Good Lord I am angry.
When making a very long post, word is your friend. I've learned this the hard way many times.

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2010, 12:20:33 PM »

Offline StartOrien

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PHOENIX GORILLAZ PLAN OF ATTACK

Starting Lineup:

Dwight Howard, Antawn Jamison, John Salmons, Wesley Matthews, Baron Davis

Rotation

Hedo Turkoglu, Greg Monroe, Terrence Williams, Rudy Fernandez, Ed Davis

Our Offensive Philosophy

Pick n rolls, pick n rolls, pick n rolls.

For the predominant portion of the game, I'm assuming, as he has in the past Roy will mostly feature THREE power forwards who can't defend in the position the Kings will ask them to play. Carlos Boozer at C, Zach Randolph at PF, and Rashard Lewis at SF.

Roy has pointed out a few times the Magic have said that they expect Rashard to play more minutes at the SF. Yet somehow ignoring that the Magic said the same exact thing last year w/o complying, and that they can "say" all they want, we haven't seen him do it in a while and can't anymore. He's not laterally quick enough to play that position anymore, and I'd guarantee that Roy would say the same thing if he wasn't partaking in this excercise.

He's also trolling out numbers about Carloz Boozer against Dwight Howard, failing to mention Mehmet Okur played in all but one of those matchups nearly always exceeding 30 minutes. Say what you will abotu Okur's D but he has a heigh advantage that aids Boozer in ways that his other power forwards can not. He also plays aside Paul Milsap who is streets-ahead of the Kings' assistance.

And while he states that Damp will be his starting center, we know at his age he won't be able to play anything more than 20 minutes per game and is unable to keep up with D12 on a pick n' roll anymore.

Bottom line is, there's just no way he can disrupt my teams pick n roll with the shooters/scorers I've surrounded Howard with.

Because I know it's a question I'd recieve, yes, we do plan on having Turk play some 4. It depends on the flow of the game, but I'd guess we'd see it for about 10-15 minutes a game. It's another pick n roll combo that the Kings will be unable to stop.

Defenisve Philosophy

It stars with challenging Rose with Wesley Matthews. The Kobe-stopper has shown his ability to limit offensive superstars, and we will see the same against Rose. Matthews will be aggressive, but won't hesitate to pack it in forcing Rose to shoot and angering mentally fragile Zach Randolph and "just got paid" Carlos Boozer.

We've heard reports that Rose has been working on that shot all summer, which would be great, if we didn't see some really poor shooting out of him in the FIBA championships. IMO, his shot actually looked significantly worse than it has in the past as he looks extremely uncomfortable and unconfident with his new form.

Leaving the ever fragile Fransisco Garcia (who played 24 games last season, and 64 the season before) with Baron Davis, whose strength and size will prevent Cisco from every getting comfortable.

For the most part, Salmons/Turkoglu will be on Lewis. Salmons speed discouraging Lewis' ability to catch in space, and Turkoglu's height to counter Lewis' own size. Two different approaches to discourage Rashard Lewis.

BTW, we all remember Rashard Lewis in the playoffs, right? He's the guy who scored 6,5,4,13,15 and 7 points in his last 6 games

As Roy suggested, yes, Antawn Jamison will be the one covering Randolph. Mostly because, throughout his career Jame-o has done a great job against Randolph, holding him to 14.9 points, 8.7 rebounds, 2.7 turnovers while getting 17.6 points, and 7.7 rebounds for himself (with 1.3 turnovers). Again, these numbers aren't always, but its a good starting point to display that these players are pretty equally matched.

That leaves us with Dwight Howard on Carlos Boozer. I've already touched upon this matchup. Boozer is not a good defender at C, and he can't keep up with Dwight Howard in any asset of the game.


Bullet points for those skimming:

-Steady diet of pick n' rolls offensively, Kings lack of height and speed will allow us for A LOT of easy baskets.
-Kings most frequent lineup will feature 3 power forwards, none of which who can defend the position being asked.
-Dampier will have extremely limited minutes
-Wesley Matthews will cover Dereck Rose.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2010, 12:26:24 PM by StartOrien »

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2010, 02:15:23 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Rebuttal:

Phoenix is being purposefully misleading
:

1.  The numbers cited by Sacramento are, in fact, Boozer's numbers against Howard.  Orlando guards the post with Dwight Howard, while perimeter players are guarded by Rashard Lewis in Orlando.  Thus, the 21 points / 10 rebounds Boozer has put up has been against Howard.  However, if Phoenix wants to guard Boozer with Jamison (having Howard guard Dampier) that's fine.

2.  Boozer has, in fact, played a ton of center (over 30% of Utah's total minutes there), and he defended the position well.  Similarly, Rashard Lewis has historically been SF, but has slid over to PF in Orlando's offense.  He can guard either position, and he guards them well.

3.  Ironically, Phoenix talks about playing guys out of position, but then lists Hedo as a PF.  Turkuglu has played *very* limited minutes at PF since about 2007, but when he has, he's been uniformly outscored and outproduced at the position.  Rather than having a speed advantage at the position, teams take advantage of his atrocious PF defense and lack of rebounding, and have used their strength advantage to keep him historically to a very low shooting percentage (and eFG% of below 40% the last time he saw extended minutes there, the year before Rashard arrived in Orlando).  There's a reason that Orlando and Toronto didn't play Hedo at the 4, but if Phoenix wants to try it, be my guest.

4.  Rashard Lewis struggled against the Celtics in the playoffs because of two reasons:  KG and a stomach virus.  In the first two rounds of the playoffs this season, Rashard averaged 16.3 points on 46% (!!) three point shooting.  Last season against the Celts, he averaged 20.3 points per game in the playoffs. 

5.  Wesley Matthews can't guard Derrick Rose.  Rose is just a much more impressive physical specimen that Matthews.  He's faster, more athletic, and stronger.  Rose abused much better defensive players in Rajon Rondo, and at times, Lebron James.  Wesley Matthews -- while a solid role player -- can't stop him.

If there's a defensive mismatch here, people should be looking at Phoenix, rather than Sacramento:

1.  StartOrien admits that Antwan Jamison, Hedo Turkuglu, and Baron Davis are all weak defenders.  John Salmons is average, at best.  Each of these guys is going to get repeatedly beat by the man he's guarding, leading to penetration.  That creates easy perimeter buckets for Sacramento on kickouts, and will lead to Dwight Howard having to do almost all of the defending by himself.

2.  Perimeter penetration means foul trouble.  Again, Dwight Howard is very foul prone.  He fouled out of two games in last year's playoff, and had at least four fouls in almost every game.  Sacramento will attack, attack, attack.  With Phoenix using Hedo Turkoglu to defend post players and Wesley Matthews to defend Derrick Rose, this will create even more penetration.  Sacramento will either score easy buckets, or will get Howard in foul trouble.  Most likely, both.

3.  Even without foul trouble, Carlos Boozer has never had much trouble scoring on Dwight Howard, as demonstrated above.

4.  The pick-and-roll just isn't that effective with a PG who can't shoot well.  Sacramento will dare B-Diddy to beat them.  Last year, he shot below 40% on all shots between the rim and the three point line (not shooting above 40% in any zone), so my guess is that Diddy can't exploit any perceived pick-and-roll defense.  Derrick Rose should have no problem staying in front of Baron Davis, unless the league is now allowing him to play on roller blades.

As for Hedo running it, the guy had 11 points and 4 assists on 40% shooting last year.  If he was as incredible as some suggest, his production would have been a heck of a lot better.  Also, Eric Dampier is still a very good defender and rebounder, and Carlos Boozer is more mobile than people give him credit for.  Rashard Lewis can easily slide over to help reduce penetration, as well.

5.  Phoenix has nobody on the bench that can defend Sacramento.  Remember, Zach Randolph, Richard Jefferson, and Courtney Lee are coming off the bench.  There's no way Phoenix can touch that.

In summary, Phoenix has the best player, Sacramento has the best team:

1.  Sacramento is a better rebounding team, especially with Hedo seeing minutes at PF;

2.  Phoenix has a number of defensive mismatches that can be exploited;

3.  Sacramento is deeper and has more elite-quality players;

4. Phoenix can't stop Dwight Howard from picking up cheap fouls, and in fact seems to have designed their defense to achieve exactly that goal.  Howard will be on the bench for much of this series, and Sacramento will exploit that.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER——— AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!@ 34 minutes

Re: CB Draft Playoffs Conference Finals. 1 Argument 1 Rebutal
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2010, 03:57:03 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Okay, I already did this once, lets see if I can do it again.

IP’s 3 Part Plan To Beating The Bucks

Part One: Defense, Defense, Defense!

LeBron James is a 2x All-NBA Defensive Team Member, and he is the best defender on either squad. Joakim Noah is widely regarded a one of the best post defenders in the league, and has been the lone defensive force in Chicago for 2 years now. Those guys are my thoroughbreds.

Then, I have Brandon Jennings and Ersan Ilyasova, guys who finished first and fourth respectively in minutes played for the third best defensive team in the league last year, the Milwaukee Bucks.  Jennings statistically speaking is one of the best defensive point guards in the league, and was ranked 2nd Team NBA All-Defensive by Basketball Prospectus author Kevin Pelton. Ersan Ilyasova is second among power forwards in charges drawn, and the other 5 guys are in order of charges, Nick Collison (1), Jared Jeffries (3), Luis Scola (4), Andersen Varejao (5). That is pretty good company.

Off of my bench I have Tony Allen and Louis Amundson. Tony Allen has proven he has the ability to limit substantially elite 2’s and 3’s, and he should have no problems with a limited Kidd or Hamilton. Amundson is kind of my 6’9 Tony Allen, with the athleticism to bother Nowitzki around the perimeter, but the strength to keep Gortat from successfully gaining position in the paint on a regular basis.

Blah blah blah…so is there a point here?


If you go to the back and forth thread (LINK), Rondo starts out saying that Maggette will be the one to take down my defense. Then, he moved on to Hamilton. Now, I believe we’re on Dirk. I think the fact that he didn’t have a cogent strategy from the beginning is emblematic of the problem that Milwaukee has against Chicago. If he goes with Maggette, he lives with the knowledge that either Maggette will score or the possessession is lost. Maggette only shot a 40% FG percentage against LeBron in the past 5 years.

If he goes with Hamilton, he does that knowing that Hamilton is 32 years old, coming off of career lows in games played and FG% (40%), and a near career low in 3pt % (29%).

So, he’ll need to run most of it through Dirk. On Nowitzki I’ll have 6’9-6’10 Ersan Ilyasova with his 7’1 wingspan and tenacious defense as the primary defender. On top of that I’ll be rotating Amundson and Noah on Dirk each for periods (with Noah’s being the shortest) to make sure Dirk never gets comfortable shooting one shot. Ilyasova should be able to handle Dirk on the perimeter, but he’ll get bullied a bit at times in the paint. Noah should bully Dirk in the paint, but he’ll be a little slow defending Dirk on the perimeter. Amundson should be able to handle Dirk in both areas, but he’ll forfeit the offense that Ilyasova brings and the rebounding that Noah brings.

The trick is just to keep Dirk from getting comfortable. No help defense on the big fella, just 3 guys with different defensive strengths that each bring something new to the table in terms of defending Nowitzki.

Part II: Rebound, That Basketball!

Center: Joakim Noah is the 3rd best rebounding center in the NBA by rebounds per game, he’s 3rd in terms of rebounding per 48 mins, and he’s 5th in terms of rebound rate (% of available rebounds gotten by any one player).

Power Forward: Ersan Ilyasova is a top 20 rebounding PF in terms of both rebounds per 48 and rebound rate. Also, against Nowitzki twice this past season, Ilyasova out-rebounded Nowitzki while he was on the floor.

Small Forward: LeBron James was the 3rd best rebounding SF in the league last season, but against LeBron Corey Maggette seems to do well. I think the reason for this was because Maggette’s rebounding team was so bad last season, nobody else was helping him. LeBron had Varejao, Shaq, and Jamison (all 3 better rebounders than anyone who played more than half the games for Golden State) and still managed to get over 6 boards a game.

Shooting Guard: Mike Miller is the best rebounding shooting guard in the NBA. He’s got the best rebounds per 48 mins, the best rebounding rate. The only person who had more rebounds per game at the 2 was Andre Iguodala, who averaged .3 rebounds more than Mike Miller, and played 6 minutes more per game.

Point Guard: Jason Kidd is without question the best rebounding point guard in the NBA. He’s got a rebound rate of 8.9. Even then, Brandon Jennings’ gets 3.4 rebounds per game in less time than Jason Kidd gets 5.6

I’ve got what I believe to be 4/5 better rebounders. Kidd is indisputable, but it is also indisputable that I’ve got the better rebounding front-court. The only thing that is a bit of a grey area Is Maggette’s rebounds against LeBron, but I believe If you look at the games (example, the most recent game GSW was outrebounded by 8 boards, and the leading rebounder was Vlad-Rad, followed by Maggette and Stephen Curry with 7 a piece. After that nobody has over 3) you’ll see Maggette plays on a team that simply doesn’t rebound well, so he’s got more chances to inflate his stats there.

Part III: Know Your  (Pick) and Roll

LeBron James and Brandon Jennings both hold distinctive advantages over their counterparts…whether it is Jason Kidd or Richard Hamilton (as of writing this Rondo was still trying to figure out how to do this) on Jennings or Corey Maggette on LeBron James, neither player can stay in front of their respective man. Neither Dirk Nowitzki nor Marcin Gortat are talented help defenders, and one of the two of them will need to, (or should) stay on Ersan Ilyasova at all times, whether he pick the picker who rolls back to pop a 3, or he rolls to the hoop, or he just sits around the 3pt line doing his best Rasheed impression, Ilyasova is a danger for Milwaukee.

Against Dallas (and Nowitzki) Illyasova shot 10 for 17 from the field between 2 games and 51 total minutes last season, going 5-9 from 3pt land in the same time. That brings his points per 36 numbers up to over 21 pp36, where before it was 16. That’s 31 percent better scoring production than Ilyasova averaged on the year.

If Richard Hamilton wants to play under Jennings and let him shoot, then Milwaukee’s GM didn’t pay attention to the way Jennings got that horrible 37% shooting percentage last season. Jennings would be hounded by the entire defensive side, and because he was the only guy who could create his own shot, a lot of possessions ended with Jennings heaving up a contested jumper.  Neither Hamilton or Kidd are capable of doing the legwork needed to contain Jennings, and neither Nowitzki or Gortat are the defensive anchors you need in place to disrupt LeBron from making plays for himself and his teammates.

Conclusion:

It works like this-

Part 1: The superior Chicago defense forces Milwaukee into taking a low percentage shot.

Part 2: The superior Chicago rebounders snatch up the defensive rebound.

Part 3: The pick and roll action from Jennings/James will work the ball inside to open up the shooters outside.

I will repeat the previous 3 steps until Milwaukee is dead.

Part 4: Chicago takes out a sad and depressed Milwaukee basketball team for cake and ice cream afterwards.

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner