Ron Artest is Not Right

[guava_wrench]

i think both sides are right

yes the whole "if healthy we will win" thing is old...
Lakers didn't win 2008 and they complained a little
so its normal that we are complaining now

BUT, the only reason why I'm more on Doc's side is because EVERYONE knows that the Lakers would not have won if Perkins was not hurt in game 6...

no one denies the fact, because if Perk was healthy for game 7, those 20 offensive board would not have happened, even Lakers fan knows that for a fact but since they win they can talk all they want

I actually don't know we would have won with Perkins. He would have helped preserve Sheed for the 4th quarter, but I don't know what his impact would have been earlier in the game.

Sure, the Lakers don't get the 20 offensive boards. But maybe we have a tougher time scoring with Perk on the floor.

[Snakehead]

i think both sides are right

yes the whole "if healthy we will win" thing is old...
Lakers didn't win 2008 and they complained a little
so its normal that we are complaining now

BUT, the only reason why I'm more on Doc's side is because EVERYONE knows that the Lakers would not have won if Perkins was not hurt in game 6...

no one denies the fact, because if Perk was healthy for game 7, those 20 offensive board would not have happened, even Lakers fan knows that for a fact but since they win they can talk all they want

I actually don't know we would have won with Perkins. He would have helped preserve Sheed for the 4th quarter, but I don't know what his impact would have been earlier in the game.

Sure, the Lakers don't get the 20 offensive boards. But maybe we have a tougher time scoring with Perk on the floor.

Maybe we have a bit harder time scoring, but with Perk we don't give up 20 offensive boards and lose a huge rebounding differential.  Sheed is also far more effective in reduced minutes.  The thing about Perk is that he plays great D (which also would of helped) and even if he doesn't grab the board himself, he boxes out a guy who could on the other team (in the case of that Game 7, often did).

So yes, I think we win that game.  In a game so close reduced offensive boards win us the game.  I mean, between that and Ray hitting one of his open 3's, that's the missing banner for sure.  But even with Ray's performance, I'm very confident we win with Perk.

[nandy16]

What Ron Artest and some Lakers fans don't realize is that in 2008 they only traded for Gasol because Bynum was injured. So the Excuse if Bynum were healthy is wrong on so many levels. Without Gasol I am not sure if they would have even won against Orlando last year. Gasol is the reason they won this year not Kobe, he was the real MVP.

The Kendrick excuse is more valid because he was part of the rotation for 6 games and got injured during the game 6 which gave the Celtics only a few days of game planning. The Lakers exploited this and made it well known that their gameplan for game 7 was to pound the ball in the paint. They won by 5 points and a ton of extra free throws. I know, as do most, that the Celtics would have won Game 7 with Perkins.

This articles first few lines proves my point and is the end all argument when it comes to 2008

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/feb/14/sports/sp-crowe14

Hopefully we meet again this upcoming season with both teams healthy and regain the title we never had a chance to defend.

[BostonIrishGuy]

Look I hate the Lakers and this nutjob Artest just as much as all of you guys, but I have to say Doc started this war of words with his whole "haven't beaten the Celtics with our starting 5"...which I'm sorry, but sounds like a whiny little girl excuse. Doc is making the Celtics organization and us Boston fans look bad.

Did Phil Jackson make excuses about not having Bynum and a healthy Ariza back in 08 as the reason they lost? No. What Doc should be saying is the Lakers were the best team in 2010, thus motivating the C's to prove him wrong and take them down, but instead he makes excuses. Furthermore, the C's win and lose as a "TEAM", and last time I checked there are 12 guys on a TEAM not only 5. If the C's were a better team than LA, then someone would have stepped up for Perk in game 7, but they didn't and thats why we are sitting here as C's fans still bitter.

I for one am not making excuses, we were the better team in 2008, and they have been the better team in 2009 and 2010. Let's look forward to 2011 and hope we meet them again in the Finals. GO C'S...and GO SOX!!!

[Cman]

Look I hate the Lakers and this nutjob Artest just as much as all of you guys, but I have to say Doc started this war of words with his whole "haven't beaten the Celtics with our starting 5"...which I'm sorry, but sounds like a whiny little girl excuse. Doc is making the Celtics organization and us Boston fans look bad.

Did Phil Jackson make excuses about not having Bynum and a healthy Ariza back in 08 as the reason they lost? No. What Doc should be saying is the Lakers were the best team in 2010, thus motivating the C's to prove him wrong and take them down, but instead he makes excuses. Furthermore, the C's win and lose as a "TEAM", and last time I checked there are 12 guys on a TEAM not only 5. If the C's were a better team than LA, then someone would have stepped up for Perk in game 7, but they didn't and thats why we are sitting here as C's fans still bitter.

I for one am not making excuses, we were the better team in 2008, and they have been the better team in 2009 and 2010. Let's look forward to 2011 and hope we meet them again in the Finals.

Right on.  Let me climb aboard your "No Excuses" train!

[LilRip]

since there are a lot of you who disagreed with my comments, let me address them all by saying that if he wants to use it as a motivational tool, then i'm fine with that. But i'd rather he not keep saying it to the media. keeping it within the team or organization is cool. Write it on the bulletin board. Post it on all the player's lockers. Go crazy, Doc. But saying it to the media (more than a few times now) makes him look like a sore loser/whiner and i can see where Artest is coming from (crazily enough). I imagine in '08 that i don't think i'd appreciate it too if Phil Jackson chalked it up to one all-encompassing excuse as to why the Lakers lost, implicitly discrediting our hard-earned championship, like a lot of you seem to be doing.

face it, we lost game 7. It sucks but it's reality. having Perkins would've helped but oh well. bottom line is that we lost game 7. new season starts in a few months!



- LilRip

[Tai]

What Ron Artest and some Lakers fans don't realize is that in 2008 they only traded for Gasol because Bynum was injured. So the Excuse if Bynum were healthy is wrong on so many levels. Without Gasol I am not sure if they would have even won against Orlando last year. Gasol is the reason they won this year not Kobe, he was the real MVP.

The Kendrick excuse is more valid because he was part of the rotation for 6 games and got injured during the game 6 which gave the Celtics only a few days of game planning. The Lakers exploited this and made it well known that their gameplan for game 7 was to pound the ball in the paint. They won by 5 points and a ton of extra free throws. I know, as do most, that the Celtics would have won Game 7 with Perkins.

This articles first few lines proves my point and is the end all argument when it comes to 2008

http://articles.latimes.com/2008/feb/14/sports/sp-crowe14

Hopefully we meet again this upcoming season with both teams healthy and regain the title we never had a chance to defend.

As far as the Lakers only trading for Gasol cause Bynum was injured, I used to say this a lot on the ESPN boards and it's like I walked into a Deaf home or something.

And to correct you a little, we lost game 7 83-79, by 4 points....I know, it doesn't mean much, but just thought I'd point that out.

[winsomme]

i hope our starting 5 will never be beat in a series, but i'm not a fan of Doc mentioning this "statistic" a lot. Seems petty. Let the media/fans do the talking and the let the coaches/teams do the winning.

I don't think it's petty, I think it's a motivation tool.  Basically, Doc is saying "If we work hard, the only thing that can beat us is bad luck".  I think that's a more effective coaching strategy than telling your team "The better team won."

I also think he's right. If Perk hadn't gone down, I think the Cs would have won the Title. If we got beat soundly, then I think it would be a weird thing to hold on to, but that game 7 was winnable and rebounding was the difference.

At the same time, I don't really want to belabor it. The Lakers won and now we just need to take another crack or two at this thing. Hopefully the wheels hold up.

[GreenFaith1819]

Phil Jackson isn't clean in the War of Words, either.

Wasn't he one of the main ones harping on Paul Pierces' "WheelChair" incident?

To my memory, the "Zen Master" made a big deal about that, too.

[Celtics4ever]

It was the zseoncd half disparity in FTAs that killed us.  Sure we didn't help the situation but c'mon. 

I saw nothing in this series nor have I saw anything before that Phil Jackson is a great coach.  He rides his player to the top about it, doesn't have the guts to try to take a bad team and make them grow.

[Mike-Dub]

Look I hate the Lakers and this nutjob Artest just as much as all of you guys, but I have to say Doc started this war of words with his whole "haven't beaten the Celtics with our starting 5"...which I'm sorry, but sounds like a whiny little girl excuse. Doc is making the Celtics organization and us Boston fans look bad.

Did Phil Jackson make excuses about not having Bynum and a healthy Ariza back in 08 as the reason they lost? No. What Doc should be saying is the Lakers were the best team in 2010, thus motivating the C's to prove him wrong and take them down, but instead he makes excuses. Furthermore, the C's win and lose as a "TEAM", and last time I checked there are 12 guys on a TEAM not only 5. If the C's were a better team than LA, then someone would have stepped up for Perk in game 7, but they didn't and thats why we are sitting here as C's fans still bitter.

I for one am not making excuses, we were the better team in 2008, and they have been the better team in 2009 and 2010. Let's look forward to 2011 and hope we meet them again in the Finals.

Right on.  Let me climb aboard your "No Excuses" train!

I know what you're saying, but we still were the better team last season.  The free-throw desparity really killed us.  I agree with the no excuses, but it's not an excuse it's the truth.

[nba is the worst]

Look I hate the Lakers and this nutjob Artest just as much as all of you guys, but I have to say Doc started this war of words with his whole "haven't beaten the Celtics with our starting 5"...which I'm sorry, but sounds like a whiny little girl excuse. Doc is making the Celtics organization and us Boston fans look bad.

Did Phil Jackson make excuses about not having Bynum and a healthy Ariza back in 08 as the reason they lost? No. What Doc should be saying is the Lakers were the best team in 2010, thus motivating the C's to prove him wrong and take them down, but instead he makes excuses. Furthermore, the C's win and lose as a "TEAM", and last time I checked there are 12 guys on a TEAM not only 5. If the C's were a better team than LA, then someone would have stepped up for Perk in game 7, but they didn't and thats why we are sitting here as C's fans still bitter.

I for one am not making excuses, we were the better team in 2008, and they have been the better team in 2009 and 2010. Let's look forward to 2011 and hope we meet them again in the Finals.

Right on.  Let me climb aboard your "No Excuses" train!

I know what you're saying, but we still were the better team last season.  The free-throw desparity really killed us.  I agree with the no excuses, but it's not an excuse it's the truth.

I can't agree, because the Lakers had a better record/HCA, which worked well for the celtics in '08.

The Celtics commit lots of fouls compared with the Lakers. That logically results in the Lakers shooting more fts than the Celtics. (21 in the 4th - NOT 22 as you posted erroneously)...

[nba is the worst]

i think both sides are right

yes the whole "if healthy we will win" thing is old...
Lakers didn't win 2008 and they complained a little
so its normal that we are complaining now

BUT, the only reason why I'm more on Doc's side is because EVERYONE knows that the Lakers would not have won if Perkins was not hurt in game 6...

no one denies the fact, because if Perk was healthy for game 7, those 20 offensive board would not have happened, even Lakers fan knows that for a fact but since they win they can talk all they want

Hard to believe that you are calling speculation fact! (But it IS funny).

[billysan]

Just imagine how scary it would be to spend time in the mind of Ron Artest. 

The comments by coaches and players during the off season whether motivational, smack talk or head games are all still just talk. I dont get it, why does anyone care what Artest says anyway? He is a certifiable head case, we have known this for years. Let him babble away, I bet most of the sensible players and coaches around the league either laugh or ignore him.

[Mike-Dub]

Look I hate the Lakers and this nutjob Artest just as much as all of you guys, but I have to say Doc started this war of words with his whole "haven't beaten the Celtics with our starting 5"...which I'm sorry, but sounds like a whiny little girl excuse. Doc is making the Celtics organization and us Boston fans look bad.

Did Phil Jackson make excuses about not having Bynum and a healthy Ariza back in 08 as the reason they lost? No. What Doc should be saying is the Lakers were the best team in 2010, thus motivating the C's to prove him wrong and take them down, but instead he makes excuses. Furthermore, the C's win and lose as a "TEAM", and last time I checked there are 12 guys on a TEAM not only 5. If the C's were a better team than LA, then someone would have stepped up for Perk in game 7, but they didn't and thats why we are sitting here as C's fans still bitter.

I for one am not making excuses, we were the better team in 2008, and they have been the better team in 2009 and 2010. Let's look forward to 2011 and hope we meet them again in the Finals.

Right on.  Let me climb aboard your "No Excuses" train!

I know what you're saying, but we still were the better team last season.  The free-throw desparity really killed us.  I agree with the no excuses, but it's not an excuse it's the truth.

I can't agree, because the Lakers had HCA, which worked well for the celtics in'08.

The Celtics commit lots of fouls compared with the Lakers. That logically results in the Lakers shooting more fts than the Celtics.

22 free-throws to 6 in the deciding quarter of the Finals... Enough said!  I can't talk about this anymore it hurts to much.