Referees Tonight (Good) EDIT: They Absolutely Ruined The Game (4th Quarter)

[FreeGreen]

Did the Refs make the Celtics lose this game?  No.

Rondo could have stolen the ball from Kobe with 13 seconds left and driven in for a tying layup and then maybe we could have won in OT.  Who knows?

But before you say the Refs were not the issue, ask yourself this ...

Could the Lakers have WON without the all those Free Throws?  I think the answer is pretty obviously No.

[BigBaby]

I agree they called the game differently in the 4th. I have the feeling the refs were just letting us foul in the first 3 quarters just so ratings would be up. That would be sad if true.

In the end, I don't think we had a chance with Perk out. Lost a major defensive presence and couldn't get any rebounds.

[guava_wrench]

I gotta agree with Doc. We were old. We had nothing left in the tank to defend Gasol and he abused us. Sheed fell apart physically after playing great in the first half.

This is the first time our age was the deciding factor.

[connerhenry43]

i do not understand how anyone can watch that game and not see it for what it was. a travesty. the refs willed the lakers to that win.

donaghy 101, refs call two terrible calls within 50 seconds of fourth quarter. help get one team in penalty. then the avalanche began.

the game is not rigged, stern is not a puppet master. but if you are an underdog on the road, you cannot win wire to wire. it cannot happen. the refs get caught up in emotion, they are swayed by the crowd. jackson, fisher, and kobe have completely intimidated them.

17 ft's in fourth quarter. it was a joke. the better team did not win.

[guava_wrench]

Did the Refs make the Celtics lose this game?  No.

Rondo could have stolen the ball from Kobe with 13 seconds left and driven in for a tying layup and then maybe we could have won in OT.  Who knows?

But before you say the Refs were not the issue, ask yourself this ...

Could the Lakers have WON without the all those Free Throws?  I think the answer is pretty obviously No.

That means fouling the Lakers was the problem, not the refs.

[wiley]

Ive written this elsewhere but I just have to say this. The statistics are just the details but this is the essence of my issue with all this.

I used to watch the NBA religiously growing up and unfortunately didnt get to do so for the past decade on account of moving/living in Sweden. I wasn't even a Celts fan when I left, I was a hardcore Bulls fan from 85 to 00. My pops was the Cs fan so I guess I thought it was cool to route against Bird and the Cs. Decided to switch allegiances since I was already a Pats and Soxs fan a few years into the 00s. I just identified more with being a New Englader after moving away. I needed to mature to appreciate the Celts I guess.

Now that I am back and having watched this I can honestly say with a little bit of objectivity, that this isn't the same league I watched growing up. It has massive problems with its refs and obviously when money is an important issue in tough economic times I really question its integrity from top to bottom. Things happen all over the place that Ive never been witness to.

With everything else that is going down currently in this country with Wall St. and the rich guys working over the little guy I think its probably dangerous to entertain any form of idealism. It is an amazing disappoint me for me not in the fact the Cs didn't win a title, I am too old to get too worked up over sweaty men throwing a rubber ball through a hoop but in the fact that as a thinking person it wasn't even possible to get away for a while with a sport I grew up playing and love to death. Its a microcosm of the much larger malaise and chicanery. And that's something I can get worked up over and dont mind drawing attention to.

Excellent post.  I agree.  Idealism feels shaky in a world where Enron insiders talk about screwing over grannies in California.....

I also want to say I understand and appreciate the ref supporters.  This is definitely one of those issues that creates fuzzy pictures all around, and I think both sides are needed in order to move forward with legitimacy....

All I know is that after this series I don't see the fans being the #1 priority.  There is definitely some sort of other priority blob that's hovering in our midst, and it's getting plenty of stroke-filled attention....

I believe in this because it just wasn't there before, but now it is.....

[guava_wrench]

I agree they called the game differently in the 4th. I have the feeling the refs were just letting us foul in the first 3 quarters just so ratings would be up. That would be sad if true.

In the end, I don't think we had a chance with Perk out. Lost a major defensive presence and couldn't get any rebounds.

We also didn't have any legs left up front without Perk taking some game minutes.

As Doc said, we started reaching in the 4th quarter when our legs weren't there anymore.

[guava_wrench]

Ive written this elsewhere but I just have to say this. The statistics are just the details but this is the essence of my issue with all this.

I used to watch the NBA religiously growing up and unfortunately didnt get to do so for the past decade on account of moving/living in Sweden. I wasn't even a Celts fan when I left, I was a hardcore Bulls fan from 85 to 00. My pops was the Cs fan so I guess I thought it was cool to route against Bird and the Cs. Decided to switch allegiances since I was already a Pats and Soxs fan a few years into the 00s. I just identified more with being a New Englader after moving away. I needed to mature to appreciate the Celts I guess.

Now that I am back and having watched this I can honestly say with a little bit of objectivity, that this isn't the same league I watched growing up. It has massive problems with its refs and obviously when money is an important issue in tough economic times I really question its integrity from top to bottom. Things happen all over the place that Ive never been witness to.

With everything else that is going down currently in this country with Wall St. and the rich guys working over the little guy I think its probably dangerous to entertain any form of idealism. It is an amazing disappoint me for me not in the fact the Cs didn't win a title, I am too old to get too worked up over sweaty men throwing a rubber ball through a hoop but in the fact that as a thinking person it wasn't even possible to get away for a while with a sport I grew up playing and love to death. Its a microcosm of the much larger malaise and chicanery. And that's something I can get worked up over and dont mind drawing attention to.

Excellent post.  I agree.  Idealism feels shaky in a world where Enron insiders talk about screwing over grannies in California.....

I also want to say I understand and appreciate the ref supporters.  This is definitely one of those issues that creates fuzzy pictures all around, and I think both sides are needed in order to move forward with legitimacy....

All I know is that after this series I don't see the fans being the #1 priority.  There is definitely some sort of other priority blob that's hovering in our midst, and it's getting plenty of stroke-filled attention....

I believe in this because it just wasn't there before, but now it is.....

The difference isn't the product. It is the press and our decreased trust. The press gets ratings by creating controversy where there is none. We have forums like this where even the most bizarre views can have a voice. We have blogs that can spew nonsense with no accountability.

We put all warts under microscopes now, even warts that aren't actually there, in a way people didn't do back in the day.

[guava_wrench]

Basically, refs are good if we have the lead, they are horrible if we lose the lead. They are great if we have good defensive execution, horrible when our defense and offense falls apart.

[jdpapa3]

Basically, refs are good if we have the lead, they are horrible if we lose the lead. They are great if we have good defensive execution, horrible when our defense and offense falls apart.

I complained to high heaven about them in game 2 when we won and the Lakers had a 20 something FT advantage.

[dark_lord]

Basically, refs are good if we have the lead, they are horrible if we lose the lead. They are great if we have good defensive execution, horrible when our defense and offense falls apart.

no, they suck pretty often.  they dont win or lose games and the games arent predetermined.......however, they GREATLY influence games and the results.  lets not forget the whole donoughy scandal......and that his coworkers still work for the league.

[Rondo_is_better]

Basically, refs are good if we have the lead, they are horrible if we lose the lead. They are great if we have good defensive execution, horrible when our defense and offense falls apart.

Blatantly false.

[marshall07]

some calls didnt go our way... but really?  can you step out of your celtic chair and look at our offensive execution?   if you asked Doc, he will tell you we were wicked...  we missed so many shots... ray allen was BAD... paul missed a lot down the stretch...  we didnt do anything in the 4th quarter that indicated we wanted to win the game.  i threw stuff at the tv, and i was more p---ed at my C's over anything else...  i wont give the lakers props..  they just played "less worse" than we did...

[Simulacra]

Basically, refs are good if we have the lead, they are horrible if we lose the lead. They are great if we have good defensive execution, horrible when our defense and offense falls apart.

Nah, some of us can look at a game and compare it to what we have seen before objectively. Since I don't live and die by this sword and expect, naively, for it to be a refuge from dealing with this in my academic and business pursuits for the greater part of the last decade I'm slightly ticked off after what I witnessed.

[Junkyard Dawg]

I'm not gonna try to blame the C's loss on the refs.. but I am gonna say the C's were playing a different game in the finals than they were in the previous rounds.  We were allowed to play hard-nosed, tough, grinding defense and all of a sudden in the finals we were getting fouls called that were total non-calls in previous rounds.

And you know what, the Lakers played pretty [dang]ed hard-nosed and tough defense for most of this series as well, and what was the free-throw disparity for the series?  You're gonna tell me the Lakers just play a cleaner brand of hard-nosed, tough defense?

Having said that and gotten it out of my system, the C's had all the chances in the world to win games this series, including this latest one, and the shots didn't fall, we didn't get the bounces, etc.  Man this is gonna hurt for a while...