Author Topic: Steve Nash deserves a ring  (Read 7505 times)

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Steve Nash deserves a ring
« on: May 30, 2010, 12:26:03 AM »

Offline ToBrien1124

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After watching the PHX vs LA game, you can't help but feel bad for the guy. He has come close so many times yet has never reached the finals. Not to mention only a handful of players have his heart, dedication, and toughness. The guy seems like a total class act as well.

Matter of fact, that whole PHX team is very likable. Gentry, grant hill, our BC guy Jared Dudley. I am so glad we are facing LA where we have that mutual hatred for each other because the Suns, not only would have been a tougher match-up but they deserve it just as much as anybody.

Hats off to a great season to them, and most importantly Steve Nash. Lets hope he gets a ring before Rondo surpasses him as the best PG in the league 8)


Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2010, 01:38:29 AM »

Offline TitleMaster

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Actually, given the state of affairs, I'd prefer Nash to join us at the twilight of his career for that ring.

In this league, it's important to bank as much money as you can get before your stock drops. For Nash, that's this current deal in Phoenix. And no, w/o a defensively oriented team like the C's, Nash won't win a title. Remember Cousy, he lived throughout the 50s w/o a title until Russell joined.


Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2010, 01:48:18 AM »

Offline LB3533

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I thought it was a mistake for Gentry to take Dragic out and it was too late to put back Nash.

Nash should have played with Dragic at about the 5 minute mark or a little before.

Nash could have been the shooting guard cause Nash couldn't seem to miss (8-10, before that last prayer 3PT attempt at the end).

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2010, 09:09:32 AM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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At this point, Nash is probably my favorite non-Celtic.  The guy is just a perfect offensive point guard, and he plays hard, too.

I hope Nash's legacy isn't "the only MVP never to reach the NBA Finals".  He deserves better.

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

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Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2010, 09:31:02 AM »

Offline Drucci

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I feel bad for Nash, especially after seeing this video of him after the game :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnWGXKA0I_Q&feature=player_embedded

He is a great guy and great player whose team always came short, but he always showed up in big games or in money time.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2010, 09:36:54 AM by Drucci »

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2010, 09:35:03 AM »

Offline soap07

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I hope Nash's legacy isn't "the only MVP never to reach the NBA Finals".  He deserves better.

I'm curious. Do you think that Nash is a "career loser" in the same way that you think Vince Carter is?

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2010, 09:41:44 AM »

Offline GranTur

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Nash is a great guy. The Suns are definitely a likeable group of guys.

His offensive ability is extraordinary. Unfortunately, in the playoffs, it's all about defense. Nash is a poor defender and he's always been around other poor defenders.
"It's not how you play the game. It's whether you win or lose--that's my motto." -Larry Bird

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2010, 09:53:52 AM »

Offline ibby

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I'm curious if any team where the superstar pg is clearly the best player has ever won.  Kidd never won it, Stockton never won (though with Malone he was not clearly the best), Billups won (but he was not a superstar), Magic won (but with Kareem and Big Game James he was not clearly the best). I would love to see Nash win it all, but I can't think of an example of a superstar pg who is clearly the best winning it all. Maybe DJ in Seattle?

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2010, 10:09:11 AM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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I hope Nash's legacy isn't "the only MVP never to reach the NBA Finals".  He deserves better.

I'm curious. Do you think that Nash is a "career loser" in the same way that you think Vince Carter is?

Nope.  Nash has actually made his teams better.  He's been the leader on multiple teams that have gotten deep into the playoffs.  The reason he hasn't sustained more success is due to the systems he has played in.  The fact that Nash has enjoyed as much success as he has in an "offense only" system is a testament to him.

Vince, on the other hand, is indeed a career loser, who has never been a leader on a team, period.  The guy puts up empty stats, and doesn't contribute to wins.

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Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2010, 10:14:50 AM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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I'm curious if any team where the superstar pg is clearly the best player has ever won.  Kidd never won it, Stockton never won (though with Malone he was not clearly the best), Billups won (but he was not a superstar), Magic won (but with Kareem and Big Game James he was not clearly the best). I would love to see Nash win it all, but I can't think of an example of a superstar pg who is clearly the best winning it all. Maybe DJ in Seattle?

Magic was clearly the best Laker in 1987, at the very least.

Here's a look at the different positions teams have built around, although it's unfortunately short on specifics:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=5956

All the negativity in this town sucks. It sucks, and it stinks, and it sucks. - Rick Pitino

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Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2010, 10:21:02 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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I'm curious if any team where the superstar pg is clearly the best player has ever won.  Kidd never won it, Stockton never won (though with Malone he was not clearly the best), Billups won (but he was not a superstar), Magic won (but with Kareem and Big Game James he was not clearly the best). I would love to see Nash win it all, but I can't think of an example of a superstar pg who is clearly the best winning it all. Maybe DJ in Seattle?

Magic was clearly the best Laker in 1987, at the very least.

Here's a look at the different positions teams have built around, although it's unfortunately short on specifics:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/blog/?p=5956


You can build around any type of player as long as one of the top pieces is a dominate big man (offensively or defensively)

There are very few exceptions (Jordon)

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2010, 10:28:22 AM »

Offline Fan from VT

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-There are a lot of players that "deserve" a title. Players that were close, but never on teams that won it all. A lot of lesser players won titles by being on very good teams. Stockton, Malone, Barkley, etc. were players who "deserved" titles more than a lot of other players.

-I'd say there is no "formula" for position and success. You basically need a good team. Needs to play defense and offense. The position distribution is secondary.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2010, 10:42:00 AM by Fan from VT »

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #12 on: May 30, 2010, 10:31:17 AM »

Offline Brendan

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I can't get worked up one way or the other about Nash. He's a great player, but one way. I thought his MVPs were... questionable.

As to last nights game, why on earth did they take Dudley off Kobe? Dudley was playing Kobe straight up better than anyone else on the team. And pulling Drago seems like a mistake in retrospect...

Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2010, 10:38:46 AM »

Offline soap07

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He's been the leader on multiple teams that have gotten deep into the playoffs.


Well, we'll ignore the fact that Carter has been out of the first round multiple times. In fact, we can ignore the fact that Nash has been out of the first round exactly one more time than Carter.

I see. Rasheed has had a better career than Vince Carter because Vince has only made a conference final series and Rasheed has a title, which makes Vince a career loser. Steve Nash has gone as deep in the playoffs as Vince Carter has, but Nash is a "winner" because his teams have gotten "deep into the playoffs" - namely, as far as Vince Carter has.



Quote
The reason he hasn't sustained more success is due to the systems he has played in.

A. Yeah, those Nets systems that Vince played in were real winners.
B. The system is set up exactly to tailor to Steve Nash's game. Is your point that Steve Nash's style of play isn't championship caliber?

Quote
The fact that Nash has enjoyed as much success as he has in an "offense only" system is a testament to him.

It's actually not, it's a detriment to Nash. Why is it offense only? Could it be because Nash has been a liability on the defensive end his whole career? Of course Nash makes his team better on the offensive end. But on the defensive end, he makes his team much worse. So, what about that makes him less of a "career loser" than Vince Carter?

Quote
Vince, on the other hand, is indeed a career loser, who has never been a leader on a team, period.  The guy puts up empty stats, and doesn't contribute to wins.

I don't even know what that means. Steve Nash's stats are less empty than Carter's? Carter doesn't contribute to wins? What exactly has Nash led his team to? I think Vince Carter can lead a team to no rings just as well as Nash.

The bias here is ridiculous. It just goes to show how overused and cliche the terms "winner" and "loser" are.


Re: Steve Nash deserves a ring
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2010, 10:40:01 AM »

Offline soap07

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-There are a lot of players that "deserve" a title. Players that were close, but never on teams that won it all. A lot of lesser players won titles by being on very good teams. Stockton, Malone, Barkley, etc.

-I'd say there is no "formula" for position and success. You basically need a good team. Needs to play defense and offense. The position distribution is secondary.

Bingo. The focus on individual rings is way over used.